Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
We would see a temporary spike in spending as the minimum wage earners temporarily became "ghetto rich", but it would very temporary.
Welfare would still cost about the same in relative dollars, since minimum wage earners would be right back on the welfare roles once the markets adjusted, and would have a few new friends to come along with them after businesses pushed more automation to offset labor costs.
The FED will loan out enough money to get 5% or less unemployment. so there is no dead weight loss to raising the minimum wage.
So up the minimum wage more each year than inflation and have it apply to all workers world wide making something to be sold in the US.
So the solution is to not only jack up our economy, but to interfere in the economies of all the rest of the world as well? Let's get right on that.
I just want to buy things that have been made by workers making $7.25 an hr or more. Insisting that all our trading partners pay that level to their export workers well we don't even have to go that far. All we have to do is to tax dividens paid and capital gains from the sale of stocks for any company that pays anyone world wide less than US minimum wage buys anything made by anyone getting paid less than US minimum wage, or uses contract labor at less than US minimum wage. That is US protectionism that benefits all. We need a spike in consumer spending or we are going to have a recession do you have a way to get that otherwise?
Quote:
Originally Posted by JimRom
Seriously, the solution has nothing to do with raising the minimum wage.
I just want to buy things that have been made by workers making $7.25 an hr or more. Insisting that all our trading partners pay that level to their export workers well we don't even have to go that far. All we have to do is to tax dividens paid and capital gains from the sale of stocks for any company that pays anyone world wide less than US minimum wage buys anything made by anyone getting paid less than US minimum wage, or uses contract labor at less than US minimum wage. That is US protectionism that benefits all. We need a spike in consumer spending or we are going to have a recession do you have a way to get that otherwise?
What is your solution then?
I've already posted my solution, but in a nutshell it's this: stop trying to lift people out of poverty by practicing economic voodoo - which is what raising the minimum wage equates to - and start encouraging people to lift themselves out of poverty by making programs that provide an education and skill set that is marketable to employers both affordable and accessible.
Why do people insist on raising the minimum wage as a solution to poverty when not one single time since the 1930s has raising the minimum wage done anything to substantially change the lifestyle of minimum wage earners?
I've already posted my solution, but in a nutshell it's this: stop trying to lift people out of poverty by practicing economic voodoo - which is what raising the minimum wage equates to - and start encouraging people to lift themselves out of poverty by making programs that provide an education and skill set that is marketable to employers both affordable and accessible.
Why do people insist on raising the minimum wage as a solution to poverty when not one single time since the 1930s has raising the minimum wage done anything to substantially change the lifestyle of minimum wage earners?
Probably because they understand inflation, or that an economy needs people at the bottom spending money too?
I've already posted my solution, but in a nutshell it's this: stop trying to lift people out of poverty by practicing economic voodoo - which is what raising the minimum wage equates to - and start encouraging people to lift themselves out of poverty by making programs that provide an education and skill set that is marketable to employers both affordable and accessible.
Wal-Mart is big enough to practice monopolistic behaviors.
They need the minimum wage to keep them from having their employees work for nothing.
Wal-Mart employs 1% of the US workforce.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JimRom
Why do people insist on raising the minimum wage as a solution to poverty when not one single time since the 1930s has raising the minimum wage done anything to substantially change the lifestyle of minimum wage earners?
Because the shape of the income distribution is a function of public policies and your place on it is a function of personal effort. Micro vs. macro. I don't care about changing the life stile of minimum wage workers.
After WWII It was set up to grow the middle in the US. Now it is set up to grow the top. It is the bottoms turn to have things set up so that they grow.
I pulled this from the other post. I guess it is effective in showing that people (The OP.) who are against the 15 dollars an hour are bad at math.
Quote:
Originally Posted by non-linear
Explain how a business can afford $15 an hour. Lets hear you theories. The increased sales argument doesn't wrk either. If you've got a pizza chain and you have twice as many orders to fill, then obviously you have to hire twice as many delivery drivers to meet demand. According to Forbes, the average restaurant franchise makes a profit of 86k annually, at a place I worked they spent approximately 3k per week on labor, so how in the hell can a company afford to double that cost, adding an extrva 156k in labor expenses when there isn't even 156k left over in profit? Even if sales doubles, the net profit comes out to about 20k even without hiring extra labor (which is obviously unrealistic). Who gets the shaft? The franchisee. Why should the guy running the place make less then his employees?
Your company made 86 K in profit after paying 156K in labor. Profit comes after labor gets paid. I would say we're working with 242K here, but there's rent, the light bill, water, heck maybe they have cable TV.
Your company doubles sales and doubles payroll. Now it makes 172K in profit after it pays 312K in labor. Now we're working with ~412K. If the light bill, rent, etc. didn't go up, he'd have even more profit vs. expenses.
I fail to see how that franchisee got totally shafted.
EDIT.. wait a second. pizza drivers taking approximately 3K a month are earning approximately $17.30 an hour.
17.30 X 2080 = $36,000.
That's based on a standard 40 hour workweek. If they are part time, they are still making 3K, so they are making MORE THAN $17.30 an hour.
The OP actually gave us a business with the workers earning the equivilant of more than 15 dollars an hour and making $86 profit a year. And then told us how it would be a failure.
The real question is not if you can sustain the business. The real question is where is this pizza place, and are they hiring?
You guys failed to thoroughly read my post. A business spends 3k on ALL WORKERS A WEEK at a place I used to work.
Probably because they understand inflation, or that an economy needs people at the bottom spending money too?
When inflation occurs, it supposedly inflates both prices and wages. The median income now is very similar to the 90s. It's not just low wage workers getting screwed, its everyone. My example was mainly pointing out fast food. It doesn't apply to retail or all the other low wage jobs. You're not gonna get over $12-$15 and it be sustainable in those industries. Fast food will never be worth over MAYBE $8.50 an hour. But it depends. On the corporate end, mcdonalds could pay $10. Franchisees maybe not. There is a huge problem for every working American. I don't give a damn if you make 7.25 an hour or $24 an hour, your most likely getting ripped off because wealthy individuals are pocketing your productivity and getting extremely rich while your wage remains stagnant. Income inequality exists because of a gross exploitation of your labor. You sell them 100k worth of services and they pay you 50k and pocket the rest. Businesses are constantly finding ways to shift this value further and further into their pocket, whether it means shipping overseas, hiring a technician to do an engineers job etc.
I don't either. But you do live in a liberal fantasy land where printing money borrowed against future human capital magically doesn't devalue anything.
A business that is printing money is probably doing so illegally, I haven't heard of cases where employers are paying their employees with fake printed money.
Typically a worker receives a paycheck or real money from their employer for hours worked. That pay has to meet a minimum standard, which is the minimum wage.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Let's get right on that.
