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Originally Posted by jade408
All white people, regardless of oaring benefited from segregationist policies, redlining, and unequal government treatment that continued well into the 70s. And those benefits continue to apply even though some of the direct policies have been eliminated.
But it is super easy to pretend it was all sunshine and roses for race "relations" and "equal rights" after slavery ended.
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Too bad.
Every race and ethnicity is guilty of oppressing others.
And there is no practical way to make up for that fact, other than to find everyone guilty.
Get over it.
You have decades of welfare, affirmative action, etc., working in your favor -- plus you live in the one country in the world that offers the most freedom and opportunity for people of all races and classes.
Millions of poor people from the Third World -- none of them white -- immigrate to this country and succeed.
That ought to tell you something.
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Originally Posted by golgi1
What is super easy is to be an anti-intellectual race hustler for purposes of rent seeking. Redlining does not warrant reparations. Segregation does not warrant reparations. The "unequal treatment" has been repaid a hundred times over in the form of affirmative action and other race specific programs. Categorizing all "white people" onto one line of your balance sheet is as racist as anything else in history, but in this case it is for your benefit and so that makes it okay. You unwittingly excuse the behavior of any white racist in the past.
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Exactly.
I don't understand why white people who just moved to this country are guilty.
I also don't understand why brown people who just moved to this country should get affirmative action preferences.
There is no nuanced consideration of who truly is the oppressor or the victim.
All there is is "hate whitey."
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Originally Posted by jade408
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I'm amazed you'd even bring up Ferguson.
Michael Brown was a criminal who deserved what he got.
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I'll also share some of my own family history. My grandad had a masters and served in WW2. And as you can imagine, back then having a masters and any sort of college education was pretty rare no matter what ethnic group you came from. When he came home from the war he couldn't get a job in his town. The local factories told him to get lost and every door was closed.
This is not to say y grand dad didn't find something to do. He opened up a few businesses and was a minister. His kids all went to college as well and had master's degrees. He owned his home. But he never did have the same sort of economic opportunity that was available to other college grads of that time. His home didn't appreciate and leave us with generations of wealth-building.
And even though at this moment, by most measures I am doing pretty well, I can see the impact of all those missed windows of equal access and how that played out in my parents life, and of course how that reflected on how I grew up and my own life ended up.
These benefits are invisible to you (if you are a white person). In our society it is OK to assume people of color are not qualified and "opening" opportunity to "diverse" people "lowers standards." You can walk into a room, or job interview or store or pretty much anywhere and people will assume you belong and you are qualified before you say a word. For me it is assumed that I am not until I have proven otherwise. Why is that?
You can try to dismiss any critical discussion systemic inequality by blaming the "race card," accusing people of being "divisive," or saying well we already have affirmative action, and "race based programs." Which best case helped white women more than anyone else and worst case did pretty much nothing because they didn't solve the underlying structural issues.
You know what I'd like to see happen in April? A critical discussion and acknowledgement of the structural issues that have lead us to where we are today without having to worry about sugar coating it so some people don't have to have hard conversations. I don't get the luxury of being "comfortable" all the time. A few minutes or hours of uncomfortable conversation isn't unreasonable.
**I forgot to add the most important comment! "I am not a racist. I know lots of white people. Some of my closest friends are white. I work with white people and interact with white people every day!" *SMH* See how patronizing that sounds from the other side.
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You sure seem to be on a hunt for grievances and excuses for your own shortcomings.
Life is tough and then you die -- and that goes for white people, not just black people.
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Originally Posted by Mimir
Newsflash: it is no longer 1945. You act like the period from 1955-1965 never happened. Institutional racism ended a very long time ago. The only people who want to pretend that it still exists are the rent-seekers, race pimps, and those who financially support those groups and individuals, also known as useful idiots.
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Well said.
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Originally Posted by jade408
Institutional racism isn't over by a long shot. It has new names.
We can start with an easy one: drug sentences for crack and cocaine were wildly different, yet the are the same drugs consumed different,y. Why was sentencing different for things that are chemically the same? You can extrapolate the rest. And let's nip this in the bud ahead of time: ethnic groups use drugs at similar so levels, with whites using them a bit mire. And people mostly buy drugs from people like then who share their race. So if drug sales and drug use are statistically the same, why are drug arrests wildly different?
Decisions made in the 50s play a huge role in how the works works now. Why don't we talk about the downfall of public transportation, the rise of the highway system and suburbs? Right now because the bulk of the housing built over the past 50 years was in the suburbs, we have an urban housing crisis and urban areas are seeing huge appreciation, and rising rents. Notice I used a metaphor here not related to race.
Or check out the history of urban renewal and redevelopment that is still impacting real estate values and development now even though it was mostly over in the 80s.
Or the fact every year banks settle a class action suit about over charging borrowers of color for loans,,even with the same qualifications. Last week Toyota got hit on the car loan front. Wells Fargo did in recent years over mortgages. And pretty much every other bank.
