Pittsburgh to Philadelphia Move; Public Transit, Cost of Living, Way of Life Comparisons (Allentown: best cities, real estate)

[Ray_Velcoro]

Originally Posted by PIT2MAD

Philly is also one of the biggest metros in the whole US, so it's not always fair to compare face to face. While there are more opportunities in Philly, there's also more of a chance a "nobody" with a good idea will be heard in Pittsburgh.

Also, I would argue Pittsburgh to Philly is more like the Cleveland/Cincinnati to Columbus or the Charleston to Columbia (SC)...rather than a Buffalo to NYC or Cumberland/Baltimore comparison. Yes we are second tier, but one would be hard pressed to find experiences in Phily that can't be found in Pittsburgh. While MD, NY, and others have a clear disparity between what the "bread and butter" can provide compared to the second tier, PA is one of the states that where I don't feel the same divide. Maybe it's just perspective but I've never felt like I was missing out on much by growing up in Pittsburgh vis-à-vis Philadelphia...it's a little harder to get to NYC/Baltimore/DC but I just feel like I appreciate my visits to those places so much more than I otherwise would.

I would say your argument is pretty spot on. Philly itself is a large city without its metro. Pittsburgh is 300,000 but if you include the rest of the county and surrounding counties it is 2.3 million. Pittsburgh metro is the 23rd largest in the country, but just the city itself doesn't register in the top 50 with population. It's kind of a unique dynamic, much like Cleveland where 2/3 of the county population lives outside of the city limits in the suburbs. I believe buffalo, Detroit and cincinnati are the same way as well.

I've always felt the state puts all of its eggs in the Philly basket. I don't disagree with that either tho.

[Port Pitt Ash]

Originally Posted by Jordanskills134

Chicago on the other hand, has been somewhere I've always been pretty obsessed with, but I am worried it is too much of a jump from Pittsburgh specifically in terms of cost of living; rent, groceries, clothes, public transit, etc.

Originally Posted by Jordanskills134

Pittsburgh is great, and is technically my home city, but I am craving more of a major metropolis. PGH is still a "second class" city, even though it's getting more and more credit as time passes.

Another side comment on reasons, would be progressiveness. Philly should and I would think be more of a progressive city compared to Pittsburgh, but that's just my assumption. A high amount of progressive movements within a city is must for me, personally, should've noted that above. Thanks!

If you're willing to do a Chicago winter what about Minneapolis (half-step up from Pgh as a city and progressive (although St. Paul has better architecture)) or Milwaukee (and just take the train whenever you want to go to Chicago)?

One of my brothers is currently living in Philly and moved from Pittsburgh. He doesn't like it. Basically his reason is it doesn't have as much to do as NYC, but has all the hassles of living in a major city.

Just about everyone I know says they wouldn't want to live there, but it's like pulling teeth to get a reason as to why.

Montreal would be a great option for you if you could figure out how to make it work.

[Blackbeauty212]

Philly Boosters and Pittsburgh Boosters aside.

As someone from the Burgh and has lived (3 1/2 years) and still travels to Philly on the regular ....

Philly COL is higher, but not that much higher than Pittsburgh, especially now that with all that's rising in the Burgh.

SEPTA crushes PAT in terms of coverage and modes, however SEPTA still is NOTHING to write home about. It has significant problems, one is the Frigging Fare system. You think PAT's Fare Structure is Antiquated and Confusing, SEPTA is right up there. They have like 7 Zones, Tons of Paper Instruments, Caveat after Caveat of rules, and they still use Tokens. At least PAT has been on Connect Cards for some time now.

Philly has always come off as a Bigger Pittsburgh in my view, Philly was the first city I moved to when I left the Burgh in my 20's and I experienced No-Culture Shock. NONE. Philly is a Great in-between city if you want bigger than Pittsburgh but do not want NYC levels, and still want more of a Pittsburgh pace. There's virtually No Rat race in Philly, still hints of its Blue Collar past throughout the city, a very Working Class society.

Philly's crime has come down a TON, once the nicknamed "Killadelphia" by Katie Couric. Its really has changed course, still not as safe as the Burgh, Boston, or NYC, but no longer on a Detroit, Baltimore, Chicago level.

Philly's Good/Career jobs are far more sprawled out into its Burbs than in the Burgh .. Philly has the biggest Reverse commute this side of the Mississippi. Most of the Good/Career Jobs located in the city are Eds, Law Firms, and Government ... yea Comcast is Downtown but that not the majority of Tech. KOP, Conshohocken, Wilmington, Horsham, Blue Bell, Trevose, Doylestown, Willow Grove, are the Big Employment "Career" Centers. Lucky most of them can be accessed with Public Transit, something PAT doesn't do well in the Burgh.

