Is it appropriate to compare the gay rights movement to the black civil rights movement? (boycott, March)

[jimboburnsy]

Originally Posted by Jaymax

Hi Freedom,

In Loving v Virginia:

The court ruled that Virginia's anti-miscegenation statute violated both the Due Process Clause and the Equal Protection Clause of the Fourteenth Amendment. In its decision, the court wrote:

"Marriage is one of the "basic civil rights of man," fundamental to our very existence and survival.... To deny this fundamental freedom on so unsupportable a basis as the racial classifications embodied in these statutes, classifications so directly subversive of the principle of equality at the heart of the Fourteenth Amendment, is surely to deprive all the State's citizens of liberty without due process of law. The Fourteenth Amendment requires that the freedom of choice to marry not be restricted by invidious racial discrimination. Under our Constitution, the freedom to marry, or not marry, a person of another race resides with the individual and cannot be infringed by the State."


Since 1888, the U.S. Supreme Court has 14 times reiterated that marriage is a basic civil right.

I don't think that he court's opinion in this case is as germane to the topic as some others seem to. The underlying assumption here is that a man and a woman marry. The equal protection clause may apply, but it will depend heavily on how "marriage" is defined.

[elamigo]

Originally Posted by sautille42

Comparisons between the contemporary gay rights movement and the American Civil Rights Movement seem to come up quite a lot in public discourse about gay rights. Is this comparison appropriate? Why or why not?

This subject came up on another thread and took on a life of its own, so I thought I should give it its own space - especially as we are currently celebrating MLK day.

What say you?

They are comparable in the sense that both issue involve civil rights. The degree of violation of rights may be different but it still involved civil rights. Sadly there have been groups or people in a group fighting for their rights do not care much fo the rights of others. The Founding Fathers fought for many rights and yet denied rights to blacks and women, take care.

[Tin Knocker]

Originally Posted by thriftylefty

We allow people with mental disorders to marry and we don't care about the children of those unions.

What are you talking about? Gay people cant even have kids anyway.

The question was & is, is it right to compare the gay rights movement to the black peoples civil rights movement. The clear answer is no.

If your crying about gay marriage its still not fair to compare because black people could always get married. Know why? Because theres black men & black women, they can have kids & raise a family just like any other normal people.

Dont you people realize that if you need to grasp at straws to prove a point its usually because you are way off track?

[thriftylefty]

Originally Posted by Tin Knocker

What are you talking about? Gay people cant even have kids anyway.

?

I know a Lesbian or two who have popped out a few crumb snatchers

[ovcatto]

I will never understand the small minded pettiness of African Americans who get upset when any movement appropriates some aspect of the Civil Rights Movement when attempting to gain their rights against discrimination and exclusion. Frankly I think that it is the highest form of recognition that the Civil Rights Movement is the model for achieving social justice.

[robwill]

Civil Rights are Civil Rights period.

[Badger]

Originally Posted by Yeledaf

Except for the fact that gays were never enslaved, lynched, beaten by cops throughout the nation, denied access to education and the vote, forced to use seperate restaurant, transportation, and restroom faciities, and do not currently suffer from economic hardship and imprisonment at many times the rate of non-gays, and are in fact among the most wealthy and well-educated of our citizenry, the comparison with, and need for, a reprise of black civil rights activism is dead on.

However, given the current infantile feeblemindedness and ignorance which characterizes the majority of Americans, spoon-fed as they are by a manipulative and mendacious mainstream media, the odious and palpably false analogy of the OP continues to gain credence and will probably end with a Matthew Shepard Day holiday. On the Fifth of July, perhaps.

Free at last. Free at last. Thank Brokeback Mountain, I'm Free at last.

What an insult to African-Americans. In some ways, it is perhaps the ultimate trivialization of their tragic past and troubled present, as they struggle with REAL poverty and injustice.

could've closed the thread after the 3rd post.

It's an ummitigated slap in the face to every black person in this country to suggest they are even remotely comparable.

Gays have suffered and faced discrimination but it's absolutely nothing in comparison to what blacks have had to endure for generations. And the level of hatred and vitriol that blacks have endured is simply uncomparable to what gays have suffered.

[thriftylefty]

The OP asked “are the Movements comparable?” Not the level or intensity of discrimination
1. They both involve a minority group
2. They both have opposition from relatively the same group
3. Like gays many blacks hid their true identities because of the Civil Rights issues
4. They both are using the legal system to achieve its goals.
5. They both first found a measure of institutional equality in the Military

[Badger]

Originally Posted by thriftylefty

The OP asked “are the Movements comparable?” Not the level or intensity of discrimination

comparable ? yes

you can compare anything. but there are degrees of everything.

remotely similar? heck NO and a slap in the face to every black person in this country.

if you want to compare what blacks in this country went through to what blacks in South Africa went through , well that'd be more accurate and comparable.

It's not that complicated after the comparison.

[jimboburnsy]

Originally Posted by thriftylefty

The OP asked “are the Movements comparable?” Not the level or intensity of discrimination
1. They both involve a minority group
2. They both have opposition from relatively the same group
3. Like gays many blacks hid their true identities because of the Civil Rights issues
4. They both are using the legal system to achieve its goals.
5. They both first found a measure of institutional equality in the Military

They can be bulleted and cross-referenced as evidenced above, but the question was whether or not it is appropriate to do so. There are similarities but there are also, in my opinion, very significant divergences.