9-9-9 serious...so we have to pay 9% on top of 7% State taxes! (Reaganomics, death)

[Jaggy001]

Originally Posted by ovcatto

Besides the income tax imposed upon the suppliers I'm dying to know what those 5 bread taxes might be.




Ah, you think that states will eliminate their income taxes just because the Fed no longer has one??? You can't be serious. States use Federal returns for computing state income taxes because it is easy and efficient. Eliminate the federal income tax and states will either shift the taxing instrument from income to property or some other method, or much worse, require every business in the state to begin reporting income to the state as they do now with federal taxes. Yikes!

I think you have to look at the proposal in the context of a complete reform of the federal tax system and not a partial reform. It will not work as a partial reform.

In terms of 'hidden' taxes .... just look at a utility bill or phone bill to see all the different taxes and levies that are stuck in there. A uniform VAT is a good idea but it will only work if all the other charges are abolished and replaced by the VAT.

I don't understand why so many people insist on mixing up state tax with federal tax. This is federal tax we are talking about. State tax will not go away if federal tax is reformed.

[goodtimes59]

Originally Posted by Nayabone

Pretty obvious none of you guys understand his plan...

For all the people who do not attempt to educate themselves here is phase 1 of the 9-9-9 plan:

[SIZE=2]Unfiltered from the Herman Cain for POTUS website:

Phase One

Our current economic crisis calls for bold action to truly stimulate the economy and Renew America back to its greatness. The 9-9-9 Plan gets Washington D.C. out of the business of picking winners and losers, using the tax code to dole out favors, and dividing the country with class warfare. It is fair, simple, transparent and efficient. It taxes everything once and nothing twice. It taxes the broadest possible base at the lowest possible rates. It is neutral with respect to savings and consumption,capital and labor, imports and exports and whether companies pay dividends or retain earnings.

9% Business Flat Tax
◦Gross income less all purchases from other U.S. located businesses, all capital investment, and net exports.
◦Empowerment Zones will offer deductions for the payroll of those employed in the zone

9% Individual Flat Tax.
◦Gross income less charitable deductions.
◦Empowerment Zones will offer additional deductions for those living and/or working in the zone.

9% National Sales Tax.
◦Unlike a state sales tax, which is an add-on tax that increases the price of goods and services, this is a replacement tax. It replaces taxes that are already embedded in selling prices. By replacing higher marginal rates in the production process with lower marginal rates, marginal production costs actually decline, which will lead to prices being the same or lower, not higher.

Economic Impact
◦According to former Reagan Treasury official Gary Robbins, of Fiscal Associates, the 9-9-9 Plan will expand GDP by $2 trillion, create 6 million new jobs, increase business investment by one third, and increase wages by 10%.


9-9-9 Plan: Summary
?Removes all payroll taxes and unites all tax payers
?Provides the least incentive to evade taxes and the fewest opportunities to do so
?Lifts a $430 billion dead-weight burden on the economy due to compliance, enforcement, collection, etc…
?Is fair, simple, efficient, neutral, and transparent
?Ends nearly all deductions and special interest favors
?Features zero tax on capital gains and repatriated profits
?Exports leave our shores without the Business Tax or the Sales Tax embedded in their cost, making them world class competitive. Imports are subject to the same taxation as domestically produced goods, leveling the playing field.
?Lowest marginal rates on production
?Kills the Death Tax
?Allows immediate expensing of business investments
?Eliminates double taxation of dividends
?Increases capital formation which aids capital availability for small businesses
?Increased capital per worker drives productivity and wage growth
?Features a platform to launch properly structured Empowerment Zones to renew our inner cities
?The pro-growth, pro-job, pro-export economic policies of the 9-9-9 PLAN equals a strong dollar policy[/SIZE]

[CarolinaWoman]

Originally Posted by mohawkx

I paid Federal income taxes for 50 years. Never once did I get a refund that exceeded the amount I paid in. I hate to admit it, but now I live off my social security check and a very small amount from a 401k.
I pay no federal income tax now but I do pay property taxes to support schools and other public services in my community although I have no children going to school. I still pay state taxes. I spend almost all my monthly income on gas, electric, water, trash and food, gas, etc. Each of these items are taxed. You want me to pay more taxes so I have some "skin in the game"? Well I have plenty of "skin in the game" over the years and have the scars to prove it.

You are absolutely right. We live off of our Social Security and a company pension ... but we pay county tax on our vehicles annually, property tax on our land and home annually, school tax annually (no children in school,) gasoline tax, hospitality tax on prepared food, state sales tax in addition to county sales tax. When hubby and I both worked we paid our pound of flesh big time to the feds.