Center City Philadelphia is what Downtown Pittsburgh inspires to be one day. However I'll take Pittsburgh's neighborhoods any day of the week over Philly's.

Originally Posted by Ray_Velcoro

Philly will always be the bread and butter for PA. Everybody else is far down on the list. Philly metro could be its own state.

Check your fact... Outside of Montgomery county, not 1 SEPA county (including the city of Philadelphia) sends more taxes to Harrisburg than Allegheny. As a matter of fact most of the tax dollars that SEPA produces gets funneled right back into SEPA. Allegheny County sends far more taxes dollars to Harrisburg than it gets back from Harrisburg. I would guess some of those lost Allegheny County dollars wind up in SEPA. Philly alone is a huge money sucking hole from the rest of the Taxes produced by SEPA.

So one could say that SEPA taxes goes back into SEPA ... Doesn't really make for "Bread n' Butter" situation like you're claiming .... Allegheny taxes goes all over the state, rather than majority back into Allegheny County. I blame that on the Politician than just trying to short change one end of the state vs. the other.

[ForYourLungsOnly]

Originally Posted by Blackbeauty212

Philly's crime has come down a TON, once the nicknamed "Killadelphia" by Katie Couric. Its really has changed course, still not as safe as the Burgh, Boston, or NYC, but no longer on a Detroit, Baltimore, Chicago level.

Chicago's murder rate per 100,000 was 15.1 in 2014. Philly's was 15.9. Pittsburgh's was 22.4

Violent crime is also lower per capita in Chicago, at 884.3, compared to 1,021.4 per 100K in Philly.

[Blackbeauty212]

Originally Posted by ForYourLungsOnly

Chicago's murder rate per 100,000 was 15.1 in 2014. Philly's was 15.9. Pittsburgh's was 22.4

Violent crime is also lower per capita in Chicago, at 884.3, compared to 1,021.4 per 100K in Philly.

Sorry that just some Chicago Booster-ism BS right there, numbers aren't telling the story here .... Chicago is a more Violent City at this point in time ... ... anytime near 100 people get shot in one weekend, COME ON!

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/report-8...end-shootings/

[gg]

Originally Posted by ForYourLungsOnly

Chicago's murder rate per 100,000 was 15.1 in 2014. Philly's was 15.9. Pittsburgh's was 22.4

If you click on this link and then click on Murder twice, it will organize the worst at the top. Pittsburgh is pretty horrible when it comes to crime.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...ime_rate_(2014)

[RogersParkTransplant]

Originally Posted by Blackbeauty212

Sorry that just some Chicago Booster-ism BS right there, numbers aren't telling the story here .... Chicago is a more Violent City at this point in time ... ... anytime near 100 people get shot in one weekend, COME ON!

The very sad thing is that the crime in Chicago is concentrated in some specific neighborhoods. You can't talk about violent crime in Chicago as a single statistic; it really depends on the area. This is absolutely tragic, because it's young African-American men who are dying at a disproportionate rate, in areas that don't have enough hospitals, or enough resources of any kind for that matter. Of course the point about black men under the age of 30 could be made in many urban environments, but it's particularly intense/awful in Chicago.

Pittsburgh isn't nearly as large, and it's also more of a circle (as opposed to a long city strung out along the coastline of Lake Michigan) and so the neighborhoods are closely interrelated; crime is more likely to spill over from one place to another in Pittsburgh. Chicago's geography allows certain areas to completely ignore the problems that are present in other areas, which is also a crime though in a different sense of the word.

[kyb01]

Originally Posted by Jordanskills134

It's funny, I was actually thinking the same thing regarding the negativity. Really appreciate the great comment! Do you have any specific recommendations for relatively affordable neighborhoods that are near the two local city lines? Or anything perhaps around a transit center? I'm assuming you live in Philly now? Are the Market-Frankford and Broad Street lines the only actual subway lines for the city that aren't regional commuter?

Yes and no. The BSL is mostly all a subway. The MFL is partially an elevated line( it's underground downtown). The subway/surface(green line)trolleys run underground in parts of downtown.

Additionally the PATCO line, which travel to/from New Jersey, is subway in downtown Philly.

[RightonWalnut]

Wow. There is a lot of hate on here for Philadelphia. Seems to be a little uninformed and misguided.

[RogersParkTransplant]

Originally Posted by RightonWalnut

Wow. There is a lot of hate on here for Philadelphia. Seems to be a little uninformed and misguided.

Well, asking about Philly on a Pittsburgh forum is a little like asking about NYC in Boston. People aren't ever really objective about their home or its rivals.