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Old Today, 12:29 PM
 
Location: East of Seattle since 1992, originally from SF Bay Area
30,375 posts, read 55,329,142 times
Reputation: 32049

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Quote:
Originally Posted by MPowering1 View Post
Fines are meant to punish bad behavior and prevent that bad behavior in the future.

But fines only benefit the government. A fund-raising effort without the cookies.
Yes, but it's not like the state/county/city is making a profit. The fines help defray the cost of investigation and enforcement, and help pay for other government services. Having scofflaws that can afford to pay their fines (rather than go to jail) actually helps us law-abiding citizens. In our state, for example, we have $124 fines for tickets given to people using a cellphone while driving. The money goes to:


$44.78 to state public safety and education
$44.43 to the city or county where the ticket was given, for police/court/prosecution
$17 for the court computer records system maintenance
$10 into an auto theft prevention fund
$5 for a hospital emergency medical account to help people with no insurance
$2 to a traumatic brain injury account
$0.79 to the city or county to help crime victims
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Old Today, 12:30 PM
 
Location: Haiku
4,724 posts, read 2,747,720 times
Reputation: 6922
Quote:
Originally Posted by miquel_westano View Post
I am aware of that, but the question is who benefits? Not the victim. I am sure the taxpayer never sees a tax break due to these fines. Obviously not the advertisers who paid money for illegally attained information. Not the local businessmen/women who's area these kids were marketed away from.

I am curious if anyone can actually point to a beneficiary of these fines beyond some untraceable deposit in the bowels of the federal government. Where does this money go, and what good comes of the fine?
Public companies care very much about their image as that affects their relationship with their customers and their partners. When a public company gets fined for something it affects their image. The bigger the fine, the more their image is impacted since the public equates size of fine with seriousness of the offense.

If enough of these things keep piling up, Congress or the FTC (which enforces anti-trust laws) will start to take notice and may take additional actions. So while the fines themselves don't particularly affect the company directly, the indirect effects can be huge.

As far as the victims, you are right. They are forgotten in this whole chain.
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Old Today, 12:41 PM
 
Location: Middle of the ocean
32,515 posts, read 20,473,973 times
Reputation: 46919
Quote:
Originally Posted by No_Recess View Post
No. In my experience most speeding tickets are issued to those who just like to speed.

I'm not attacking your explanation of the system. You're absolutely correct...on paper. I'm just pointing out that it's only correct on paper because the government and corporations such as Google are one in the same.

The funneling of money back and forth is a big shell game to give the illusion that the government works for us peasants, the corporations are 100% capitalist, and nobody is above the law. You don't have to be an anarchist like myself to fully see this and admit to it.

Remember when Sammy got JP Morgan for $135 million last Christmas for "improperly handling" ADRs?

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...the%20practice.

That's like fining me $3 for speeding and no other ramifications like points on my license.

If we look like we're independent and we announce these fines and you make public adjustments to show you've learned the lesson the gravy train keeps going.

And for us slaves? Scraps.

JP Morgan's closing statement on the case I cited...



C'mon people.

Lather, rinse, repeat


And I'm not arguing with you that the system is corrupt, you are absolutely correct. I'm a huge proponent of trying to take the money out of politics by removing lobbying and campaign donations, among other things. It'll never happen, but a girl can dream.
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Old Today, 12:42 PM
 
Location: SM
25,801 posts, read 9,968,127 times
Reputation: 9950
Quote:
Originally Posted by miquel_westano View Post
Then they should be more than 1000th of a corporations revenue. What does a small fine like that do to a mega corporation like FB or Google? To me it just sends a message they can do what they want.
Well, that's your problem for paying attention.

Signed,

Your government



But the fine amount isn't even a big deal. I don't want you guys to focus on it.

The fines only make it as far back as the government (and not the people) who then in turn give these same corporations subsidies and allow their lawyers to write the laws/regulations going forward. It's only a game of illusion.

Remember the 2008 recession? Too big to fail ring a bell?

Do you think the government is going to allow Google or Chase go out of business? Do you think Google or Chase are going to allow the government to give favor to their competitors (of which they have none thanks to that very same government)?

Do you think Chase or Google want a truly capitalist society? That's the result of no government.

Do you think the government want's a truly capitalist society? That's the result of no corporations.

Window dressing. An illusion. A magic act.

Just like all of government in a nutshell.
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Old Today, 12:43 PM
 
11,928 posts, read 8,615,892 times
Reputation: 7281
Quote:
Originally Posted by No_Recess View Post
The government and Google are one in the same.

