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Old 09-01-2010, 12:13 PM
 
Location: Littleton, CO
20,892 posts, read 16,108,286 times
Reputation: 3954

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Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
I've supplied NUMEROUS links to support what I've posted. None of it is made up.
Links to made up stuff is still just made up stuff.
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Old 09-01-2010, 12:22 PM
 
Location: the very edge of the continent
89,323 posts, read 45,051,012 times
Reputation: 13792
Quote:
Originally Posted by HistorianDude View Post
Links to made up stuff is still just made up stuff.
The Congressional Record, Cornell University, and the Yale Review (just a few examples) are made up?

But please continue... you're absolutely destroying your credibility.
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Old 09-01-2010, 12:41 PM
 
Location: Littleton, CO
20,892 posts, read 16,108,286 times
Reputation: 3954
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
The Congressional Record, Cornell University, and the Yale Review (just a few examples) are made up?
And none of them get you around your fundamental problem. That problem is that the Unoted States Supreme Court has defined natural born citizen, and it is not the definition that you are trying to foist off.

1. The sources generally do not actually back up your assertions. For example, you assert that none of Bingham's contemporaries contradicted hima and that this is supported by the Congressional Record. But in point of fact, many of his contemporaries did contradict him, and did so in that record.

Learning moment: A source does not support you if it either does not say what you claim it says, or if it actually contradicts you.

2. The sources are often deliberately misrepresented by you. For example, you repeatedly had to back pedal from your description of the Bingham quotation and the significance of his comment since he was not the author of the clause and not even talking about the 14th Amendment at all. Now... the mistakes you made there were not originally your own, but they were copied and pasted from Birther web sites. This is the habit that causes Birthers to replicate the same errors and lies over and over ad nauseam.

Learning moment: Do your own research instead of relying on copying and pasting sources you really don't have a good reason to trust.

3. You generally cherry pick your sources in the effort to misrepresent their actual positions and context. For example, you have repeated run screaming from the fact that Wong Kim Ark explicitly defines natural born citizen, instead trying to deflect attention to single sentence of the final ruling. This is not merely dishonest, it is pathetic.

Learning moment: Misdirection never works when your debate opponent knows the sources better than you do. You will always be caught with your pants down.

4. You often apply inappropriate sources to different arguments. This is because you yourself do not even really understand your own arguments and get them hopelessly confused. The most recent example is your complete garbling of the "Vattel definition" argument with the completely different "no dual citizenship" argument.

Learning moment: Sort out your ideas and make sense of them before committing them to cyberspace. If you are confused, it will always show.

Fundamentally though, I am not the slightest bit concerned about my credibility. It is well enough established that you keep coming back for more.

So yes... links to sources are still links to made up stuff if the sources do not say what you need them to say.

And that is your biggest problem.
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Old 09-01-2010, 12:46 PM
 
Location: Redondo Beach, CA
7,835 posts, read 8,455,351 times
Reputation: 8564
Quote:
Originally Posted by HistorianDude View Post

And none of them get you around your fundamental problem. That problem is that the Unoted States Supreme Court has defined natural born citizen, and it is not the definition that you are trying to foist off.

1. The sources generally do not actually back up your assertions. For example, you assert that none of Bingham's contemporaries contradicted hima and that this is supported by the Congressional Record. But in point of fact, many of his contemporaries did contradict him, and did so in that record.

Learning moment: A source does not support you if it either does not say what you claim it says, or if it actually contradicts you.

2. The sources are often deliberately misrepresented by you. For example, you repeatedly had to back pedal from your description of the Bingham quotation and the significance of his comment since he was not the author of the clause and not even talking about the 14th Amendment at all. Now... the mistakes you made there were not originally your own, but they were copied and pasted from Birther web sites. This is the habit that causes Birthers to replicate the same errors and lies over and over ad nauseam.

Learning moment: Do your own research instead of relying on copying and pasting sources you really don't have a good reason to trust.

