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Old 05-01-2018, 12:22 PM
 
Location: Sinking in the Great Salt Lake
13,138 posts, read 22,818,947 times
Reputation: 14116

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Winterfall8324 View Post
Political propaganda and the such. It’s become something more of a symbol of government policy towards Israel and the west.

Go to Iran, it’s not the place you imagine. Yes it has a brutal dictatorship (I’m not defending them) but Iranians and the cautious political history they carry have no plans to invade and bomb Israel.
Never been to Iran but I've been around... I imagine it's like most places where regular people just want to be able to go about their daily lives and have the chance to end life better off than where they started. Wars tend to screw that goal up.

None of us have much say in what our leaders do/don't do. I hope someday the 99% of the planet wake up and stop dancing to the ridiculous tunes of the 1%...it's OUR world too, after all and the vast majority of us want the same basic thing.
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Old 05-01-2018, 12:52 PM
 
4,668 posts, read 3,900,630 times
Reputation: 3437
Quote:
Originally Posted by Winterfall8324 View Post
Political propaganda and the such. It’s become something more of a symbol of government policy towards Israel and the west.

Go to Iran, it’s not the place you imagine. Yes it has a brutal dictatorship (I’m not defending them) but Iranians and the cautious political history they carry have no plans to invade and bomb Israel.
You went from they have the “only clean hands in the region” to a “brutal dictatorship” in only a few pages of posts. Please just put some thought into you’re posts. You obviously are just making crap up., the worst part is the only person you are brainwashing is yourself. Iran isn’t going to attack Israel, they have their puppets to do so. It’s no different then the Soviet Union using its puppets during the Cold War.
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Old 05-01-2018, 01:20 PM
 
Location: Manchester NH
15,507 posts, read 6,434,708 times
Reputation: 4831
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mattks View Post
You went from they have the “only clean hands in the region” to a “brutal dictatorship” in only a few pages of posts. Please just put some thought into you’re posts. You obviously are just making crap up., the worst part is the only person you are brainwashing is yourself. Iran isn’t going to attack Israel, they have their puppets to do so. It’s no different then the Soviet Union using its puppets during the Cold War.
Internally they are a dictatorship but in terms of external influence Iran hasn't invaded or attacked any of its neighboring states. Iran is the pacifist in the region.
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Old 05-01-2018, 01:24 PM
 
7,300 posts, read 3,398,309 times
Reputation: 4812
Quote:
Originally Posted by cebuan View Post
First, wrong forum.

Second, nobody considers the National Review to be anything other than far-right bias. Take it for what it is intended to be.
The National Review is as center Right as it gets without going completely Left. They were even anti-Trump, which puts them arguably on the Left.

Liberals think that anything to the Right of them is "far Right" and "biased", while ignoring their explicit propaganda arm that comprises most of the rest of the media.

Its very similar to Zionists calling anything that doesn't fall within their markers for acceptability to their agenda as being "anti-Semitic" instead of merely the natural opposition that exists due to conflicting political aims. It's political spin, and nothing more.

Last edited by golgi1; 05-01-2018 at 01:33 PM..
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Old 05-01-2018, 01:27 PM
 
7,300 posts, read 3,398,309 times
Reputation: 4812
Quote:
Originally Posted by nononsenseguy View Post
One can always identify the anti-Semites by their position on Israel and Netanyahu, and their sympathetic views toward Israel's enemies.
One can identify rabid Jewish ethno-nationalists by their willingness to classify anyone who pushes back against their political interests as "anti-semites".

Its code for: "either you give me what I want, even if it is counter to your interests, or you are immoral".

