Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
And becoming a better deal, with government punishing companies for hiring more and more employees.
Look at the healthcare bill for examples.. Companies of X size, pay $x a year per employee. Thats a lot of incentive to keep your business under the size before you start paying fines..
I have heard too many small businessmen who make over $250,000 and will be taxed to hell and back for being so rich say that they want to expand their businesses but they just don't know what will happen to them as far as taxes are concerned.
Hey, wait till some of the middle class people who work for small or large businesses see what happens to them from the Obamacare law in the way of income taxes. They may well rise up and rebel openly.
Is there anyone who does not believe this? Seriously?
How many jobs have you recieved from a poor man? Are buisnesses owned by the rich or the poor?
The more money I have beyond our monthly living expenses, the more I invest in our buisness (ag in Brazil and the US). I am a physician but our "buisness" is agriculture.
When the Obama tax increases go into effect, will I continue to invest more in our buisness? No. I will let it ride with no plans for expansion but only maintaining payment for expenses.
Next big step in setting American's free of Govenmentism is a better equal tax system.
And what do you think they do with their money? Its called capital preservation, if you give them an incentive to spend, rather than save, then yes.. it results in JOBS.. If you dont understand this, then I'm assuming you work for a poor man..
the bolded part is an oxymoron. poor people dont start businesses
Quote:
Originally Posted by tablemtn
Taxes were actually far higher back during other periods of economic expansion, like the 1950's.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Driller1
But, there were very few rules to follow.
Just the environmental rules make a huge difference.
yes taxes were much higher in the 50's, and there were far fewer regulations, BUT the tax rate in the 50's was LOWER than in the 30's and through the mid 40's. when the war was over truman got taxes lowered, and the combination of lower taxes, a pent up demand for new products, the fact that household debt was virtually eliminated since 1929, and the fact that we were going to be THE economic powerhouse for at least 3 decades to come, meant that taxes kind of didnt matter at that point, add to that the fact that we didnt have a large number of people that made the really big money back then either.
Quote:
Originally Posted by pghquest
I also became self employed around the same period.. My risk, and not being punished for reward has now only allowed me to grow my businesses yearly, but has become an economic stimulus to a whole city who benefited from the arena football team I was able to purchase, and able to hire programmers, buy a 2nd home, and gainfully employ a few dozen individuals.
Would I have been able to do this without the Bush tax cuts... possibly, but it would have been a lot harder and the economic effects no where near what they were with the cuts..
another success story. good work
Quote:
Originally Posted by StillwaterTownie
I wonder if the wealthy who control companies, instead of creating jobs in this country would rather send more jobs overseas or to Mexico or buy the lastest in technology that can replace a bunch of workers? If this is common, little wonder the unemployment rate is dropping so slow.
the wealthy in this country would rather have american workers, or american technology on the job. the problem is the regulations that governments has put in place on a variety of issues, coupled with union rules in many states, and high taxes, and the not knowing what new regulations are coming down the pike, means that businesses are going to ship jobs overseas where the business environment is friendlier to business, if they can. the european and japanese automakers have moved some of their manufacturing here for one reason, the weakness of the american dollar. it is cheaper to build here and ship the cars overseas right now than to build the cars in their own country and ship them out. it is also because of lower tariffs from the US to other countries in many instances.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ozzie679
Job growth will only occur with at strong middle class that has the disposable income to purchase products.
yep, but to do that you need to keep taxes on the wealthy fairly low otherwise they tale their money and go home.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oerdin
Exactly, loads of tax breaks for the rich but few new jobs and then a huge economic crisis because unregulated moneyed interests crashed the world economy.
really? during the clinton years the lowest unemployment rate was just under 6%. during the bush years the lowest unemployment rate was just under 5%. the economic crisis was not caused by those with money, it was caused by those without money who could not pay back what they owed when oil prices spiked in 2008. same reason the economy tanked in 1929, too much easy credit, and too many people who couldnt pay back what they owed when something triggered a collapse. try reading and understanding history once.
