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you really seem clueless as to what freedom of speech is, and where it fits into a civil society.
The people who bought tickets are customers, the game they attended was a product they purchased. The fans came to escape from their daily lives, to get away from politics, and the kind of crap these knee takers are inserting into the game. They did not spend money and drive all that way to be forced to watch a bunch of millionaire sportos acting out their social justice agenda.
These knee takers are abusing their position as players, exploiting their captive audience to force customers to watch their their SJW crap.
The people who bought tickets bought them for many different reasons, and it's their choice. Surely you don't want the government telling us what reasons we can have for watching a game, a concert, or another activity?
The way we handle this in America is that you buy the products that you want, and can afford at the price offered. If you don't want them, or can't afford them, then don't buy them. If enough people are in the same camp, then supply exceeds demand, and prices come down, or the seller changes the product to meet with demand. It's simple economics. We don't need the government to tell the NFL what product they can or can't sell. As consumers, we can decide if we want to buy it or not.
And knee takers, as you call them are not abusing their position, they are however exploiting an opportunity to reach a lot of people with their message. Exploiting is not a bad word. If you want to stop them from reaching you, just don't go, and don't watch. Again, why do we need to create a nanny state, are you that weak that you can't figure this out on your own?
It's a shame in that the kneeling protest has been hijacked by this debate about disrespecting the military. When Kaepernick started doing this last year he was in his own words trying to bring attention to unethical police practices. It was never intended to be a stance against the Armed Forces.
It is a shame.
And rather ironic since many of the same people who claim that respecting the anthem and flag equals respecting the troops also choose to support a draft-dodger who has actively defamed service members and Gold Star families.
Boils down to support of convenience as far as I'm concerned, much like those who stuck yellow ribbon magnets on their cars but refused to allow their own children to enlist during the initial stages of the Iraq War.
This is a circular discussion of disrespect. Those pointing fingers and the NFL/players who say they are disrespecting the country/flag/armed forces are disrespecting the foundation of this country, the Constitution. Players have publicly stated their families military involvement and love for their country. Trump chiming in was probably the worst thing that could have happened.
None of it escapes me. What must escape you is that the issue of doing it at work is between the employer and employee and it doesn't appear to be an issue in this case
The fans paid for the ticket, they are the customer. True, the players can essentially punk the customer with their SJW crap, but the customer has the right to stop purchasing the product. Which is what more and more fans are doing, by refusing to go to the games, or watch them on TV.
If you bought a an item on Amazon, you would not like it if the employee packaging your order slipped in a pamphlet on abortion. Hey, it's freedom of speech, and it's just an issue "between the employer and employee."
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lowexpectations
But the fan isn't the employer, you as a fan can choose to not go or watch but you aren't in the position to directly say why the players can or can't do
You really don't grasp this concept of the customer and product supplier relationship, do you? The customer paid for a product. In this case, the product was the football game. This includes sitting in the stadium, eating the food, and the ambience of the entire event, which includes participating in the playing of the anthem.
If you eat at a restaurant, and the servers are acting improper, is that just an issue "between the employer and employee?" Or does the customer not have a say on any of this. According to you, the purpose of the restaurant is to give employees a job to do. Without paying customers, what exactly is their job, hmmmm?
The restaurant servers job is to make the customer happy, just as the football players job is to make the customer happy.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lowexpectations
You are incorrect, my free speech doesn't end just because it negatively impacts you
You missed that one too. You cannot impose your right on me against my will. You do not have the right to force me to listen to it, watch it, or acknowledge it.
I have a right to get what I paid for. If I paid to be entertained by a football game, and you keep shoving your SJW antics in my face, I have the right to take my money elsewhere.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lowexpectations
It's not your call, you don't employ the players. It's too difficult for you to grasp
Geez, the fans are the boss here!!! That's the point you miss.
The players are not playing football in a vacuum here. They only get paid if their are people willing to pay to watch them play. If enough people stop watching the game, then advertisers go away. You continually act as if the fans have no say in the game.
The restaurant owner will not have a business if his employees keep displeasing the customers. Employees have the right to freedom of speech to **** off customers, but the customers are free to go somewhere else. Then who pays their salaries, hmmmm?
Blacks put their blackness first. Al Sharpton , Jesse Jackson has nothing good to say about race relations. Ever hear a positive word about race relations. NO.. and it will continue ..
Racism and racists are not as easily understood by way of the folks you seem fixated on. The issue(s) are not that complicated. The problem(s) not that hard to see if willing to look.
I believe race relations are certainly improved since before the civil rights movement, and although progress will continue to be slow because of all the ongoing ignorance and bigotry that persists, we can and will make progress going forward as well. Of this I'm sure, because the younger generation is always just a little less hung up by the ignorance of the prior generation as a whole, generally speaking. That's why we no longer have segregation and why women can vote now and..., need I go on?
Racism and racists are not as easily understood by way of the folks you seem fixated on. The issues are not that complicated. The problem(s) not that hard to see.
I believe race relations are certainly improved since before the civil rights movement, and although progress will continue to be slow because of all the ongoing ignorance and bigotry that persists, we can and will make progress going forward as well. Of this I'm sure, because the younger generation is always just a little less hung up by the ignorance of the prior generation as a whole, generally speaking. That's why we no longer have segregation and why women can vote now and..., need I go on?
The democrats keep pointing at the racism and racist.. where? I don't see it. I never hear one good word about race relations from the left.. they use the race card as a tool for their political power over blacks. They use them as pawns because of their skin color. So what is so bad about being black?
Babies in the womb are government's business, because they are life. The right to life is mentioned first. "To secure these rights, government is instituted among men ..."
Common sense should dictate who uses which bathroom, and I think it could be argued that the right to privacy might play a role in protecting the right to expect that entering a public restroom will not be a traumatic experience or subject one to spying by some pervert who "feels" he is a female on any given day. This whole bathroom issue is just disgusting. And out of that issue we are not getting to, "I think a child should be given time to decide what sex he or she is!" Debauchery has become acceptable to a certain class of people today.
Good manners and respect for others and respect for one's country should rule when it comes to the Pledge and the National Anthem ...stand up! Disrespecting the flag and our country is just plain poor manners. If you have a "beef" with some policy or issue, find another way to protest. "Giving the finger" to the fans who pay you (and they pay a lot) is not a real good idea. Firing is justified. Wouldn't an employer fire an employee that disrespected a paying client? You bet he would.
Nonsense Guy, I knew we could count on you.
Government has no business in the decisions that I make with my medical providers. None. Neither my embryos nor my children belong to the government.
There were absolutely no reports of problems over who was using which bathroom in NC. There was no reason for that idiotic law other than pandering to RW ***holes.
Poor manners is the realm of Ms. Manners not the federal government. If the NFL wants to get into with the players they have on contract, so be it. But the POTUS has no business tweeting that they should be fired or deported.
Seem Rs are all about doing away with environmental regulations, banking regulations, ... but they sure want to butt into people's personal business.
I do understand that. I clearly stated I do not believe players should be fined or fired for their beliefs as they have every right to protest.. however, I believe there are better ways to protest than this.
Maybe, like perhaps when white restaurant owners didn't think blacks should protest by insisting on sitting at the counter in their diner when there were places for blacks to eat? Or when Rosa Parks had the audacity to sit in the front of the bus when no one else would think of doing such a thing?
"Better ways" you say? Some might argue the best way is to do something people notice and start talking about, arguing about, doing something about...
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Debauchery has become acceptable to a certain class of people today.