The world has long refused this brand of political hyper-aggressiveness from them.
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Old 05-01-2018, 01:31 PM
 
6,675 posts, read 4,279,413 times
Reputation: 8441
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ponderosa View Post
Expect Israel to engineer terror attacks on the US to blame on Iran and gin up support for war.
You have my vote for the most idiotic post on CD.
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Old 05-01-2018, 02:02 PM
 
7,300 posts, read 3,398,309 times
Reputation: 4812
Quote:
Originally Posted by Winterfall8324 View Post
Internally they are a dictatorship but in terms of external influence Iran hasn't invaded or attacked any of its neighboring states. Iran is the pacifist in the region.
Iran is going to get invaded because of what occurred a long time ago. It has zero to do with modern politics / current events. Go as far back as you can.

Israel is merely a permanent aircraft carrier in the region to make that happen. It's nothing more. However, that also tips you off to the unfortunate endgame. Iran's leadership knows all of this, which is why they will never turn West in spite of harboring one of our oldest religions in the depths of Shia Sufism.

You're here to challenge the rabid Zionist crew. I'd encourage you not to waste your time. They're just soldiers, and not very aware soldiers at that.

They're geared not to listen to your logic, nor morality, and will instead bombard you endlessly with a mixture of fact and nonsense. That's after they ignore your logic.

Their logic and morality is not your own, and they won't present all of their logic and morality here. You're essentially arguing with people who refuse to be honest as a general strategy. Like "good" soldiers. So, again, I'd encourage you to engage another outlet for your understandable frustration.

In addition, they are at least partially deluded about why Israel exists and why they have any political platform whatsoever.

Most of that has to do with Iran, though they instead see conquering Iran as a means to a tribal end. In reality, they are the means to the end.

At least you can take a little bit of solace in their eventually fatal stupidity and arrogance, borne of religious entitlement and unearned ego, that is most often unchecked by their high aggression level / emotion. I could say more but I'll leave it here. Just be done with them, and refuse to waste more of your life debating people that can't be effectively debated.
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Old 05-01-2018, 03:08 PM
 
Location: Long Island
57,313 posts, read 26,217,746 times
Reputation: 15647
Quote:
Originally Posted by Icy Tea View Post
I wasn't aware just how anti Israel CNN was. I listened to both sides. First Patriot News Channel on Sirius going on and on about how Obama was played for a dunce ( which was true and we heard all about it when it happened) but it was breaking no new ground. But they did cover Netanyahu's newly revealed information which pretty much did make that argument indisputable once again.
Then I switched over to CNN and it was like walking from the sunlight into a dark cave. They accused Netanyahu of giving false information and using information already known and how he was trying to use Trump. And they gave dire warnings about what would happen if Trump tore up the agreement which would leave Iran free to do what they were accused of already trying to do. Who needs Al Jazeera that Saudi network when CNN will defend Iran and North Korea at the expense of us and our allies?
You can believe this is new information presented by Netanyahu, maybe you also believe that he just found it before the May 12 deadline for the renewal of the Iran deal, some coincidence. I have heard this is not new information but why wasn't it important to share with the inspectors a few years ago when they were developing the agreement. Pretty incredible find by Netanyahu if this is new information, he is very lucky.
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Old 05-01-2018, 03:41 PM
 
Location: Ohio
24,621 posts, read 19,170,143 times
Reputation: 21743
Quote:
Originally Posted by spectator11040 View Post
Pure BS.

The Iranian regime works through its proxy terrorists, Hezbullah, Hamas, and Islamic Jihad, hordes of Shia forces from Pakistan to Iraq, and sometimes murders using its own agents.
The US operates the same way, and Iran actually learned all of that from the US.

Historically, groups backed by the US were called "freedom fighters" while any group opposed to the US were labeled as "communists" -- even if they weren't, until the "fall of Communism" after which time the US labeled every group it opposed as "terrorists."

Iran has every right to advance its own agenda, and if that agenda conflicts with US goals, that's just the way it goes.

You can't exactly blame Iran, since the US labeled Prime Minister Mossadeq a "communist" and tried three times to murder him -- but failed -- and instead ended up arresting and trying him in a kangaroo court.

Mossadeq's sole indiscretion?