Fines are just an agreed-upon kickback in the circle jerk. It gives the illusion to us peasants that the government is independent of commerce, we have capitalism, and no one is above the law.

Newsflash: the government is commerce, we live under socialism, and the law only applies to those who wish to fight the government/corporate thrown. You do that last thing...you'll find out real quick who the law applies to and who it doesn't.
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Old Today, 12:44 PM
 
Location: SM
25,801 posts, read 9,968,127 times
Reputation: 9950
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hemlock140 View Post
Yes, but it's not like the state/county/city is making a profit. The fines help defray the cost of investigation and enforcement, and help pay for other government services. Having scofflaws that can afford to pay their fines (rather than go to jail) actually helps us law-abiding citizens. In our state, for example, we have $124 fines for tickets given to people using a cellphone while driving. The money goes to:


$44.78 to state public safety and education
$44.43 to the city or county where the ticket was given, for police/court/prosecution
$17 for the court computer records system maintenance
$10 into an auto theft prevention fund
$5 for a hospital emergency medical account to help people with no insurance
$2 to a traumatic brain injury account
$0.79 to the city or county to help crime victims
Wow, $124 is all it takes to fine a person for a non-crime.

C'mon statists. At least raise your standards.
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Old Today, 12:47 PM
 
Location: SM
25,801 posts, read 9,968,127 times
Reputation: 9950
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikala43 View Post
And I'm not arguing with you that the system is corrupt, you are absolutely correct. I'm a huge proponent of trying to take the money out of politics by removing lobbying and campaign donations, among other things. It'll never happen, but a girl can dream.
That's one hard way to "get clean". I admire your determination.

I prefer not accepting the filth in the first place but to each his/her own.

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Old Today, 12:56 PM
 
Location: Suburb of Chicago
21,537 posts, read 10,380,345 times
Reputation: 20651
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hemlock140 View Post
Yes, but it's not like the state/county/city is making a profit. The fines help defray the cost of investigation and enforcement, and help pay for other government services. Having scofflaws that can afford to pay their fines (rather than go to jail) actually helps us law-abiding citizens. In our state, for example, we have $124 fines for tickets given to people using a cellphone while driving. The money goes to:


$44.78 to state public safety and education
$44.43 to the city or county where the ticket was given, for police/court/prosecution
$17 for the court computer records system maintenance
$10 into an auto theft prevention fund
$5 for a hospital emergency medical account to help people with no insurance
$2 to a traumatic brain injury account
$0.79 to the city or county to help crime victims
Investigation and enforcement? Can you imagine how many tickets the traffic cops in Chicago write in the course of one day? They're not investigating anything. And it's easy to find people who aren't following the law, because the cops are well aware of the scams pulled on the public.

For example, the yellow stripe on the curb indicating a fire hydrant is present. People who park in those spots in in front of and behind a hydrant are constantly getting ticketed because the law clearly states you have to be X number of feet from the hydrant and drivers assume the yellow paint on the curb properly reflects that footage. It doesn't - it's short on both sides, deceiving the driver.

I don't know what the breakdown is on our tickets - but my eyebrows would certainly be raised if the breakdown was similar to yours.
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Old Today, 01:07 PM
 
Location: SM
25,801 posts, read 9,968,127 times
Reputation: 9950
Quote:
Originally Posted by TwoByFour View Post
Public companies care very much about their image as that affects their relationship with their customers and their partners. When a public company gets fined for something it affects their image. The bigger the fine, the more their image is impacted since the public equates size of fine with seriousness of the offense.
Oh lord.

A true believer.

Well, the schools work I suppose.

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Old Today, 01:11 PM
 
Location: SM
25,801 posts, read 9,968,127 times
Reputation: 9950
Quote:
Originally Posted by MPowering1 View Post
Investigation and enforcement? Can you imagine how many tickets the traffic cops in Chicago write in the course of one day? They're not investigating anything. And it's easy to find people who aren't following the law, because the cops are well aware of the scams pulled on the public.

For example, the yellow stripe on the curb indicating a fire hydrant is present. People who park in those spots in in front of and behind a hydrant are constantly getting ticketed because the law clearly states you have to be X number of feet from the hydrant and drivers assume the yellow paint on the curb properly reflects that footage. It doesn't - it's short on both sides, deceiving the driver.

I don't know what the breakdown is on our tickets - but my eyebrows would certainly be raised if the breakdown was similar to yours.
Check your homicide clearance rates against ticket revenues.

Yeah, it's a scene boys and girls.
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