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Old 12-18-2009, 02:19 PM
 
Location: Irvine, CA to Keller, TX
4,829 posts, read 6,933,064 times
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I can't believe I agree with MoveOn.org.

WASHINGTON – The liberal group MoveOn.org is opposing the Senate health care bill and urging Democrats to block it.

In a letter to members Friday, MoveOn.org complained that the legislation has no government-run insurance option and no expansion of Medicare.
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Old 12-18-2009, 02:38 PM
 
971 posts, read 1,295,195 times
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Originally Posted by Soccersupporter View Post
I can't believe I agree with MoveOn.org.

WASHINGTON – The liberal group MoveOn.org is opposing the Senate health care bill and urging Democrats to block it.

In a letter to members Friday, MoveOn.org complained that the legislation has no government-run insurance option and no expansion of Medicare.
You might agree, but probably for different reasons. I'm a liberal very much opposed to this bill - I want a single payer system, not this piece of trash plan they're gonna pass.
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Old 12-18-2009, 02:43 PM
 
Location: Irvine, CA to Keller, TX
4,829 posts, read 6,933,064 times
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Originally Posted by denverkid View Post
You might agree, but probably for different reasons. I'm a liberal very much opposed to this bill - I want a single payer system, not this piece of trash plan they're gonna pass.
So what if they pass it now and all the things Keith Obermann, MoveOn.org, and others are saying comes true?
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Old 12-18-2009, 02:56 PM
 
2,229 posts, read 1,687,719 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Soccersupporter View Post
I can't believe I agree with MoveOn.org.

WASHINGTON – The liberal group MoveOn.org is opposing the Senate health care bill and urging Democrats to block it.

In a letter to members Friday, MoveOn.org complained that the legislation has no government-run insurance option and no expansion of Medicare.
You agree with them voting to reject it, but look at the reason why.

Blah, when are these die-hard government option people going to realize that the majority of Americans don't agree with them. Remember, we live in a representative republic, thus your politicans are only going to vote for things that they think their constituents support.

These people care nothing about the majority rule, and will push so hard for their fringe beliefs, they are going to push the liberals and their agendas out of Washington.
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Old 12-18-2009, 03:05 PM
 
971 posts, read 1,295,195 times
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Originally Posted by jcarlilesiu View Post
You agree with them voting to reject it, but look at the reason why.

Blah, when are these die-hard government option people going to realize that the majority of Americans don't agree with them. Remember, we live in a representative republic, thus your politicans are only going to vote for things that they think their constituents support.

These people care nothing about the majority rule, and will push so hard for their fringe beliefs, they are going to push the liberals and their agendas out of Washington.
Every poll on the issue I've seen (dozens over the last year or so) shows that a majority of Americans support a public option.

If the congress needed just a majority vote, then the public option would already by law.
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Old 12-18-2009, 03:06 PM
 
Location: Wisconsin
37,981 posts, read 22,167,958 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Soccersupporter View Post
I can't believe I agree with MoveOn.org.

WASHINGTON – The liberal group MoveOn.org is opposing the Senate health care bill and urging Democrats to block it.

In a letter to members Friday, MoveOn.org complained that the legislation has no government-run insurance option and no expansion of Medicare.
They just oppose anything that is not a complete takeover of health care by the federal government.

People like those in MoveOn seem to think the nameless faces in government have all the answers and need to be in charge of a federally run universal healthcare program, even though they have no clue who those people in government might be, what their agendas are, or what their qualifications may be, in ten or twenty years, they just trust them anyway.

Anyone who considers themselves a part of MoveOn or KOS want to disagree with me on this?
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Old 12-18-2009, 03:12 PM
 
971 posts, read 1,295,195 times
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Originally Posted by Wapasha View Post
They just oppose anything that is not a complete takeover of health care by the federal government.

People like those in MoveOn seem to think the nameless faces in government have all the answers and need to be in charge of a federally run universal healthcare program, even though they have no clue who those people, their agendas, or the qualifications may be in ten or twenty years, they just trust them anyway.

Anyone who considers themselves a part of MoveOn or KOS want to disagree with me on this?
Haha. Nationalized heath insurance (single-payer) is not the same as government-run, nationalized health care. Do you conflate the two out of ignorance or dishonesty?

No one is proposing a complete nationalized health care system. Even the proposals for the "public option" are just that - an option (well, Bernie Sander's proposal might be for a strict single-payer system - I'm not sure, I didn't read it).
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Old 12-18-2009, 03:17 PM
 
Location: Wisconsin
37,981 posts, read 22,167,958 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by denverkid View Post
Every poll on the issue I've seen (dozens over the last year or so) shows that a majority of Americans support a public option.

If the congress needed just a majority vote, then the public option would already by law.
NBC poll: Plurality opposes public option - First Read - msnbc.com
Poll: Floridians oppose public option for healthcare - Florida - MiamiHerald.com (http://www.miamiherald.com/news/florida/story/1308703.html - broken link)
National (US) Poll * October 8, 2009 * American Voters Oppose Obama H - Quinnipiac University – Hamden, Connecticut
Poll: Majority opposed to Democratic healthcare reform efforts
Big Government » Blog Archive » Exclusive Poll of Likely Voters: Strong Opposition to Health Reform Plans
Opposition to Obama's Health-Reform Plan Is High, but Easing - washingtonpost.com

Maybe not "every poll on the issue".
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Old 12-18-2009, 03:22 PM
 
Location: Wisconsin
37,981 posts, read 22,167,958 times
Reputation: 13811
Quote:
Originally Posted by denverkid View Post
Haha. Nationalized heath insurance (single-payer) is not the same as government-run, nationalized health care. Do you conflate the two out of ignorance or dishonesty?

No one is proposing a complete nationalized health care system. Even the proposals for the "public option" are just that - an option (well, Bernie Sander's proposal might be for a strict single-payer system - I'm not sure, I didn't read it).
"No one" is a big statement.

I can find video clips of 0bama and prominent democrats who not only want a federally run single payer health care system, but think that the "public option" is the first, best step in achieving it. I'm against it because I seriously doubt the greedy, special interest, lobbyist loving, do-anything-to-get-reelected politicians could run a universal healthcare system without running our health care system, and us, into the ground.
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Old 12-18-2009, 03:36 PM
 
27,624 posts, read 21,136,796 times
Reputation: 11095
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Originally Posted by denverkid View Post
Every poll on the issue I've seen (dozens over the last year or so) shows that a majority of Americans support a public option.

If the congress needed just a majority vote, then the public option would already by law.
Herein lies the problem. If the majority of the American people are in favor of a public option or single payer, why aren't their representatives listening and voting for their constituencies demands? The reason is that they would prefer to lose support of the public by way of votes than the $$$$ that the corporations are showering them with. This is insane and until we have campaign finance reform, we will never again have a true democracy. You do not call a nation a democracy if the corporations are making the decisions as opposed to the people...you call it Corporate Fascism and that is where we are now.
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