Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Gifted programs in urban schools are important to get middle class families to live in these areas. Without that, you end up with segregation as wealthier parents move to the suburbs to better school districts. Even if the lower performing students don't make the gifted program they benefit from a better overall learning environment created by economic diversity in the school and neighborhood.
I think this is just the start.
DeBlasio has voiced that the "elite high schools" in NYC aren't diverse enough either.
I grew up in NYC and while I went to private school passing the test for these "elite high schools" was a big thing.
My SIL passed the test and went to Bronx High School of Science and then on to college.
Smart as a whip too.
I hate seeing what they are doing to education in the name of "diversity".
Thanks for the link. Didn't have time to google. If you look at the OP page, it does look fake and I did state that it may just be my PC, but thanks for the snark lol.
Also, as was mentioned, and as you should know since you claim to be an educator, gifted programs do not start in most districts until 2nd or 3rd grade as most kid's academic ability evens out by then and even if they are put into an accelerated program in kindergarten, most kids don't even meet the academic requirements needed to designate them as "gifted" by 5th grade who were in the accelerated program from k-5.
And FWIW, I do think there are truly gifted kids at 5 years old. But even gifted 5 year olds don't need to be sitting in a boring class getting facts crammed down their throats and causing them to dislike school. Kindergarten should be both fun and stimulating for the kids and give them a positive outlook on school. For younger kids in particular, they learn more through playing than through instruction from an adult so letting a gifted kid stay in regular kindergarten will do more good than harm in most cases.
Will use my gift of google and give you all the following, older article but information still holds true
As an educator, you should know that way too many parents like to tout their little one as being "gifted" for normal development or because they memorized stuff that mom/dad/grandma made them memorize. Most are just regular kids. Those parents do give the kid a boost and encourage a love of learning but the kid is not actually gifted.
As stated, people tell me my own kid is gifted. I don't know for sure, but I don't think she is. She just likes to learn and so we explore her interests in depth. I did the same for my older kid who is now in middle school and to know him now, you would know that he is not gifted even though he does still read above average and does above average math. He is just a regular kid who has parents who put a lot of time and effort into him. Contrast that with me, as I was a TAG kid, my mom was a single mom on welfare and she didn't do hardly anything with me at all but I could read my favorite book "Soup and Me" when I was 3 years old and do multiplication better than the 8 year olds on our street at the time. True giftedness cannot be taught to kids. They just are that way.
Gifted and Talented programs have been around since the 80's and serve all grade levels.
In Texas it's a pullout program for a portion of the day.
The kids are not put in a cohort. They are mainstreamed for most of the day.
This is K-8. In HS they get an independent study period.
Now you do have your magnet schools in urban areas which is a different story.
But for most schools G/T is a pullout program.
Gifted programs in urban schools are important to get middle class families to live in these areas. Without that, you end up with segregation as wealthier parents move to the suburbs to better school districts. Even if the lower performing students don't make the gifted program they benefit from a better overall learning environment created by economic diversity in the school and neighborhood.
I agree with this, especially in regards to having the gifted/magnet programs to lure middle and upper income families.
Since you are in Oak Park, you probably are familiar with the selective enrollment schools in Chicago and I feel they serve this very purpose.
We were looking to move to Chicago (my husband is a native) and I personally wouldn't send my kids to many schools on the south side except the classical or selective enrollment schools. And even though, as I stated above, I don't think either of my kids are gifted, I know that I could tutor the older one enough (who is soooo not gifted lol, sweet and smart, but not gifted) to get him into one of the selective enrollment high schools since he is an above average reader and gets near gifted scores in math (he is in the 89th percentile mathematically) and I know with a good test prep program, he could get the scores needed to get in. But I personally think they would be too much for him so wouldn't go that route, so I had to halt the idea of moving to the city of Chicago based on his educational needs.
ETA: also wanted to note that I always find it odd that NYC public schools have diversity issues with their elite schools. This is not the case in Chicago and in Chicago they have a larger population of native black Chicagoans than NYC I bet who have a lot of West Indian and African immigrants whose children usually perform really well academically.
