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Old 01-15-2013, 04:40 PM
 
Location: LEAVING CD
22,974 posts, read 27,011,790 times
Reputation: 15645

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Quote:
Originally Posted by AnonymouseX View Post
Executive orders aren't laws.

Unconstitutional executive order can and will be overturned as unconstitutional...

Try taking our guns.
Tell that to the Gov. of New York and the state house in New Jersey/California. Wow, knee jerk draconian laws anyone?

In New Jersey, one of 18 new gun bills submitted to the legislature would require gun buyers to submit to a psychological evaluation. A bill requiring gun owners to register annually, and another requiring all guns to be kept in lock boxes when not in use may be introduced in California. While in Connecticut, state Sen. Beth Bye, wants to limit access to assault weapons and high-capacity magazines, and require that firearms be registered by model and serial number.
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Old 01-15-2013, 09:30 PM
 
Location: Deepest Darkest NZ
717 posts, read 648,035 times
Reputation: 446
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimj View Post
Tell that to the Gov. of New York and the state house in New Jersey/California. Wow, knee jerk draconian laws anyone?

In New Jersey, one of 18 new gun bills submitted to the legislature would require gun buyers to submit to a psychological evaluation. A bill requiring gun owners to register annually, and another requiring all guns to be kept in lock boxes when not in use may be introduced in California. While in Connecticut, state Sen. Beth Bye, wants to limit access to assault weapons and high-capacity magazines, and require that firearms be registered by model and serial number.
You do realise that this is how other nations deals with Guns, don't you? Here in NZ, you must first study and then apply for a licence, must store the weapon in a locked safety box with the bolt (if it is bolt action) stored somewhere else and the ammo stored separately also in a locked strong box. As well back ground checks are made and your psychological health assessed. We are among the highest gun ownership per capita in the world and have among the least fire arms related crimes.
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Old 01-15-2013, 09:39 PM
 
11,768 posts, read 10,262,817 times
Reputation: 3444
Quote:
Originally Posted by kiwimac View Post
You do realise that this is how other nations deals with Guns, don't you? Here in NZ, you must first study and then apply for a licence, must store the weapon in a locked safety box with the bolt (if it is bolt action) stored somewhere else and the ammo stored separately also in a locked strong box. As well back ground checks are made and your psychological health assessed. We are among the highest gun ownership per capita in the world and have among the least fire arms related crimes.
Americans have the right to bear arms, New Zealanders have no such right protected.
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Old 01-15-2013, 10:01 PM
 
1,596 posts, read 1,158,930 times
Reputation: 178
Quote:
Originally Posted by AnonymouseX View Post
Executive orders aren't laws.

Unconstitutional executive order can and will be overturned as unconstitutional...

Try taking our guns.
Because Executive Orders are not laws, they cannot be overturned in a court of law.

Executive Orders are force.

Guns are force - force of law, that is!
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Old 01-15-2013, 10:05 PM
 
11,768 posts, read 10,262,817 times
Reputation: 3444
Quote:
Originally Posted by Statutory Ape View Post
Because Executive Orders are not laws, they cannot be overturned in a court of law.

Executive Orders are force.

Guns are force - force of law, that is!
Huh? EO's can be overturned and they have, though it's not that common.
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Old 01-15-2013, 10:19 PM
 
1,596 posts, read 1,158,930 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lycos679 View Post
Huh? EO's can be overturned and they have, though it's not that common.
In Article III courts?

Please cite.
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Old 01-15-2013, 10:23 PM
 
1,596 posts, read 1,158,930 times
Reputation: 178
Quote:
Originally Posted by lycos679 View Post
Huh? EO's can be overturned and they have, though it's not that common.
You're right!

Found it!

Legal conflicts

"To date, U.S. courts have overturned only two executive orders: the aforementioned Truman order, and a 1995 order issued by President Clinton that attempted to prevent the federal government from contracting with organizations that had strike-breakers on the payroll.[9] Congress was able to overturn an executive order by passing legislation in conflict with it during the period of 1939 to 1983 until the Supreme Court ruled in Immigration and Naturalization Service v. Chadha that the "legislative veto" represented "the exercise of legislative power" without "bicameral passage followed by presentment to the President."[10] The loss of the legislative veto has caused Congress to look for alternative measures to override executive orders such as refusing to approve funding necessary to carry out certain policy measures contained with the order or to legitimize policy mechanisms. In the former, the president retains the power to veto such a decision; however, the Congress may override a veto with a two-thirds majority to end an executive order. It has been argued that a Congressional override of an executive order is a nearly impossible event due to the supermajority vote required and the fact that such a vote leaves individual lawmakers very vulnerable to political criticism.[11]
[edit]"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Executive_order
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Old 01-15-2013, 10:33 PM
 
11,768 posts, read 10,262,817 times
Reputation: 3444
Quote:
Originally Posted by Statutory Ape View Post
In Article III courts?

Please cite.
What are you asking me to cite?


http://lawreview.vermontlaw.edu/file...-2-Vol.-35.pdf
USA.gov: Presidential Executive Orders
Obama Overturns Bush Order on Presidential Records - Government - The Chronicle of Higher Education
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Old 01-16-2013, 04:23 AM
 
Location: LEAVING CD
22,974 posts, read 27,011,790 times
Reputation: 15645
Quote:
Originally Posted by kiwimac View Post
You do realise that this is how other nations deals with Guns, don't you? Here in NZ, you must first study and then apply for a licence, must store the weapon in a locked safety box with the bolt (if it is bolt action) stored somewhere else and the ammo stored separately also in a locked strong box. As well back ground checks are made and your psychological health assessed. We are among the highest gun ownership per capita in the world and have among the least fire arms related crimes.
And that's why it is there and we are here. Just because other nations do something does not mean we have to follow thank goodness. As has been stated before, we have a document that no other country has that has allowed us to become the super power we are today. Do we have issues? Certainly but you don't become a nanny police state to fix them.
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Old 01-16-2013, 08:07 AM
 
Location: South Jersey
322 posts, read 547,166 times
Reputation: 260
Quote:
Originally Posted by JimRom View Post
What I don't want to deal with is having to ask the intruder to hang on for a minute while I'm reloading my revolver because some holier-than-thou liberal gun grabber couldn't grasp the concept that limiting magazines and handgun sizes for law-abiding citizens does absolutely nothing to stop violence and ensures that fewer people would be capable of fighting off an intruder or assailant.
I think making every handgun a single action revolver is silly, let me just start with that. I do, however, support limiting mag sizes to the 10 round max for civilian use under the former AWB.

You're correct in stating that lesgislating "law abiding citizens" doesn't stop violence, but that's an oversimplification. Nearly all weapons (rifles, handguns, shotguns) I confiscated due to their involvment in a commision of a crime over the course of my brief Law Enforcement career were either purchased legally directly by the perpetrator of the crime, or originated from a legal purchase and was subsequently "lost or stolen" thus ending up in the hands of criminals with the intent of commiting violent crime. By halting production, you limit availability thus reducing opportunity to procure through purchase channels (legitimate or not). Basic economic supply principles.

Also regarding your point about mag sizes limiting your ability to ward off inturders. No offense intended but, if you can't hit your target in 10 rounds then you have no business discharging your weapon out in the open.
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