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Old 09-17-2010, 09:04 AM
 
Location: Redondo Beach, CA
7,835 posts, read 8,440,877 times
Reputation: 8564

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Quote:
Originally Posted by oz in SC View Post

You seem to be proving my point about envy driving how some people think...

They have more so should pay more(% wise).

Why exactly should someone making more than you pay a higher % of their pay in taxes?
I'll let Teddy Roosevelt explain it to you.

New Nationialism - August, 1910
"I do not speak of this struggle of the past merely from the historic standpoint. . . Of that generation of men to whom we owe so much, the man to whom we owe most is, of course, Lincoln. Part of our debt to him is because he forecast our present struggle and saw the way out. He said:

"I hold that while man exists it is his duty to improve not only his own condition, but to assist in ameliorating mankind."

And again:

"Labor is prior to, and independent of, capital. Capital is only the fruit of labor, and could never have existed if labor had not first existed. Labor is the superior of capital, and deserves much the higher consideration."

. . .

"We grudge no man a fortune which represents his own power and sagacity, when exercised with entire regard to the welfare of his fellows. . . We grudge no man a fortune in civil life if it is honorably obtained and well used. It is not even enough that it should have gained without doing damage to the community. We should permit it to be gained only so long as the gaining represents benefit to the community. This, I know, implies a policy of a far more active governmental interference with social and economic conditions in this country than we have yet had, but I think we have got to face the fact that such an increase in governmental control is now necessary.

"No man should receive a dollar unless that dollar has been fairly earned. Every dollar received should represent a dollar's worth of service rendered - not gambling in stocks, but service rendered. The really big fortune, the swollen fortune, by the mere fact of its size acquires qualities which differentiate it in kind as well as in degree from what is possessed by men of relatively small means. Therefore, I believe in a graduated income tax on big fortunes, and in another tax which is far more easily collected and far more effective - a graduated inheritance tax on big fortunes, properly safeguarded against evasion and increasing rapidly in amount with the size of the estate."
It's a very long speech, but I trust you'll take the time to read it in its entirety, right?
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Old 09-17-2010, 09:06 AM
 
Location: Wisconsin
37,972 posts, read 22,157,422 times
Reputation: 13803
Quote:
Originally Posted by AnUnidentifiedMale View Post
Republicans could at least try to pretend they don't favor wealthier Americans, but sometimes the truth slips out...

Mitch McConnell Cries Over The Plight Of Those Hardest Hit By Recession: Those Making $250K | Crooks and Liars
Well then, tell me why so many people are out of work. Is it because they were hit hard by the economic decline, and were forced to quit their job? Or do you think the small business employer was hit hard, and had to lay people off, close the doors to his business, or divest himself of some of his assets in order to stay in business?

I seriously doubt McConnell was discussing the merits of who was hit hardest on an emotional level. He was discussing which part of our economy was hit the hardest, which part was impacted to have caused the spike in unemployment, and what is causing our economy to slow, and its clear that it was the private sector business community.

Both political parties were unanimous in extending unemployment to the people out of work. The sad truth is that compassion does not create jobs, giving someone unemployment does not create jobs, nor does it reduce unemployment. The only cure to being unemployed is to be employed, and no amount of "I feel your pain" is going to help.
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Old 09-17-2010, 09:09 AM
 
Location: Wisconsin
37,972 posts, read 22,157,422 times
Reputation: 13803
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jill61 View Post
Wah Wah Wah My heart just breaks for those poor wealthy people. Wait. Isn't that an oxymoron? Well, it's some kind of moron, anyway.
...and the bitter bile of bigotry and class warfare rears its ugly head.
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Old 09-17-2010, 09:10 AM
 
4,006 posts, read 6,040,241 times
Reputation: 3897
Quote:
Originally Posted by GregW View Post
Once you have enough money that you could not survive eating, screwing or drinking it away why would you want more?

I am mostly annoyed by the fact that most of the wealthy are making their money without having to put in their god given 40 hour work weeks. The wealthy are the other welfare class in this economy and cost far more than the poor.

