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Status:
"Let this year be over..."
(set 25 days ago)
Location: Where my bills arrive
19,219 posts, read 17,102,322 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by katzpaw
Following the 2018 hurricane, and response and events that followed, would you support statehood for Puerto Rico.
I think it's time, based on principles, despite a likely increase in smuggling and refugees in PR.
The majority of (voting) Puerto Ricans support statehood, and at 3 million population it's larger than 21 states.
As I have always understood it the island residents vote every so many year(s) to either become a state, become an independent country or keep things as they are. They continue to remain in their current state so why the current push to statehood?
Following the 2018 hurricane, and response and events that followed, would you support statehood for Puerto Rico.
I think it's time, based on principles, despite a likely increase in smuggling and refugees in PR.
The majority of (voting) Puerto Ricans support statehood, and at 3 million population it's larger than 21 states.
your problem is that you don't understand Puerto Rico's politics and their people. The Statehood movement was NEVER a majority in the island. They don't want to become a state because they don't want to lose their culture and identity, they want to remain a Commonwealth. That is not my view but the view of many on the island. I was born and raised there so I should know.
of all the referendums done on statehood on the island since 1967, Statehood was rejected by the majority in the island. It would never pass the statehood act even if Congress gives the green light, this is American Civics 101:
These are the actual results of all the referendums done on the island. These are not polls or opinions but the actual will of the people in the island:
1967: remain a Commonwealth 60% Statehood 39%
1993: remain a Commonwealth 49% Statehood 46% Full Independence 5% (54% vs 46%)
1998: Protest the referendum 50.5% Statehood 46.6% Independence/Free Association 3% (53.4% vs 46.6%)
2017: Statehood got 97.18% (502,801 votes) but 77% of the voters (electorate) stayed home to protest the referendum. That means over 2 million voters stayed home and didn't vote for statehood.
502,801 votes for statehood vs over 2 million voters that protested the statehood referendum.
Numbers don't lie. You can't make a territory a state when the majority don't want to take the oath of statehood and pledge allegiance to the U.S. Flag.
Poll is pretty much as I thought and shows how the Republican party is split between those who are decent and those who are....well, maybe more authoritarian, racist or otherwise NIMBY.
Democrats tend to be fairly certain about such things. PR residents are citizens. They are taxpayers. They are part of our trade system and we have military facilities there.
Much of the financial situation was caused or exacerbated by the U.S.
lies.....I was born and raised there. Most of the financial situation was a Puerto Rican government that grew the local government too big for decades, couldn't control spending and is very corrupt.
For every 3 employees you have in Puerto Rico, 1 is a government employee. that means 2 employees in the private sector has to pay the salary, benefits, and retirement of that 1 government employee. See the problem with that ratio in taxes and borrowing? The Puerto Rican government instead of cutting the size of government and cut spending they kept borrowing and raising taxes and passing the buck to the next administration.
I saw this in the '80s but they kept doing the same thing to win elections and stay in power.
Numbers don't lie. You can't make a territory a state when the majority don't want to take the oath of statehood and pledge allegiance to the U.S. Flag.
I suspect the numbers have changed in the past year.
Perhaps I should have been more specific - would you support statehood if the majority of Puerto Ricans did?
I would support them no matter if they wanted to become a state or to become independent.
And...who's to blame for that? Why are you trying to make a racist thing out of this, we aren't forcing them to say no when deciding to become a state / independent.
good grief, some people aren't happy unless they can play the race card.
Yup.
Anytime they decide they want in, I'm good with it. Am also good with it if they decide they'd rather continue to be a territory, or if they want to choose the Philippine option and go it alone.
I have no idea what the issues are from their point of view, but I don't need to, it's not my call.
I will say that the official US action - or rather lack of it - following the hurricane was shameful. If PR had been a state, would it have been different? Dunno, but it was clear that plenty of Americans didn't realize that Puerto Ricans are US citizens.
Poll is pretty much as I thought and shows how the Republican party is split between those who are decent and those who are....well, maybe more authoritarian, racist or otherwise NIMBY.
Democrats tend to be fairly certain about such things. PR residents are citizens. They are taxpayers. They are part of our trade system and we have military facilities there.
What could possibly be a reason not to?
Because you have over 50% in the island that rejects statehood.
You know that the U.S. imposed U.S. Citizenship on them by force in 1917 without a democratic referendum?
are they racist for rejecting statehood? this is how silly LIBERALS are and throw the racism card on anything.
Most Puerto Ricans view themselves as Puerto Ricans above being Americans. The majority don't call themselves Americans or waive the American Flag....that should be a reason for pause before pushing statehood on a nation of people that reject it.
and by the way, Puerto Ricans on the island don't pay FEDERAL INCOME TAX....try again!
2017: Statehood got 97.18% (502,801 votes) but 77% of the voters (electorate) stayed home to protest the referendum. That means over 2 million voters stayed home and didn't vote for statehood.
502,801 votes for statehood vs over 2 million voters that protested the statehood referendum.
Numbers don't lie. You can't make a territory a state when the majority don't want to take the oath of statehood and pledge allegiance to the U.S. Flag.
Numbers don't lie but people do.....
So what you are saying is that Trump is not President because tens of millions protested by staying home?
Or, is what you are saying that 97% VOTED FOR STATEHOOD.
Or, is what you are saying is that if a fair vote...a vote that was binding....was taken with no strings attached (that is, statehood granted like any and every other state) that it would fail??
That last one is a reach. I think it would pass. More want statehood than any other option....so if the question was put "statehood or not" it would almost certainly pass.
But I agree. Let them vote - a very simply up or down. No special colony wording, no 3rd or 4th options or confusing questions.
Yes or No. I am quite certain what the result would be.
I suspect the numbers have changed in the past year.
Perhaps I should have been more specific - would you support statehood if the majority of Puerto Ricans did?
it depends on the conditions of statehood.....with statehood comes responsbilities and the Puerto Rican people have to accept but being born in the island and raised there, there is a large % that will always reject it. That's just the way it is.
Let them have a referendum of STATEHOOD YES or NO (no other options) and the NO will win. I will bet you money because I know the politics in the island.
PR has voted on state hood before. They do not want it. End of story.
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