I sent Herman Cain an email and have not received a response but at the CNN Debate last night he answered my question ... his 999 Plan has nothing to do with each state/county/city tax structure ... he explained it as apples and oranges ... the state/county/city will continue to tax their residents as this has nothing to do with his 999 Plan. His plan is Federal ... which I do not think Congress would pass anyway.

I like Herman Cain ... but I do not like the 999 Plan, we pay approx 50 cents or more out of every dollar for taxes in our state/county/city right now.

The debates are turning into Perry/Romney bickering and taking pot shots at each other. That is why I liked Cain until I started digging into his 999 Plan. This plan will kill the middle class and poor.

[BigJon3475]

Reid: Parts of Cain’s 9-9-9 plan ‘make sense’ [VIDEO]

[lucknow]

Originally Posted by Jaggy001

I listened to Cain on CNN last night but before the debate. It was the first time I had really focused on what he was saying.

First of all, he seems to be the only candidate who is trying to think outside the box. The rest of them just repeat the same old stuff. Second, he is absolutely right that our tax code needs radical change. Third he is also right about the hidden taxes; what he is proposing is essentially a VAT. Nothing wrong with that because it works.

I think his 9-9-9 plan needs some re-working and I suspect he intends to do that. There does need to be some protection in there for the poorest Americans. But I think his plan is a good basis for a constructive discussion. Unfortunately, I'm not sure that the rest of the candidates - or Obama for that matter - have any interest in a constructive and rational debate.

And that is one of the attractions of Cain .... he does not sound like a politician.

What they did here in Canada with the 8% added vaule tax is: Eveyone who files a tax return and their income falls below a certain $$$ gets a GST tax rebate every quarter. The less you make the bigger your GST tax rebate is. For example, I have one low income daughter who recieves $150 four times per year as her GST rebate. I really have my doubts she pays $600 per year GST on her purchases, so for her it would be a net gain. My wife and I get $0 GST rebate because our income is above that cutoff point needed to qualify. For 12 years in a row before the present recession our government had a fairly big budget surplus. Having that GST sure helped out the government books. If you read my previous post in this thread it will seem that I'm opposed to a value added tax. I'm not opposed to it in the case of Canada because Canadians are very different than Americans and the problems that the GST caused here were solvable but I doubt the ability of the American government to administer such a programme well. We still have some ongoing problems with it like an underground economy that flourishes because of GST avoidence and worse I think is the trouble many small buisness people run into because of GST remittence problems.

It's a whole lot easier to do anything in a federal government when you only have 30 some million people. Because the USA has ten times the people that Canada has, every single problem that exists is ten times worse and ten times harder to solve.

[Katarina Witt]

Originally Posted by Had2SaySumthin

Not only is this guy a complete idiot, he can't even come up with this own marketing gimmicks. Instead, he ripped off his former competition.



^^^ That's a Pizza Hut ad. ^^^

I rest my case.

Actually, the creator of this plan, who was not Cain himself, got it from Sim City.

Herman Cain 999 Plan: Did It Come From SimCity?

[monkeywrenching]

Originally Posted by bentlebee

I really like Herman Cain but his plan is not something that will work...

He is stating you don't pay the tax on used items....so no tax on a used car?

I don't get it but for groceries, clothes, etc....to me another 9 % is too much...I know on milk, bread there is now no tax, but again an increase of 9%is a lot.

then move to a state without any state income taxes, then see how the 999 plan works. if the 999 plan came into being, I think I would see a influx of people moving from income state tax states to states that have no income taxes.

[Katarina Witt]

Originally Posted by monkeywrenching

then move to a state without any state income taxes, then see how the 999 plan works. if the 999 plan came into being, I think I would see a influx of people moving from income state tax states to states that have no income taxes.

These states with no income taxes usually have high sales and/or property taxes. There's no way to come out ahead with this plan.

[monkeywrenching]

Originally Posted by Katiana

These states with no income taxes usually have high sales and/or property taxes. There's no way to come out ahead with this plan.

yes and no. I would rather live in a state with no income tax and a high sales tax, as I would now be in charge of how much tax I would actually have to pay.

[StillwaterTownie]

Originally Posted by Quick Enough

You would be wrong. go back and READ what the plan ACTUALLY proposes.

No, he's right, assuming that Alabama has in the neighborhood of 9% state and local sales taxes. It's like that in Oklahoma and food purchases are not exempted.