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Perhaps I should insert myself into it, theres a clear shortage of minds with common sense and reasoning/logic ability in the matter, who better than me?
part of my tax $ in the past went to the big dig, even though Im certainly no fan of tassachuttets.
Id love to see the states in the north get their act together so the influx of transplants down this way would slow down (its not just about weather), but thats seriously OT for this thread.
You're paying a higher tax rate in North Carolina compared to Mass. Sure, though, we could use another brilliant mind. No doubt you're another cutting edge, publishing scientist who can school us all on the fabrication of climate science and evolution, like informed consent.
At first glance they appear to be the good guys in this conflict. If you favor Nazi ideology you might not believe what they are doing is right...
Even if you dont favor Nazi ideology you might not believe what they are doing is right. I'm pretty sure I hate neo Nazis at least as much as you. Probably more. But I believe in the constitution. I believe in the rule of law. The right to swing your fist ends at the point where my nose begins. Saying things that someone finds ugly or offensive, is not infringing on their rights. Assaulting them is.
We have laws for a reason. In this case, it is the first amendment. Free speech is the freedom that makes all other freedoms possible. The Supreme Court takes a very hard line on the first amendment. The speech has to lead to imminent danger. You yell fire in a movie theater, people panic and run for their lives and may trample people in the process. This creates an imminent danger. Symbols, flags, signs, and ugly words do not create imminent danger. The Supreme Court ruled that burning a cross on your own property is protected by the first amendment.
At some point, people have to be responsible for their own behavior. If you see a guy burning a cross on his front lawn, and you attack him, you made that decision. You weren't running for your life. You made a conscious decision to attack him because he did something that offended you.
When a neo Nazi gets beaten up for his speech, I have mixed emotions. Under most circumstances, I would be happy that a neo Nazi got beaten up. But when it is merely for the words that are coming out of his mouth, I'm saddened by the reason. And I hope the person who threw the first punch gets arrested.
This surely will get 4 pages of being quoted and turned into
Whitesupremacy groups and KKK endorse Trump
Therefore
Trump and his supporters = KKK neo Nazis
Trump literally Hitler.
And Robert Byrd apologists will poke their heads in...
Way to Rustle Jimmies thoroughly.
It never ceases to amaze me how hurt liberals are by the truth.
If you think that Trump is "literally" Hitler, then you are mentally ill and need help. That is factually incorrect. There is no truth in it at all. Trump won an election, condemned the KKK and violence on both sides, and, as demonstrated, had never said or done anything as despicable towards blacks as his opponents.
Nor have Trump supporters employed the fascist tactics of AntiFa and the media.
Really get help. This is NOT an ad hominem...you need help.
Even if you dont favor Nazi ideology you might not believe what they are doing is right. I'm pretty sure I hate neo Nazis at least as much as you. Probably more. But I believe in the constitution. I believe in the rule of law. The right to swing your fist ends at the point where my nose begins. Saying things that someone finds ugly or offensive, is not infringing on their rights. Assaulting them is.
We have laws for a reason. In this case, it is the first amendment. Free speech is the freedom that makes all other freedoms possible. The Supreme Court takes a very hard line on the first amendment. The speech has to lead to imminent danger. You yell fire in a movie theater, people panic and run for their lives and may trample people in the process. This creates an imminent danger. Symbols, flags, signs, and ugly words do not create imminent danger. The Supreme Court ruled that burning a cross on your own property is protected by the first amendment.
At some point, people have to be responsible for their own behavior. If you see a guy burning a cross on his front lawn, and you attack him, you made that decision. You weren't running for your life. You made a conscious decision to attack him because he did something that offended you.
When a neo Nazi gets beaten up for his speech, I have mixed emotions. Under most circumstances, I would be happy that a neo Nazi got beaten up. But when it is merely for the words that are coming out of his mouth, I'm saddened by the reason. And I hope the person who threw the first punch gets arrested.
Is this really that hard for you to understand?
What's paradoxical about this position and the fact that you're Jewish is that thrown punch is not close in power as speech is.
Steve Bannon On Exit: “I’ve Got My Hands Back On My Weapons”
"I feel jacked up,” Bannon told the Standard. “Now I’m free. I’ve got my hands back on my weapons. Someone said, ‘It’s Bannon the Barbarian.’ I am definitely going to crush the opposition. There’s no doubt. I built a f*cking machine at Breitbart. And now I’m about to go back, knowing what I know, and we’re about to rev that machine up. And rev it up we will do.”