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Hey, I've noticed that blacks haven't supported gays in their struggles. Neither have Latinos. But we hear constant sob stories about how blacks and Latinos have been wronged.
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Originally Posted by jade408
They need to start higher level, by defining a white consciousness. So much of being white in the US is about forgetting your white ethnicity and adopting generic American WASP-y-ness.
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What would "white consciousness" be? Or "black consciousness"? Other than racism?
Hitler's minions constantly talked about "Jew consciousness."
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Originally Posted by jade408
No. Advancing your "group" doesn't mean your trampling others. Just like if I were to do exercises to build my strength, it has no impact on your strength development and training.
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So you don't mind the Aryan Brotherhood and other white power groups?
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Originally Posted by jade408
Yes I do. It is actually important to eliminating racism. Since black (et al) is defined as the polar opposite of whiteness, we need to hone in on what being white really means. How did it get defined in our society and why? According to the census, Syrians, Iraqis, Egyptians, Afhans, and Iranians are white, but I am sure most Americans don't think so.
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That's because they aren't white.
Just look at the Middle East.
It is the intersection of Europe, Africa and Asia.
And its inhabitants have been a racial combination of white, black and Asian for centuries.
I love these leftists and liberals who think they can define race as they please.
They cannot.
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Originally Posted by victimofGM
In this day and age, economic background plays a bigger part than race. Poor white families don't have as much access to programs to help them pay for college. Back in the 80s I fell in the middle ground. Family had too much income to qualify for financial aid programs but not enough to pay for college. My grades were good enough to get accepted but not enough for scholarship. But if my skin color was different I could have gotten the opportunity. Some of the things holding back black communities are themselves. First comes passing on the victim mentality that a black man can't ever get ahead in a white man's world and the only way to succeed is to either become a music star, pro athlete, or an Uncle Tom. Another road block is cultural attitude. You go into a job interview with an angry aggressive attitude, posture, and style of talking and your chances of getting hired would be slim to none regardless of your skin color. The hip hop or gangsta culture is a source of this attitude. Socially accepting criminal behavior as normal is another road block. There was a news story of a man who was arrested for shooting a cop. His relative didn't understand what was the big deal. She looked at what he did like it was a public service. Raising kids around such attitudes towards crime will most likely breed more criminals. Another problem is "keeping it real". This attitude that even if you do become a success you should continue behaving like you're still in the hood. This mostly impacts musical artist and pro athletes. Nothing wrong with remembering where you came from, but don't continue to engage in criminal activity nor hang out with criminals. And when a well educated black person becomes a success they're accused of acting white or being an Uncle Tom as was the case with Condolizzaa Rice.
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Well said.
The race and gender grievance hustlers claim to want diversity. But God forbid you be a white male, a conservative black, or a conservative female.
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Originally Posted by jade408
No, race and class are intersectional. Being black and middle class doesn't insulate you from racism. I know from experience.
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Sorry. You sound very entitled. You don't sound like someone who has suffered even a smidgen of oppression.
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I see you incorporated Fox News' entire catalog of black people stereotypes here.
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What stereotypes?
The black community having a 70% illegitimacy rate?
Blacks committing a disproportionately high amount of crime?
Those are not stereotypes, they are facts.
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The average black person is just like you working hard to support themselves or family. But you don't ever here the story of regular black folk in the media. Tv shows about regular black folks get rejected because the characters aren't "black enough" aka don't fit in those stereotypes.
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Ridiculous.
There have been tons of TV shows and movies featuring blacks as middle class and even high class role models.
Producers have even stretched historical accuracy in order to include blacks. For example, "Hogan's Heroes" in the 1960s having a black character.
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The only people calling Condi and Colin Uncle Toms or Fox News correspondents who want to discuss so called black pathology.
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Not according to Condi, etc.
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Originally Posted by jade408
You can't be racist if you have no power to enforce it or impact people because of it.
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B.s.
Racism is nothing other than judging people based solely on their race.
Which is what you are doing.
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Originally Posted by Mimir
LOL @ black people having no power in 2016 C.E. Barack Obama is U.S President. That Cory Booker guy is Senator from New Jersey. Tim Scott is a Senator from South Carolina. Mia Love is a Representative from Utah. The last two attorney generals, including the current one, have been black. Do you hate white people or not? "ANTI-RACIST" is code for anti-white.
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Well said.
It's interesting that the cries of victimization and racism have exponentially increased ever since we elected our first black president!
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Originally Posted by shiftymh
This is why nobody will ever take the BLM nonsense seriously. Just because the social pseudo-science crowd has fabricated a definition of racism that conveniently excludes minorities doesn't mean the rest of us have to accept it.
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Exactly.
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Originally Posted by fisheye
To me and Wikipedia (by their definition) BLM is racist: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Racism. The only way an organization, like BLM, could not be racist is if it was called ALM (All Lives Matter). |
Good point.
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