Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Do the people who say the wall is a dumb idea understand there is already either a fence or a wall in about half of the border already?
Yes, mainly in California and Arizona, I believe. Note that in those areas the fencing was built mainly 'on' the border.
There is one interesting factor about building a 'wall' along the Texas-Mexico border.
As everyone knows, the Rio Grand River marks the international boundary.
Now, we cannot build a wall 'in' the river. We cannot build the wall on the Mexican side of the border.
For various reasons (which I cited in an older thread), the wall would have to be built a few miles away from the actual river (estimates vary).
Say, for sake of simplicity, the Wall is built just one mile north of the Rio Grand. It is akin to ceding that land, and river, to Mexico. Those Texas ranchers that own land along the border would be shut out from at least a mile of their land, as well as denied access to the river (which many still use for their stock).
We must recall that when Texas joined the United States in 1845, there arose a dispute with Mexico concerning the international border: we claimed the Rio Grand, Mexico claimed the border should be further north, along the Nueces river. We sent troops down south to contest the issue (including many young soldiers that would gain fame in the Civil War), and after the dust settled, the Rio Grand was the border.
Anyway, there are quite a few Texas ranchers that do not wish to cede land back to Mexico.
Central to building a wall was the M-E-X-I-C-O was going to pay for it. It was a key phrase from many of Trump's campaign rallies, complete with chants that Trump led.
The US building it first and sending Mexico a bill is not Mexico paying for it, since they will not pay it.
Taxing remissions to Mexico is not Mexico paying for it. That is taxing people here, legally or not who want to send money to Mexico. And who is to say people here don't open PayPal accounts and let people in Mexico access the account.
And this is a stupid idea:
"It's an easy decision for Mexico: make a one-time payment of $5-10 billion to ensure that $24 billion continues to flow into their country year after year."
So Trump wants to extort money from Mexico?
It assumes that Mexico will not want to shift more of their business to other growing countries, like India and China. And what of American companies, like Ford and GM for starters, that have facilities in Mexico?
Tariffs only hurt US consumers who buy the imported goods being taxed.
And this one is a beauty:
"Keep in mind, the United States has already taken in 4X more migrants than any other country on planet earth, producing lower wages and higher unemployment for our own citizens and recent migrants."
At some point in their past, almost all Americans can trace their roots to some other country. I guess it's the old "close the door after you let me in" syndrome.
There is no bait and switch. It will take time for Trump to initiate plan A to make Mexico pay for the wall. We need the funds up front to start it. Besides, would you rather pay the over $100 billion a year that illegals cost us or a $25 billion wall that has proven to be effective? Congress already approved it back in 2006 it just wasn't funded.
Taxing remittances sent out of our country should have nothing to do with whether one is a citizen or an illegal alien. It's our right to do so if we please. Mexico has been extorting us for decades but all of a sudden you're concerned about us extorting them? Turn about is fair play. We won't not be blackmailed or bullied by any tactics that Mexico chooses to implement either. They need us way more than we need them. Whatever costs are incurrent by Trump's plan to the citizens of this country it will still be well worth it.
WTH are you talking about? What does where our ancestors came from and that the fact that most came legally have to do with our right to enforce our immigration laws against illegal aliens? You don't know the difference between legal and illegal? Who's closing the door? We allow in 1 million legal immigrants a year!
Healthcare Trumps the wall any day. They should get the priorities correct. The worst part about it is his policies affect his hardcore supporters ADVERSLY more than anyone else.
If the situation was dire enough (a long shutdown) couldn't Congress end a shutdown on their own? Pass a bill without funding for the wall and override the President's veto? I mean, it would take some bipartisan actions by Congress. In this climate, this is unlikely. But you never know. If Republicans believe their jobs are on the line in November, they might be able to close the wound a little if they did reach across the aisle on something like this.
But I think they'd have to be awfully desperate.
No, because any bill they come up with ultimately has to be signed by the President. So if the president is the cause of the shutdown by vetoing spending bills, he wouldn’t sign a bill that overrides his authority. I seriously doubt he’d be the cause of a long shutdown (or any shutdown) that close to midterm elections. A long shutdown starts to affect everyone (including his supporters) from services, health, 401K savings/stock markets, etc. Although, in this climate, you never know what will happen.
Why spend 20 years fighting about a wall, when you could jail business owners who hire illegals today? What's happening with e-verify? Not one durn thing.
About all those miles of fence and walls. Federation for American Immigration Reform did a piece about how much wall and where it was located last year sometime. I'll try to find it.
Tariffs only hurt US consumers who buy the imported goods being taxed.
Does that apply as a principle? Then the tariffs and other market protectionism China employs to limit US access to their markets is a self-defeating idiotic policy on the part of the Chinese? Both China and Mexico impose, on average, more than double (almost triple) the tariffs that the US imposes. Trump is simply seeking a level playing field.
In 2016, according to the World Bank, the average applied U.S. tariff across all products was 1.61%; that was about the same as the average rate of 1.6% for the 28-nation EU, and not much higher than Japan’s 1.35%. Among other major U.S. trading partners, Canada’s average applied tariff rate was 0.85%, China’s was 3.54% and Mexico’s was 4.36%. U.S. tariffs are among lowest in world
And this doesn't even factor in the fact that US exports are assessed an average 15% VAT while the US imposes no such tax on imports. This isn't something that can be resolved with tariffs but it is something to consider in trade agreements. https://www.huffingtonpost.com/ian-f..._12242314.html
No, because any bill they come up with ultimately has to be signed by the President. So if the president is the cause of the shutdown by vetoing spending bills, he wouldn’t sign a bill that overrides his authority.
He wouldn't have to sign it. That's my point. Congress can overturn a presidential veto with a two-thirds vote. Whether they'd be desperate enough to do it is another story.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