But I have respect for the law. I have respect for the constitution. If everybody has respect for these things, then nobody has anything to fear. These nazis could have 10,000 new recruits, but if they cant physically harm anyone, then they are powerless. And on the flip side, if somone is allowed to take away their constitutional rights, then who is stopping someone from taking away mine one day? The Jews in Germany died because their rights were taken away from them.
Also, I truly believe that "the resistance" is responsible for more recruitment than the actual nazis. They give them so much publicity that they wouldnt normally have. If Milo spoke at Berkeley, with no violent protesters, he would have given his speech to a few likeminded people and nobody else would have heard about it, or him. It was the protesters that gave him a national spotlight. If neo Nazis start harming innocent bystanders, nobody would be defending them. They are already pariahs as it is. If they go around causing problems, they will be even more shunned. They will go to jail, and everyone will go on hating them. But they are not going to do that. They will just keep doing their little rallies, and nobody will even know about it, just as has been the case for decades past.
A lot of people on this board seem to be defending Antifa. They seem to be saying that Antifa only responds, they don't initiate the violence. Yet, from what we have seen on TV in the past, they do initiate violence. In their own words, they do initiate violence. And it hasn't been only violence on these other groups. We saw in Berkeley at the Milo speech in February how they attacked innocent bystanders just walking down the street. People who were not even protesting.
Personally, I think that the neo Nazis and the KKK are subhuman scum, but so is Antifa. You will never see me defend neo Nazi or KKK violence, so why do people on the left feel they should defend Antifa?
Can't we all agree that violence is never the answer to speech?
So, I guess YOU are suggesting that anyone being oppressed and bullied just lie down and accept their "Station in Life". It's BAD enough that LE gets away with killing unarmed folks claiming in FEAR... WHEN will people realize that the OPPRESSED will no LONGER LIE DOWN and RESPOND??
Sure as in any protest their are provocatures ... But usually.. its to make a point.. BUT when confronted by HATE FILLED TYPE like Supremacists and NEO-Nazi .. it's WELL KNOWN exactly what their GOAL IS!! KILL.. HATE and DEGRADE anyone who isn't OF them!
There by the Grace of GOD you didn't get born into different circumstances.. BUT IF YOU DID.. Just step back and think about it!!! I'd bet your'd have an entirely DIFFERENT perspective!!
See how you need to filter my words and reinterpret to fit your narrative. A lot like Trump, actually. I never said I opposed free travel. I'm asking why you feel the need to harass liberals in liberal spaces. I'm curious. WN's show up with militia uniforms, guns, weapons, etc in states they are not from to antagonize and intimidate. When people protest this your feelings get hurt and you get scared. What gives?
Really. Words on the Internet frighten you, but not guns. That sounds unhinged to me and you may be a repressive threat to yourself.
Of course there were no riots. Did she show up with weaponry and threats? No
#1 Why can't conservatives speak freely in blue states/cities? Aren't you advocating for political segregation? "Liberal spaces?" Do we really want to get politically territorial in this country?
#2 You do realize that tens of millions of right leaning people live in blue states and blue cities in this country? Should they be forced to move/travel if they wish to exercise their 1st Amendment rights?
#3 I've never protested or harassed any liberal in a "liberal space." But I'd be willing to die to protect the right of liberals to enter red areas and keep their peaceful 1st Amendment rights and vice versa. Mainstream Democrats would have agreed with me on that 20 years ago.
#4 If you are honest and you aren't - you would recognize that the antifa has shown up to peaceful political discourse to smash property and skulls. Milo was not threatening anyone, the KKK was not there, neo-Nazis were not there - antifa showed up looking for violence to silence Milo's 1st Amendment rights - how "brown shirt" of them.
But I have respect for the law. I have respect for the constitution. If everybody has respect for these things, then nobody has anything to fear. These nazis could have 10,000 new recruits, but if they cant physically harm anyone, then they are powerless. And on the flip side, if somone is allowed to take away their constitutional rights, then who is stopping someone from taking away mine one day? The Jews in Germany died because their rights were taken away from them.
I see you have respect for the law. I respect that and I do respect our constitution even though I do not think we all have a strict, shared interpretation. And I do not agree that if everybody respects these things there is nothing to fear or if they cannot physically harm someone in 1:1 combat it's all good. The war on drugs, for example, was rule of law essentially rooted in racism and it has harmed millions. Law allows for all kinds of things that are no good from environmental harm, to corporate greed at the cost of human health, to trade agreements that harm outside our boarders. None of it is cut and dry.
I also posit that our rights, to some extent, are illusory. We have these rights under certain conditions and these can be usurped in a minute. The daily evening news testifies to that easily enough. People's rights are tromped upon everyday and it's true that it may happen to you one day as well.
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