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrJoey
Why do people always lump personal income tax with business when the two are not the same. I have a lot of friends who are entrepreneurs and personally consult for a lot of start-ups and none of them are salaried anywhere near 250k. To add to that, there are an enormous amount of deductions that most small business owners who are smart can claim, none of which seem to be getting eradicated.
yes there are a number of deductions that a business can take when filing their taxes, but it just isnt about tax returns, it is ALL the taxes a business has to pay. remember that each month a business has to do inventory. why? because the states hit them with a monthly property tax. and then there are the payroll taxes, sales taxes, etc. not all payroll taxes are taken from an employees pay check. the business has to pay matching soc sec taxes, unemployment taxes, among others.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MiamiRob
If tax cuts to the rich worked we wouldn't have entered a recession in December of 2007. Obviously the Bush mutiple tax cuts to the wealthiest couldn't avert the coming disaster.
tax cuts DID WORK. again the economic crisis was not because of low taxes, it was because of high debt loads, and spiking oil prices. the housing bubble collapsed, which would have been ok if nothing else bad happened, but when oil prices spiked like they did, people could not afford to pay their mortgages, fill their tanks, and put food on the table. so they made a choice, they quit making mortgage payments so they could still afford to go to work and put food on the table. the problem is that because of this the credit markets dried up, and businesses then had to struggle to make payrolls, and make their loan payments, so they had to lay people off to cut expenses.
do you see how this works?
now the government is piling on the regulations, new health care crap, new financial sector crap, and businesses are also looking at new taxes next year, and looking at the bush tax cuts expiring next year, and they dont know what is going to happen, so they are hoarding their money to carry them through the worst part of this crisis.
and if you think it is past the worst part, let me tell you that it isnt over yet. the commercial real estate market is very soft right now, and the owners of commercial building are having a hard time paying for their loans because commercial buildings are sitting empty, and the government is STILL pushing sub prime loans through fannie and freddy, and now the FHA as well. this is the things that businesses are seeing, along with the stock market being manipulated to make it look like it is recovering, poor performing stocks being removed from the dow industrial and being replaced with better performing ones. and you will see what are known as bear market rallies, it happens every time we have an economic downturn. what happens is the rich will put off filing their taxes as long as possible. so they file for a 90 day extension on april 15th. then they go to work in the markets to raise the strength of their portfolios. then around the early part of july, they either file another extension, or they sell off stocks and bonds to pay their taxes. if they file another extension then the same thing happens in october, you will see a sell off of stocks and bonds to raise money for taxes.
then they prop up their portfolios again until april 15th the next year.
When Bush put in the "tax cuts for the rich " I was waitressing , I made about , reported about 45 grand. I saved 3,000 that year. I got interested in what businesses paid more or less tax . I started my own .
Its a long story short but its true..
Should be very proud of yourself for capitalizing! Good American.
Lol, too funny. That link pretty much makes the case that tax cuts work. After Reagan's tax cut, the economy grew at an unprecedented 7.3% within 1 quarter according to the chart. When taxes were cut again in the mid-80s GDP growth went up yet again. Following a small tax increase in the early 90s growth actually slowed. Same for the unemployment chart at that link. Following the tax cuts the unemployment rate drops by a huge margin in 1983.
Try again.
Also, I would be one to argue that manipulation of the tax code follows the law of diminishing returns. Reagan's tax cuts worked because the cuts were so large in the early 80s. Cutting them in the late 80s did not work as well because the rates did not fall nearly as much. When taxes went up in 1993 it stymied growth, but only for about two years before people became accustomed to the new rates, and it was no longer an issue.
Between 1950 and 1960 when the top rate was in the 90% range, we had 3 recessions in that one period alone. Between 1969 and 1982 while rates were in the 70% range, there were 4 recessions. Since Reagan's tax cuts instead of having several successive recessions we have had one recession roughly every 10 years - 1990-1991, 2000-2001, and 2008-2009.
Who the hell hires people to work for their company, the poor?
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
