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Old 05-20-2023, 07:34 AM
 
5,743 posts, read 3,615,364 times
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Americans expect leave to go about their affairs, WITHOUT the burden of proof of innocence. Unless there is probable cause to suspect a crime.

Sometimes we don't like that presumption, and settled law even precludes, but is still the right.

A checkpoint stops all drivers, demand DL, insurance, tax receipts. DL? Violation of rights. The same as cops goinginto a hospital and demanding to see everybody's license to practice medicine.

A BG check demands proof of innocence, when there is no reasonabe suspicion of a crime about to happen.

Last edited by arr430; 05-20-2023 at 07:44 AM..
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Old 05-20-2023, 09:36 AM
 
Location: Wisco Disco
2,158 posts, read 1,218,608 times
Reputation: 3035
Quote:
Originally Posted by GreggT View Post
You mean like gang members selling to another member or a Felon buying from another thug?
Make this requiring a background check, I'm sure they will comply!
The part you don't understand is that the likelihood of there being THAT ^ gun at play would e much smaller. Every gun starts out legal, then at some point it might slip into undocumented territory. Like stolen ( not the topic here) or transferred in an undocumented fashion. Stop that and then there is no gun availability. Having the transfer subject to documentation puts the current owner on the spot to make sure it goes down that way. Then he has skin in the game. Right now he is the weal link and the 'law abiding citizen' who is flooding the undocumented market. All that will end when he is eligible for sitting felony time and losing HIS OWN gun rights. Where do you think undocumented guns would come from if UBC came about?
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Old 05-20-2023, 09:40 AM
 
Location: Wisco Disco
2,158 posts, read 1,218,608 times
Reputation: 3035
Quote:
Originally Posted by arr430 View Post
Americans expect leave to go about their affairs, WITHOUT the burden of proof of innocence. Unless there is probable cause to suspect a crime.

Sometimes we don't like that presumption, and settled law even precludes, but is still the right.

A checkpoint stops all drivers, demand DL, insurance, tax receipts. DL? Violation of rights. The same as cops goinginto a hospital and demanding to see everybody's license to practice medicine.

A BG check demands proof of innocence, when there is no reasonabe suspicion of a crime about to happen.
Clueless much? 'proof of innocence'??? Absurd. It is exactly as stated. A check to see if you are on record as having issues that would preclude you from ownership. Person being checked does not have to prove anything nor even participate. If you do get kicked aside with a flag then you can challenge that. Your argument is non sequitur.

Why do so many so called 'law abiding citizens' fear the check?
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Old 05-20-2023, 11:17 AM
 
Location: Texas Hill Country
23,652 posts, read 14,038,285 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by manapplet View Post
.......why do so many so called 'law abiding citizens' fear the check?
because we fear a government that has such control over us!
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Old 05-20-2023, 11:23 AM
 
Location: Louisiana
9,143 posts, read 5,813,710 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ManApplet View Post
Very simple part of the overall solution. For every transaction. Why would law abiding citizens be opposed to this?
I posted this question several times in a similar thread...still no answer.

Quote:
I keep asking, but no one will answer...
Other than underage people who stole the weapon, can you name
the last "mass shooter" who did not pass a background check?
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Old 05-20-2023, 11:35 AM
 
Location: On the Chesapeake
45,475 posts, read 60,707,289 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Speleothem View Post
I posted this question several times in a similar thread...still no answer.
Mass shooters are a small fraction of the shootings that happen daily in major cities. Just yesterday in DC there were seven with two fatalities.

The perpetrators of those very likely (almost 100%) didn't go through a NICS check.


Do you think these two did?
https://thebaynet.com/officers-recov...crack-cocaine/

Or this guy?
https://smnewsnet.com/archives/52023...regional-park/
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Old 05-20-2023, 11:47 AM
 
Location: Louisiana
9,143 posts, read 5,813,710 times
Reputation: 7711
Quote:
Originally Posted by North Beach Person View Post
Mass shooters are a small fraction of the shootings that happen daily in major cities. Just yesterday in DC there were seven with two fatalities.

The perpetrators of those very likely (almost 100%) didn't go through a NICS check.


Do you think these two did?
https://thebaynet.com/officers-recov...crack-cocaine/

Or this guy?
https://smnewsnet.com/archives/52023...regional-park/
How did they obtain the weapons and would a new law have prevented it?
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Old 05-20-2023, 11:51 AM
 
Location: On the Chesapeake
45,475 posts, read 60,707,289 times
Reputation: 61100
Quote:
Originally Posted by Speleothem View Post
How did they obtain the weapons and would a new law have prevented it?
I have no clue.

That's the problem, every "new law" is supposed to prevent it but never does. Just like the new ones in Maryland I referenced earlier.

A novel idea is to start enforcing the laws already on the books pertaining to felons in possession (mandatory sentence) and straw purchases.
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Old 05-20-2023, 12:03 PM
 
Location: Wisco Disco
2,158 posts, read 1,218,608 times
Reputation: 3035
Default Your non sequitur is showing

Quote:
Originally Posted by TamaraSavannah View Post
because we fear a government that has such control over us!
Nah. There is no control involved in this. And the current owner already went through the process to acquire it.

Follow the money. Law abiding citizens (LAC) for some strange reason do not want criminals on the street buying guns without background checks to have to go through them like the LAC themselves had to in the first place to obtain the gun.

This doesn't seem odd to you? Those folks ( subset of LAC ) are the target group for UBC.

But they want a market to sell their guns. Because they are front men or simply knowingly selling to those who would not lawfully qualify. Why would any LAC not want to put an end to that?

Simple greed. i.e. You buy a gun and shoot the barrel out ( or something) but can still flip it on the street for good $ while no sane person who could legally buy a new one would touch your junk. And you are willing to have society suffer the collateral damage for your small financial benefit. Free use of guns loophole for the immoral.
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Old 05-20-2023, 12:09 PM
 
24,026 posts, read 15,125,430 times
Reputation: 12974
I'm not telling a soul about grand daddy's 22, or Big Daddy's shotgun or any of the other long guns in the closet. It's none of their business.

There are far too many legally registered weapons killing people.

Texas has the NG on the border. Meanwhile the fools in Austin permitted a Chinese criminal gang in NYC to steal the IDs of 5000 Asian American Texans. Then didn't notify the victims.

What's to stop hackers from getting the registered gun owners. Then stealing the guns?

Texas is so inept at securing their own drivers license website from an organized criminal gang. What's to stop the gun thieves?
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