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I don't think anarchists can stand being close to other people not even their own.
i would like to see a highway in such an anarchist community (if it was big enough of course) where everybody writes his own traffic laws LOL
there are plenty of places in the world that lack meaningful rules on the road. you simply have to be more vigilant when driving in these places. as an example, even as recently as ten years ago, when i was driving in cambodia, whenever a police officer tried to pull me over i would simply ignore them and continue on my way. they would give up eventually. things have changed quite a bit in the last five years, so I wouldn't try that anymore, but it was chaotic to say the least, back in the day. no lanes, no traffic signals, no right of way, no universal direction of travel, dirt roads, etc. had to be on your toes.
You dont have to argue this point, we all know people can be sympathetic but there is no way private charities could take care of all those in need. Not enough capacity. This I know for sure.
It's practically impossible for any society to properly address every single need of every single citizen. It certainly isn't possible if any semblance of freedom is supposed to exist. We spend right around $1 trillion per year in federal and state assistance programs. That works out to ~$21k per poor person, or $84k per family of four. How much has it helped?
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Originally Posted by random_thoughts
I am not arguing the government is not skimming 85% but simply point out that NOBODY ELSE wants to take care of people in need. Private charities, churches simply don't have the capacity to do so.
Again, untrue. Plenty of people want and actually do help others. Can they help everyone? No, but neither can the federal government because it's impossible to be omniscient and omnibenevolent. There are 126 different federal assistance programs, yet we have the highest poverty rate in decades. We've sunk more than $15 trillion into the war on poverty, yet we still have poverty.
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Originally Posted by random_thoughts
What's the alternative? Let the people in need starve to death? No private institution has the resources to help all those in need.
And neither does the government. The difference between the two is the morality of initiating force, as well as efficiency. You see, when I give $100 to St. Judes, exactly $100 of it gets used for research or the care of a sick kid. My $100 that gets taken by Leviathan to support welfare end sup actually making use of about $15 on actual assistance, while the remainder props up the bureaucracy.
Quote:
Originally Posted by random_thoughts
I am appalled to realize that anarchist utopia does not offer any solution to the problem of elderly, disabled or sick. They would probably have to walk door to door begging for food. Nice alternative. Thank you, but no thank you.
Another appeal to sympathy. Charity doesn't need to be wrapped in plain brown paper. I've done volunteer work at women's shelters, homeless housing, food banks, etc. People in need come in of their own volition, are treated kindly and with respect, and tend to be really grateful and pleasant. It's not the sameful Oliver twist nightmare you're trying to paint it as.
PS - I am not an anarchist. You have me confused with someone else.
You dont have to argue this point, we all know people can be sympathetic but there is no way private charities could take care of all those in need. Not enough capacity. This I know for sure.
I am not arguing the government is not skimming 85% but simply point out that NOBODY ELSE wants to take care of people in need. Private charities, churches simply don't have the capacity to do so.
What's the alternative? Let the people in need starve to death? No private institution has the resources to help all those in need.
I am appalled to realize that anarchist utopia does not offer any solution to the problem of taking care of the elderly, orphaned, disabled or sick. They would probably have to walk door to door begging for food. Nice alternative. Thank you, but no thank you.
One way I look at it is that the fact that we even have a welfare state is proof that the majority wants to help. Think of all the people who support it, plus people who believe in charity. Thats probably most of the population who want the less fortunate taken care of. It would be more efficient to have those people donate directly without politicians taking some of it and giving the rest to people who may need it or may be cheating the system.
Wow, this thread has gotten really funny, who knew a libertarian thread would turn into an armchair anarchist thread. It is easy to be for anarchy when living in a safe environment where one doesn't have to experience the negative effects of anarchy.
Anarchy should be the default position of all human life on earth. Thus, I'm an anarchist in the default sense.
I'll simply repeat it one more time:
I believe that a person born has natural rights and free will. They are not subject to any involuntary associations and their rules. The only way a person can have their rights/free will restricted is thru a voluntary agreement.
You believe that upon birth a person's natural rights and free will are automatically prescribed to an involuntary institution called the government (or State). The only circumstances under which a person may access their natural rights/free will is thru the permission of this involuntary institution. The punishment for those who don't access their natural rights/free will in this manner ranges from fines to imprisonment to death.
It really is that simple. That is what I mean by anarchy. Anarchy is the natural default setting of a human because it is an immoral and illegitamate act to involuntary force someone into an association upon birth.
In my personal life, if I had access to my natural rights/free will I would not be an anarchist. I would join voluntary associations. Just my personal preference. It should be noted that even after I've joined a voluntary organization I may leave it at some point. Something you are unable to do.
If I currently don't belong to any voluntary organizations I would be an anarchist at that point. A temporary one in my case because once again my personal preference is to belong to voluntary associations.
Anarchy: absence of government
That's what it means. I would initially be an anarchist. We all would. I personally may be an anarchist for short periods over my life...meaning I was free from any hierarchical institution. I assume some folks would never joun a voluntary association making themselves permanent anarchists.
If you know what you would do then could you please tell us? I would be really interested to hear how those who are unable to defend themselves with retaliatory force will be protected in your anarchist utopia. Of course if you know that there is no answer for that and that's why you're avoiding the question please do be honest and admit that.
Why does it matter what I would do in situation A, B, or C?
It has no bearing on what you would do.
If I'm unable to physically defend myself from an intruder I would put my underwear on my head and sing Celebration by Kool & The Gang.
How that impacts your life I have no clue. But there's your answer. Go ask Bob in Helena, Montana what he would do.
Why does it matter what I would do in situation A, B, or C?
It has no bearing on what you would do.
If I'm unable to physically defend myself from an intruder I would put my underwear on my head and sing Celebration by Kool & The Gang.
How that impacts your life I have no clue. But there's your answer. Go ask Bob in Helena, Montana what he would do.
Might as well.
It matters what you would do (well it matters what you tell us what you would do) because we want to know how you actually imagine it to work. If you don't know how it would work, if you don't know what you would do, then fine, just say that. Don't just avoid questions because you can't answer them, be honest about the issues in your utopia and maybe people would take you more seriously.
It matters what you would do (well it matters what you tell us what you would do) because we want to know how you actually imagine it to work. If you don't know how it would work, if you don't know what you would do, then fine, just say that. Don't just avoid questions because you can't answer them, be honest about the issues in your utopia and maybe people would take you more seriously.
But my answer would only be for me so why does it matter?
Some people would hire a guy to guard them from intruders. Others may build a moat. Still others may purchase a gun. Some may pray. Some may commit suicide.
I would put my underwear on my head and sing Celebration by Kool & The Gang.
But my answer would only be for me so why does it matter?
Some people would hire a guy to guard them from intruders. Others may build a moat. Still others may purchase a gun. Some may pray. Some may commit suicide.
I would put my underwear on my head and sing Celebration by Kool & The Gang.
How any of this is relevant is beyond me.
Thank you for answering with some examples of what you think people might do. It makes it much easier to discuss a topic when your ideas are clearer.
The issue lies in how the weak, children, disabled, elderly can defend themselves - beyond praying or committing suicide it seems they don't have much choice.
The issue lies in how the weak, children, disabled, elderly can defend themselves - beyond praying or committing suicide it seems they don't have much choice.
I already do, by paying my taxes and being part of society.
If I was in an anarchistic society I suppose I would help people around me that I know, to the extent that I don't put myself at risk, which is what I imagine most people would do, which isn't enough to help everyone that needs help and that is the problem with the idea.
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