Larimer (Penn Hills, Wilkinsburg, Liberty: low income, apartments, rental)

[BrianTH]

Originally Posted by stburr91

That's always one of the difficult aspects of redevelopment, and it only gets harder in areas that are unlikely to attract middle and upper middle class.

But as that implicitly points out, one of the crucial variables is expected future potential demand. I personally think a lot of people in Pittsburgh are underestimating the future demand for centrally-located neighborhoods with the potential to be walkable and well-served by public transit. If I am right that people are underestimating such future demand, it means they may be too aggressive in determining that certain existing structures don't have a viable future use.

We're seeing this problem with the redeveloping Hamnett Place in Wilkinsburg. The PHLF can't redevelop all of Hamnett Place, and private investors are highly unlikely to be willing to spend $200,000+ for a home in an area with so much poverty and crime.

Same answer. We are very early in the process in Hamnett Place, and I think people may be surprised at how future demand grows.

Note, by the way, that poverty and crime are not completely independent variables in these models. Poverty and crime ratios will decrease as a neighborhood revitalizes, which in turn can accelerate potential demand growth, which in turn can accelerate reinvestment and revitalization, feeding back into further decreases in poverty and crime ratios, and so on. This is actually the exact opposite of the dynamic that helps to explain how neighborhoods can decline so quickly, and neighborhoods can also improve quickly when that dynamic is reversed.

So poverty and crime can actually make the expected future demand all the more uncertain--under the right conditions, if the initial projections are just a little off, the longer-term projections can be way off.

[PreservationPioneer]

Sorry if I seemed too harsh when I said East Liberty and Larimer could be neighborhoods in Toledo, but it's true. The architecture and the general flat landscape is very similar to neighborhoods in Toledo. And furthermore, I was just expressing my opinion. You could say my neighborhood resembles a neighborhood in Cleveland, and it would be absolutely true (and I can't stand Cleveland).

[PreservationPioneer]

Originally Posted by raubre

I don't know much about the West End. I'm sure there are some cool things out there to do that haven't been discovered. (Heck, I have no idea if they have any big parks out that way or not.)

We have some really cool parks -- West End Park and Sheraden Park, which are both really beautiful. We also have the park adjacent to the West End overlook in Elliott.

[PeterRabbit]

Parks attract drug dealers and the accompanying crime.

[BrianTH]

Originally Posted by alleghenyangel

Sorry if I seemed too harsh when I said East Liberty and Larimer could be neighborhoods in Toledo, but it's true.

As I noted, Toledo has some cool parts, so that is neither here nor there to me. Generally, East Liberty and its satellite neighborhoods are almost like a little city of their own, so comparing them to other small cities makes sense to me.

"blech!", on the other hand, is kinda hard to mistake as a neutral statement.

[BrianTH]

Originally Posted by PeterRabbit

Parks attract drug dealers and the accompanying crime.

And they attract snot-nosed kids. And don't forget the dogs--filthy beasts, they are.

[squarian]

Originally Posted by PeterRabbit

Parks attract drug dealers and the accompanying crime.

Which makes life much easier for the Vigilante Cannibal Posse.

[www21]

I think homewood and wilkinsburgh will be the next east liberty

[I_Like_Spam]

Originally Posted by www21

I think homewood and wilkinsburgh will be the next east liberty

Larimer is a lot smaller piece of real estate with well defined borders and lots of vacant lots, mostly owned by the city.

I think it stands a better chance of a quicker revival than Homewood or Wilkinsburg- both much larger and Wilkinsburg with a crappy school district.

[Hopes]

Originally Posted by alleghenyangel

The stigma of living in a neighborhood perceived as "bad" in Pittsburgh is intense. People will judge you, be afraid to visit you, and ask if they are going to get shot when they do visit.

Although I was never judged, I can attest to friends being afraid to visit. That's how it was when I lived in Manchester. Well, the little problem of guys chasing their cars when they turned the corner to get to my building didn't help me convince them that they were safe. The reality is they were just flexing their muscle, intimindating. They wouldn't dare hurt us. But life became isolating from not having friends daring enough to visit and not being able to make friends within the neighborhood because we were the minorities.