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Why doesn't the USA follow its own laws and that of the treaties it AGREED to. You know, like real democracies abiding by the rule of law.
Asylum seekers can be detained, but NOT separated from their children.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2sleepy
You know what I think is ridiculous? Trumpbots struggling to justify separating asylum seekers from their children. There is no way to justify it..none at all. This is a disgusting inhumane policy and is going to cost Republicans dearly in November if they don't grow a set and speak out against this.
I have no idea what a trumpbot is.
There's a key piece of information we're missing here. You guys keep stating that they are asylum seekers, therefore they cannot be considered illegals anymore. You guys are saying once they show up at the border and say the words "I am an asylum seeker" they are safe! (Which is asinine by the way if it's true "But the treaty!"). Sessions says parents will be separated from children for people entering illegally, which is normal for anyone being arrested for breaking the law. The parents are being arrested and their children are being separated. Nobody is saying separating parents and children is a great thing, it's just that happens when the parents break the law... since forever (2sleepy you worked in jail, how many children did you see incarcerated with their parents? Why be so obtuse about this?). You guys and the MSM are crying foul because #mustresisttrump.
So we can conclude that:
A. That's not how the process works, they can't show up at the border, shout "asylum" and you're safe. They then choose to break the law and so on, it's the very first line of the vox article.
B. They truly have to be recognized as asylum seekers because of a treaty (but the treaties!) and BP is separating them anyway and breaking some treaty rules (the treaty!). If this was truly the case then I agree that's messed up
but It leads me to ask...
Why hasn't anyone stopped them? A judge seemed to reinstate daca at the snap of a finger. A judge can't stop DOJ/BP citing the treaty(!)?
And by the way, this is not how it's being reported, the vox article says right in the first line "... entering illegally". Vox recognizes they entered illegally, but you guys keep shouting "the treaty!".
There's a key piece of information we're missing here. You guys keep stating that they are asylum seekers, therefore they cannot be considered illegals anymore. You guys are saying once they show up at the border and say the words "I am an asylum seeker" they are safe! (Which is asinine by the way if it's true "But the treaty!"). Sessions says parents will be separated from children for people entering illegally, which is normal for anyone being arrested for breaking the law. The parents are being arrested and their children are being separated. Nobody is saying separating parents and children is a great thing, it's just that happens when the parents break the law... since forever (2sleepy you worked in jail, how many children did you see incarcerated with their parents? Why be so obtuse about this?). You guys and the MSM are crying foul because #mustresisttrump.
So we can conclude that:
A. That's not how the process works, they can't show up at the border, shout "asylum" and you're safe. They then choose to break the law and so on, it's the very first line of the vox article.
B. They truly have to be recognized as asylum seekers because of a treaty (but the treaties!) and BP is separating them anyway and breaking some treaty rules (the treaty!). If this was truly the case then I agree that's messed up
but It leads me to ask...
Why hasn't anyone stopped them? A judge seemed to reinstate daca at the snap of a finger. A judge can't stop DOJ/BP citing the treaty(!)?
And by the way, this is not how it's being reported, the vox article says right in the first line "... entering illegally". Vox recognizes they entered illegally, but you guys keep shouting "the treaty!".
"Following World War II, most nations in the world agreed to offer asylum to victims of persecution in order to prevent any repetition of the tragic fate of Jewish refugees caught up in the Nazi Holocaust. In 1951, the United Nations adopted the Convention Relating to the Status of Refugees. This international treaty defined a refugee as someone with "a well-founded fear of being persecuted for reasons of race, religion, nationality, membership of a particular social group or political opinion." According to the agreement (signed by the United States and codified in U.S. law in 1980), qualified refugees who can reach a "safe country" have the right to be given shelter and granted asylum in that country." BRIA 10 2 c Seeking Asylum in the U.S. - Constitutional Rights Foundation
There's a key piece of information we're missing here. You guys keep stating that they are asylum seekers, therefore they cannot be considered illegals anymore. You guys are saying once they show up at the border and say the words "I am an asylum seeker" they are safe! (Which is asinine by the way if it's true "But the treaty!"). Sessions says parents will be separated from children for people entering illegally, which is normal for anyone being arrested for breaking the law. The parents are being arrested and their children are being separated. Nobody is saying separating parents and children is a great thing, it's just that happens when the parents break the law... since forever (2sleepy you worked in jail, how many children did you see incarcerated with their parents? Why be so obtuse about this?). You guys and the MSM are crying foul because #mustresisttrump.