3. You generally cherry pick your sources in the effort to misrepresent their actual positions and context. For example, you have repeated run screaming from the fact that Wong Kim Ark explicitly defines natural born citizen, instead trying to deflect attention to single sentence of the final ruling. This is not merely dishonest, it is pathetic.

Learning moment: Misdirection never works when your debate opponent knows the sources better than you do. You will always be caught with your pants down.

4. You often apply inappropriate sources to different arguments. This is because you yourself do not even really understand your own arguments and get them hopelessly confused. The most recent example is your complete garbling of the "Vattel definition" argument with the completely different "no dual citizenship" argument.

Learning moment: Sort out your ideas and make sense of them before committing them to cyberspace. If you are confused, it will always show.

Fundamentally though, I am not the slightest bit concerned about my credibility. It is well enough established that you keep coming back for more.

So yes... links to sources are still links to made up stuff if the sources do not say what you need them to say.

And that is your biggest problem.
I can't rep you again right now, but at a minimum, this post deserves this:

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Old 09-01-2010, 12:53 PM
 
Location: On Top
12,373 posts, read 13,215,775 times
Reputation: 4027
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jill61 View Post
I can't rep you again right now, but at a minimum, this post deserves this:
I can't rep him right now either....BUT!

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Old 09-01-2010, 01:15 PM
 
26,581 posts, read 14,496,074 times
Reputation: 7449
what meson said.
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Old 09-01-2010, 01:42 PM
 
Location: Redondo Beach, CA
7,835 posts, read 8,455,351 times
Reputation: 8564
Quote:
Originally Posted by meson View Post

I can't rep him right now either....BUT!

I can't rep you right now, either, but wanted to say your graphic is way better than mine! Now that's applause!
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Old 09-01-2010, 01:53 PM
 
Location: On Top
12,373 posts, read 13,215,775 times
Reputation: 4027
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jill61 View Post
I can't rep you right now, either, but wanted to say your graphic is way better than mine! Now that's applause!
Save it on your computer and upload it to your own photo hosting website.
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Old 09-01-2010, 01:54 PM
 
26,581 posts, read 14,496,074 times
Reputation: 7449
what i'm curious about from the people that still believe in the obama ineligibility theories is which one(s)..... and why ??? :

A): COLB: not an acceptable document.
B): COLB: a falsified statement document.
C): COLB: a forged document.
D): mother too young to pass on citizenship.
E): mother too young to pass on citizenship for foreign birth.
F): loses US citizenship
G): adopted by lolo and loses US citizenship.
H): mother marries and loses US citizenship
I): relinquishes US citizenship.
J): becomes dual citizen: US UK
K): becomes dual citizen: US kenya
L): becomes dual citizen: US indonesia
M): CIA agent
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Old 09-01-2010, 03:39 PM
 
Location: Littleton, CO
20,892 posts, read 16,108,286 times
Reputation: 3954
Quote:
Originally Posted by wrecking ball View Post
what i'm curious about from the people that still believe in the obama ineligibility theories is which one(s)..... and why ??? :

A): COLB: not an acceptable document.
B): COLB: a falsified statement document.
C): COLB: a forged document.
D): mother too young to pass on citizenship.
E): mother too young to pass on citizenship for foreign birth.
F): loses US citizenship
G): adopted by lolo and loses US citizenship.
H): mother marries and loses US citizenship
I): relinquishes US citizenship.
J): becomes dual citizen: US UK
K): becomes dual citizen: US kenya
L): becomes dual citizen: US indonesia
M): CIA agent
You left out:

N) Didn't meet the "Vattel Definition"
O) Born in Kenya
P) Born in Canada
Q) Traveled to Pakistan on Indonesian passport and loses US citizenship
R) Registered at Occidental as an Indonesian and loses US citizenship
S) Got a Connecticut SSN and that does something weird to his citizenship
T) Dodged the draft making him ineligible for Federal employment
U) Is a commie/bastard/Muslim/traitor/drug-using/murderous closet gay guy.
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