Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
What happened to 'personal responsibility'? You know, if these people need more money to pay higher bills, they should get a better job!
Isn't that the republican's current mantra? Personal Responsibility?
BTW, global warming does NOT mean, as you so cutely put it, "it warms up all over.."
I guess coal companies are just going to have to either abide by the regulations or re-make themselves, kind of like the people who lit the gas lanterns; they lost their jobs to electricity and had to do something new.
If we have so much coal, let's export it to a country that will use it.
We do. How the heck do you think China and India keep their manufacturing costs lower? Cheap coal fired electric power plants is how.
If you think corporations are bad, just wait 'till you see how badly a nationalized energy company pollutes.
No one ever said anything about nationalizing electric utilities.
Nebraska has a great solution of putting them under the control of voters in separate districts. You can also expand them to statewide like how Canadian power utilities are provincial crown corporations.
No one ever said anything about nationalizing electric utilities.
Nebraska has a great solution of putting them under the control of voters in separate districts. You can also expand them to statewide like how Canadian power utilities are provincial crown corporations.
Maxine Waters has stated the US should nationalize oil companies. There is no reason to believe any energy sector should be safe from such Progressive thinking.
IMO, the federal government is lousy at managing electic utilities (see Tennessee Valley Authority). The poor management of water levels at hydroelectric dams contributed to the exacerbation of flooding from Montana to Missouri this Spring/Summer 2011 along the Missouri River.
If people want true electric energy security they should seek to produce their own on their own property, for their own use, IMO.
Maxine Waters has stated the US should nationalize oil companies. There is no reason to believe any energy sector should be safe from such Progressive thinking.
This thread is about electric utilities, not oil companies.... although I do agree that the oil industry should be nationalized as such a highly essential commodity is dangerous to the national economy when it is subject to wild swings in the market. The federal government should seize oil, set a price for it, and act as a wholesale distributor to private companies who can refine it how they see it and sell it in their brand of stores.
Quote:
IMO, the federal government is lousy at managing electic utilities (see Tennessee Valley Authority). The poor management of water levels at hydroelectric dams contributed to the exacerbation of flooding from Montana to Missouri this Spring/Summer 2011 along the Missouri River.
This is extremely incorrect considering it isn't the federal government's fault that the Missouri River basin has seen an exceptional increase in water input this year versus past years. The sheer amount of water volume coming into that system was ridiculous.
The TVA has had its ups and downs. But with that said, once again, I am arguing for states and local regions to handle power utilities... not private for-profit companies, and not the federal government.
Quote:
If people want true electric energy security they should seek to produce their own on their own property, for their own use, IMO.
Totally agree with this, actually. People should be encouraged to set up solar panels and wind generators on their properties in order to produce sufficient energy for their homes or larger appliances.
Apart from conspiracy theory type motives, has any one of the whiners actually asked why the regulations are being introduced and whether there are any benefits to cutting airborne pollution?
Quote:
EMISSION REDUCTIONS RESULTING FROM COMPLIANCE WITH THE
PROPOSED STANDARDS
The proposed rule establishes emission standards for mercury, acid gases (hydrochloric acid, or
HCl, as a surrogate), and non-mercury metallic toxic pollutants (total particulate matter (PM) as
a surrogate with alternative surrogate of total metal air toxics), and each year would:
o Prevent 91 percent of the mercury in coal burned in power plants from being emitted to
the air;
o Reduce acid gas emissions from power plans by 91 percent; and
o Reduce sulfur dioxide (SO2) emissions from power plants by 55 percent.
HEALTH BENEFITS OF THE PROPOSED STANDARDS
• By updating safeguards under the Clean Air Act to reduce mercury, acid gases, and other
life-threatening pollution in our air, EPA is acting to protect our health and our families from
the illnesses—and premature deaths—linked to these pollutants.
• Uncontrolled releases of toxic air pollutants like mercury from power plants damage
children’s developing brains, reducing their IQ and their ability to learn.
• They cause a range of dangerous health problems in adults as well, including cancer, heart
disease and premature death. Mercury and many of the other air toxics also pollute our
nation’s lakes, streams, and rivers. Fish advisories have been issued across the US as a result
of mercury contamination.
• The proposed standards will have direct benefits to neighborhoods near power plants as well
as neighborhoods hundreds of miles away from the nearest power plant.