So we can conclude that:
A. That's not how the process works, they can't show up at the border, shout "asylum" and you're safe. They then choose to break the law and so on, it's the very first line of the vox article.
B. They truly have to be recognized as asylum seekers because of a treaty (but the treaties!) and BP is separating them anyway and breaking some treaty rules (the treaty!). If this was truly the case then I agree that's messed up
but It leads me to ask...
Why hasn't anyone stopped them? A judge seemed to reinstate daca at the snap of a finger. A judge can't stop DOJ/BP citing the treaty(!)?
And by the way, this is not how it's being reported, the vox article says right in the first line "... entering illegally". Vox recognizes they entered illegally, but you guys keep shouting "the treaty!".
One of the problems with the previous system was that it was catch and release with an appearance date, but they didn't show up for the appearance date. Will the children be held until the parent(s) show up for the court appearance? What if they don't care about the children and still don't show up?
Are the children being schooled, taught lessons and educated at the detention center?
1500 boys aged 10-17 is a lot of children to let sit idle or play games during normal school hours.
Where are the girls and children under the age of 10?
Asylum Procedures may take 4 to 5 years to finish the cases.
If application is denied two separate appeals may be filed adding
an additional 5 to 7 years.Some cases have been pending for 10-12
years while clients remained in the U.S. legally with families often with work permits.
The figure estimates are from ORR Office of Refuge Resettlement.
The figures are only estimates as refugees access welfare and other government assistance programs.
The cost per refugee to the American Taxpayer is $79,600 per year for the first 5 years after resettlement.
In 2016 $545 million spent on resettlement, $140,389,177 transportation costs, $867 billion spent on welfare alone'
Fact: 54% of all refugees will hold jobs paying less than $11 an hour for the first 5 years.
Fact: $71 million will be spent on educating refugees and asylum seekers,
Fact: Over 5 years 15.7% of all refugees will need housing assistance.
Fact: Costs do not include national security,law enforcement expenditures associated with refugees that pose a threat
vetting,screening,criminal justice costs,homeland security to states,and local agencies can not be quantified.
In Final:
The United States averages 100,000 immigrants per year. It cost money which the U.S. can not sustain over a prolonged period of time to
acclimate refugees to become productive members of society. It is sad to see people being turned away from our borders when the focus should be on those miserable countries which is forcing them to leave. The United States has always and will always help those in need but it will not cut off its nose to spite its face. There will come a time when Enough is Enough! People need to realize this. Would you be willing to give up your Social Security and Medicare, pay higher taxes on your home which you worked so hard and long to buy because the government needs more money to help those in need? It is an obligation to help those in need as our humanity dictates but one will only sacrifice up until it affects him/her. Then it stops. It's only human Nature.
Like the old saying goes Charity starts in the home first.
US only takes in 100,000 immigrants a year? Canada takes in an average 300,000. I know your number are way off. In fact the number of legal immigrants to the USA is around 1 million a year. If you took in the same ratio as Canada, you would be closer to 3 million. No wonder all those illegals are needed in your job market.
Both Canada and the USA need immigrants. You know why?
Because the citizens that live in the respective countries don't procreate enough to feed the economy. Immigrants are a good thing, and everyone wins.
Another Message for Donald Trump from Former Mexican President Vicente Fox
Even in this comedy sketch, Former Mexican President Vincente Fox character thinks that America is the care giver of the world.
Instead of building a wall you can be supplying drinking water and end world hunger.....Ughhhhh Yeah ?
But what about your country? Mexico is considered a newly industrialized country,a regional power,an emerging market as
its presence in major economic groups such as the G8+ and the G-20 major economies. Why don't you use your own money instead
of mocking the U.S. to use theirs ? Some Hollywood Libertard probably put this funny but pointless video together.
I assume you're talking to me. I pay more taxes in the USA than I do back home. And I don't get to vote. Plus you only let me stay for 6 months, but that's OK, because you can only stay 6 months in my country.
Oh, my country?
We're better known for our hockey sticks than tacos.
Another Message for Donald Trump from Former Mexican President Vicente Fox
Even in this comedy sketch, Former Mexican President Vincente Fox character thinks that America is the care giver of the world :
Instead of building a wall you can be supplying drinking water and end world hunger
But what about your country? Mexico is considered a newly industrialized country, a regional power, an emerging market as its presence in major economic groups such as the G8+ and the G-20 major economies. Why don't you use your own money instead of mocking the U.S. to use theirs?