As an educator, you should know that way too many parents like to tout their little one as being "gifted" for normal development or because they memorized stuff that mom/dad/grandma made them memorize. Most are just regular kids. Those parents do give the kid a boost and encourage a love of learning but the kid is not actually gifted.
Yes but we go by testing and observations in the schools, not by parent's words.
Every kid would have a perfect A in every class if we went by what parent's thought of their children's abilities.
I agree with this, especially in regards to having the gifted/magnet programs to lure middle and upper income families.
Since you are in Oak Park, you probably are familiar with the selective enrollment schools in Chicago and I feel they serve this very purpose.
We were looking to move to Chicago (my husband is a native) and I personally wouldn't send my kids to many schools on the south side except the classical or selective enrollment schools. And even though, as I stated above, I don't think either of my kids are gifted, I know that I could tutor the older one enough (who is soooo not gifted lol, sweet and smart, but not gifted) to get him into one of the selective enrollment high schools since he is an above average reader and gets near gifted scores in math (he is in the 89th percentile mathematically) and I know with a good test prep program, he could get the scores needed to get in. But I personally think they would be too much for him so wouldn't go that route, so I had to halt the idea of moving to the city of Chicago based on his educational needs.
ETA: also wanted to note that I always find it odd that NYC public schools have diversity issues with their elite schools. This is not the case in Chicago and in Chicago they have a larger population of native black Chicagoans than NYC I bet who have a lot of West Indian and African immigrants whose children usually perform really well academically.
That's you pushing him though. Truly gifted don't need "tutoring" to qualify.
Once in the program it becomes obvious that they didn't achieve where they are by themselves.
I've worked with the G/T students and you can tell they WANT to know what goes beyond what you are teaching.
And when challenged they do go off and research (within their ability) the topic.
And yet, all the rich Liberal NY'ers will send their kids to Private schools so they can get a better education.
No diversity required in Private schools.
Those with the means who choose to compete for space in the " right" private schools understand that preparation begins well before pre-school and involves private tutoring. If one is fortunate enough to have their child accepted at one of the " right" private pre-schools, they face annual tuitions that are approaching $30, 000 a year for a 3year old, exclusive of fees and the expectation of incremental donations pledges.
There is a growing trend within the city that rejects the private school model in favor of public schools, especially in lower Manhattan and Brooklyn.
A gifted program for kindergarteners? Give me a break.
The G/T programs have been around since the 1980's and offered to all students at all grade levels.
01-31-2014, 09:59 AM
Guest
n/a posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyTexan
That's you pushing him though. Truly gifted don't need "tutoring" to qualify.
Once in the program it becomes obvious that they didn't achieve where they are by themselves.
Yes but we go by testing and observations in the schools, not by parent's words.
Every kid would have a perfect A in every class if we went by what parent's thought of their children's abilities.
Testing and observation are both subjects that can and are influenced by parental involvement. As stated, I have been told my daughter is gifted. She is 5 and is in pre-k, she reads at a 2nd grade level, she does simple math problems (mostly addition), her teachers, more than one have actually told me that she is gifted based on tests that they perform with her on a periodic basis (which is how they know her reading level) and on her classroom behavior/observations.
Most of the test administered to kindergartners in the public school system are not test used to determine giftedness. Those test are usually administered by an educational psychologist. And a more precocious student usually seems the most gifted. My daughter is very precocious, outspoken, speaks very well, very articulate, and is also creative and expressive. She is like every other kid in my family who has a mom that reads to him/her and takes them on trips and such. And though she is an advanced reader (as this is usually what makes most teachers think that kids are gifted) that by itself is not indicative of giftedness. No one test can determine that and most teachers especially do not have the training or ability to recognize giftedness in children. Standardized tests cannot measure giftedness. Many children who do poorly on those tests, especially children with specific learning disorders like dyslexia can be gifted but fail standardized tests due to their LD. One of my good classmates growing up had dyslexia and was deemed as gifted even though she never did well on the ITBS due to her disability. Luckily those test at that time, did not hold us back or make her have to join the general population of kids as she was probably the most gifted of all of us, and super weird lol. But most really gifted kids are really weird too in my experience.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