Other than a few athletes, entertainers and trust fund babies (which there are not many of any of these 3), most 'wealthy' or 'rich' people earned it by busting their balls, making smart decisions, and realizing that in the land of opportunity, the possibilitie for personal success are not limited by the government.
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Old 09-17-2010, 09:13 AM
 
Location: North Cackelacky....in the hills.
19,567 posts, read 21,873,039 times
Reputation: 2519
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jill61 View Post
I'll let Teddy Roosevelt explain it to you.

New Nationialism - August, 1910
"I do not speak of this struggle of the past merely from the historic standpoint. . . Of that generation of men to whom we owe so much, the man to whom we owe most is, of course, Lincoln. Part of our debt to him is because he forecast our present struggle and saw the way out. He said:

"I hold that while man exists it is his duty to improve not only his own condition, but to assist in ameliorating mankind."

And again:

"Labor is prior to, and independent of, capital. Capital is only the fruit of labor, and could never have existed if labor had not first existed. Labor is the superior of capital, and deserves much the higher consideration."

. . .

"We grudge no man a fortune which represents his own power and sagacity, when exercised with entire regard to the welfare of his fellows. . . We grudge no man a fortune in civil life if it is honorably obtained and well used. It is not even enough that it should have gained without doing damage to the community. We should permit it to be gained only so long as the gaining represents benefit to the community. This, I know, implies a policy of a far more active governmental interference with social and economic conditions in this country than we have yet had, but I think we have got to face the fact that such an increase in governmental control is now necessary.

"No man should receive a dollar unless that dollar has been fairly earned. Every dollar received should represent a dollar's worth of service rendered - not gambling in stocks, but service rendered. The really big fortune, the swollen fortune, by the mere fact of its size acquires qualities which differentiate it in kind as well as in degree from what is possessed by men of relatively small means. Therefore, I believe in a graduated income tax on big fortunes, and in another tax which is far more easily collected and far more effective - a graduated inheritance tax on big fortunes, properly safeguarded against evasion and increasing rapidly in amount with the size of the estate."
It's a very long speech, but I trust you'll take the time to read it in its entirety, right?
Psst,there was no income tax in 1910....

Could you explain why someone who makes more than you should buy your drinks at the bar?
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Old 09-17-2010, 09:14 AM
 
Location: North Cackelacky....in the hills.
19,567 posts, read 21,873,039 times
Reputation: 2519
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wapasha View Post
...and the bitter bile of bigotry and class warfare rears its ugly head.
Yup...envy is a strong emotion among some.
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Old 09-17-2010, 09:21 AM
 
Location: Redondo Beach, CA
7,835 posts, read 8,440,877 times
Reputation: 8564
Quote:
Originally Posted by oz in SC View Post

Psst,there was no income tax in 1910....

Could you explain why someone who makes more than you should buy your drinks at the bar?
I see my trust was misplaced. I won't be making that same mistake again.
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Old 09-17-2010, 09:22 AM
 
Location: Wisconsin
37,972 posts, read 22,157,422 times
Reputation: 13803
Quote:
Originally Posted by MsMcQ LV View Post
Raised my family of five on just a bit over that 30k. Maybe we didn't have 'the best' of everything, but we had what we needed. That's the problem I see more and more - no one seems to want anything less than the best, whether they can afford it or actually need it or not.
Agreed, i take umbrage to that also. I was raised with four siblings, and my mother earned an equivalent of under $30,000. a person should not make a hasty declaration concerning the means in which other people live their lives.
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Old 09-17-2010, 09:23 AM
 
Location: North Cackelacky....in the hills.
19,567 posts, read 21,873,039 times
Reputation: 2519
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jill61 View Post
I see my trust was misplaced. I won't be making that same mistake again.
Of course you won't reply to my question....

Because the answer would be embarrassing.

So to all the other supporters of having someone else pay for you....

Explain why the guy who makes more than you should buy your drinks at the bar?
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Old 09-17-2010, 09:29 AM
 
Location: Redondo Beach, CA
7,835 posts, read 8,440,877 times
Reputation: 8564
Oh for crying out loud, it was a stupid and irrelevant question.

The well-being of a nation /= sidling up to a bar with buddies.
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