Nationalizing While Non-White/Non-Christian.

It's perfectly okay if White Christian States like Norway or Denmark nationalize their industries, and Britain was the King of Nationalization in the 1950s, since everything in Britain save Sainsbury's -- a sort of grocery store like Kroger's which was started by Lord Sainsbury, was nationalized.

British Air, British Petroleum (BP, but now Amoco-BP), British Rail, the defense industry, the auto industry, all natural resources,....everything was owned by the British government (having controlling interest of 51% up to 100% of a company).

But, when Mossadeq tries to nationalize the oil company in Iran, the Brits throw a hissy fit and ask the US to deal with Mossadeq, which is an Act of War.

The Brits and the US had the same deal everywhere: take 92% of the profits, and then the US/British corporations would devalue their assets to avoid paying taxes, so they actually ended up with 100% of the profits.

It's this arrangement that led President Cardenas of Mexico to nationalize oil and gas operations in Mexico in 1939.

President Cardenas offered to pay the US $42 Million -- the total value of all US corporate assets seized as stated by US oil companies, but FDR refused to accept it.

Recently declassified documents show FDR wanted to invade Mexico and seize the oil and natural gas fields, but most of the Cabinet and the Generals were opposed to it, since it would have tied down US naval forces in the Atlantic Ocean and several US Army and Marine Divisions for quite a long time, and with WW II looming on the horizon, that wasn't a good idea.

Likewise, PM Mossadeq offered to pay $46 Million -- the total value of assets as stated by the oil companies -- but his offer was refused.

It didn't help that the CIA and the French DGSE trained and equipped the SAVAK, the Iranian secret police who tortured and murdered Iranians for speaking out against the Shah.

And then Carter botched the transition of government.

The Shah had already approached Ambassador Bill Sullivan to inform him he had pancreatic cancer. He told Sullivan he intended to abdicate and wanted visas for him and his family to enter the US for medical treatment.

The Shah and Sullivan both knew Khomeini would be the likely successor, so Sullivan established back-door negotiations with Khomeini, who was in Paris, France at the time. The negotiations went well, and they were close to a face-to-face meeting when the French DGSE got wind of it and leaked info about the Shah's intended abdication to supporters of Ayatollah Ruhollah -- who would become the French puppet --- at a mosque in Tabriz.

That sparked a series of demonstrations, and the idiot Carter, along with his to neo-con advisors Gary Sick and Zbigniew Brzezinski, sent General Huyser to Iran in an attempt to convince the Iranian army commanders to initiate a coup and take over the government, which of course is an Act of War.

Khomeini felt he was being played by Sullivan, thinking he would end up like Mossadeq, and it went down-hill from there.

Had Carter listened to Sullivan and Army Chief of Staff General Al Haig (who actually lived in Iran for 3 years), and both of them recommended rolling out the red carpet for Khomeini and helping him establish power, things would have turned out differently.

Of course, had the US let Mossadeq carry out his reforms, Iran would be a much more advanced State, with a more stable economy and more advanced infrastructure, and probably a secular State to boot, who would be an ally to the US, instead of an enemy.

The point of this is that if you don't like what you see, you have only the US to blame.
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Old 05-01-2018, 03:44 PM
 
Location: Ohio
24,621 posts, read 19,170,143 times
Reputation: 21743
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roboteer View Post
America and Israel gearing up for war with Iran


Iran has been building nuclear weapons and missile delivery systems; violating agreements, lying, continuing development when they said they wouldn't etc., and has been calling for the annihilation of Israel for decades.

I'd say it's Iran that's gearing up for war against Israel and the U.S., not the other way around.
Iran doesn't have a nuclear weapons program, and even if they did, their nuclear weapons aren't going to be much of a threat to the US.

Without weapons grade Plutonium, which Iran does not have, they're extremely limited in the size of the warheads they could possibly build, and even their current missiles would not be capable of mounting a 20 kt warhead.
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