Quote:
Originally Posted by normstad
I assume you're talking to me. I pay more taxes in the USA than I do back home. And I don't get to vote. Plus you only let me stay for 6 months, but that's OK, because you can only stay 6 months in my country.
Oh, my country?
We're better known for our hockey sticks than tacos.
Looks like Con Artist versus G7
Hockey sticks versus Mexican food?
Canada needs to build THE WALL !
Those who are arguing that it's cruel to separate the child from their parents and labeling USA as evil when these Illegals cross the border illegally is appalling.
If the child is being separated from their parent from a LEGAL immigrant and Citizens, THEN, you might have an argument. HOWEVER, these Illegals are crossing KNOWING and FOREWARNED that they will be separated should they try to cross ILLEGALLY. Even WITH the knowledge, they STILL try to cross ILLEGALLY.
So, the blame should be 100% on the Illegal parent border crosser. THEY are putting THEIR children in this awful torture. It's REALLY simple. Don't want to get seperated, DON'T CROSS the border ILLEGALLY, PERIOD.
Also, these kids that are in detention camps are being treated even BETTER then our homeless. They are being sheltered, fed and a given activities to do. Way MORE then what we should provide at taxpayers dollars. When we can use that same resources to help our own.
Those who are arguing that it's cruel to separate the child from their parents and labeling USA as evil when these Illegals cross the border illegally is appalling.
If the child is being separated from their parent from a LEGAL immigrant and Citizens, THEN, you might have an argument. HOWEVER, these Illegals are crossing KNOWING and FOREWARNED that they will be separated should they try to cross ILLEGALLY. Even WITH the knowledge, they STILL try to cross ILLEGALLY.
So, the blame should be 100% on the Illegal parent border crosser. THEY are putting THEIR children in this awful torture. It's REALLY simple. Don't want to get seperated, DON'T CROSS the border ILLEGALLY, PERIOD.
Also, these kids that are in detention camps are being treated even BETTER then our homeless. They are being sheltered, fed and a given activities to do. Way MORE then what we should provide at taxpayers dollars. When we can use that same resources to help our own.
We know that 1500 sons/boys between the ages of 10 and 17 have been detained for months by the USA government in what has been described by reporters as a detention center with covered up windows. The detained children are allowed 2 hours of fresh air per day, and otherwise seem to be left to their own devices. Reporters have not commented on whether the detained children are educated, but footage of the detention center suggests otherwise. They are indoctrinated with wall murals depicting USA propaganda, similar to Cuba. Trump is quoted as saying 'lose the battle, win the war'.
Are the parents detained? If so, where are they? ... maybe not ... overstuffed incarceration facilities et al
Perhaps the parents, children under the age of 10, and girls under the age of 18 are not detained? If so, why are the boys detained?
Is this because some males attempted to enter the country without parents, yet they were under the age of 18? That would certainly put their identity and country of origin in question. If there was even one case where a family took a stray child under their arms and offered to try to pass him off as a natural child, that would justify rounding up all males between the ages of 10 and 17 to separate real children from strays trying to enter the country with no real documentation.
"Following World War II, most nations in the world agreed to offer asylum to victims of persecution in order to prevent any repetition of the tragic fate of Jewish refugees caught up in the Nazi Holocaust. In 1951, the United Nations adopted the Convention Relating to the Status of Refugees. This international treaty defined a refugee as someone with "a well-founded fear of being persecuted for reasons of race, religion, nationality, membership of a particular social group or political opinion." According to the agreement (signed by the United States and codified in U.S. law in 1980), qualified refugees who can reach a "safe country" have the right to be given shelter and granted asylum in that country." BRIA 10 2 c Seeking Asylum in the U.S. - Constitutional Rights Foundation
So we should let everyone in the world in that say they want Asylum. What a bunch of fools
So we should let everyone in the world in that say they want Asylum. What a bunch of fools
No one is suggesting that everyone should behave as fools and allow all males who claim to be under the age of 18 to cross the border. It is known that males who claim to be under the age of 18 were travelling alone and were detained at the Texas Youth Male immigrant Detention Center.
I think it's reasonable to be cautious, especially since it is known that terrorists may have entered the EU as single males claiming to be youths, and stories about foreign 'youths' swarming local teenage girls.
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