• Each year the standards will prevent serious illnesses and health problems for thousands of
Americans, including: up to 17,000 premature deaths, 11,000 heart attacks, 120,000 asthma
attacks, 12,200 hospital and emergency room visits, 4,500 cases of chronic bronchitis, and
5.1 million restricted activity days.
• The value of the air quality improvements totals $59 billion to $140 billion each year. That
means that for every dollar spent to reduce this pollution, Americans get $5-13 in health
benefits.
• The benefits are widely distributed and are especially important to minority and low income
populations who are disproportionately impacted by asthma and other debilitating health
conditions.
INVESTMENTS THAT KEEP PEOPLE WORKING AND CREATE JOBS
• Each year, 850,000 missed work or “sick” days will be avoided, enhancing productivity,
lowering health care costs for American families.
• Money spent on pollution control at power plants creates high-quality American jobs in
manufacturing steel, cement and other materials needed to build pollution control equipment,
in creating and assembling pollution control equipment, in installing the equipment at power
plants, and operating and maintaining the equipment once it is installed.
• EPA estimates this proposed rule will provide employment for thousands by supporting
31,000 short-term construction jobs and 9,000 long-term utility jobs.
3
• The standards will maintain fuel diversity:
o Coal-fired generation becomes much cleaner with little effect on its role as the major
generator of U.S. electric power.
o EPA’s modeling shows that plants totaling less than 10 GW of the nation’s coal-fired
capacity (not generation) are expected to retire by 2015 rather than invest in control
technologies, which represents about a 2 percent decrease in coal-fired generation.
The plants that are expected to retire are primarily the smaller, less efficient and
higher polluting units that are not used much.
"EPA modeling and power-plant operator announcements show that EPA regulations will close at least 28 gigawatts (GW) of American generating capacity, the equivalent of closing every power plant in the state of North Carolina or Indiana. Also, 28 GW is 8.9 percent of our total coal generating capacity."
The following link lists the plants that will be shut down due to EPA regulations.
If you live in these five states apparently you will feel it the worst.
Current announcements and EPA projections indicate that EPA regulations have a dramatic impact on states reeling from economic hardship.
Ohio: 2,894 MW retired, 8.6% of state total generating capacity.
West Virginia: 2,448 MW retired, 14% of state total generating capacity.
Indiana: 2,168 MW retired, 7.5% of state total generating capacity.
Tennessee: 1,376 MW retired, 6.2% of state total generating capacity.
Missouri: 1,325 MW retired, 6.3% of state total generating capacity.
Wisconsin: 902 MW retired, 5% of state total generating capacity.
Thank goodness that some of these plants are finally either going to be shutdown or cleaned up. There operators have been doing whatever they could for decades to avoid complying with the 1970 Clean Air Act. Below is an article about 2 of the plants listed in the study you linked. The plants should have been either been cleaned up or closed decades ago.
Yet a Tribune analysis reveals that the State Line plant, built along Lake Michigan by ComEd in 1929 and bought by Virginia-based Dominion Resources in 2002, is far dirtier than either of the Chicago plants. It emits more lung-damaging nitrogen oxide than the Pilsen and Little Village plants combined, and churns more sulfur dioxide and toxic mercury into the air than either plant.
Only a dozen other coal plants nationwide emit more nitrogen oxide in relation to the amount of electricity generated — a sign of how much less efficient State Line is than bigger, cleaner power plants.
.....
Responding to questions, Dominion said it decided earlier this year that it isn't worth cleaning up the company's sooty relic. It plans to keep selling State Line's electricity on the open market until a federal lawsuit or tougher pollution rules make it too costly to keep operating the plant.
"We aren't going to make significant capital expenditures in the future at State Line," said Jim Norvelle, a Dominion spokesman.
.....
As environmental laws forced dozens of other coal plants to clean up or shut down, State Line's owners largely avoided the toughest provisions of the federal Clean Air Act and other regulations. Regulators during the 1970s exempted dozens of old plants like State Line after utilities said they wouldn't be running much longer.
Four decades later, complaints about State Line are motivated in part by new research showing that people living in the Chicago area face some of the nation's worst health risks from coal plant pollution, which has been linked to cancer, lung disease and heart problems.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
