So Diversity is Going Well For Portland huh? (Troutdale, Detroit: insurance, crimes)

[Deezus]

Originally Posted by Minervah

The East side is simply more accessible in terms of getting around than the hilly West side of town. Teens can get around more easily. The East side is more heavily populated with more opportunity for crime but in these case this crime was done by a bunch of teens who can be out of control in any neighborhood. I wonder as the West side gets more built up if it too will see an increase in its crime rate.

I thought the old comparisons of "East side: Bad; West side: Good" rivalry went out in the 80's. Nobody does that anymore.

There's a huge range of neighborhoods on the Eastside. I mean it's not that far from the old mansions of Alameda Ridge to a place like Cully(and both aren't that far from a trendy area like Alberta).

The old classifications of what places used to be like though is slowly going out the door. I live like 10 blocks east of 82nd on the edge of Montavilla and Mt. Tabor and houses go from upper-middle class homes to lower rent apartments in a few blocks. Montavilla up to 82nd is slowly changing as a lot of young couples priced out of inner SE buy up homes in the area. Though even 82nd is changing with Asians opening more and more restaurants and groceries.

That being said, Brentwood-Darlington has some shabbier areas.

[ccjarider]

Originally Posted by FSF

Who ever claimed that Portland was all that diverse? If anything, I think most people recognize its lack of diversity. Furthermore, I'm not sure what this has to do with bearing arms. It's a ridiculous proposition that everyone should start carrying around guns in case they get into a scuffle of some sort. I GUARANTEE you the murder rate would would increase exponentially under such a scenario. Why is it strange just because the African American population is only 6.3% and that these crimes were committed by people of that race? With all due respect, there's nothing about your post that makes any sense or seems remotely rational.

I think you're wrong with your "Wild West scenario." People have the right to carry firearms in Portland and Oregon now and have for years. I do not see the huge murder rate increase you fear.

To the contrary, across the nation violent crime has been trending down as firearm restrictions have decreased. I am not sure the two pieces of data correlate - but it is an observation.

While controversial, there are articles stating that crime decrease is due to several generations of abortions in the black community. There is an argument put forethe that abortion has decreased the number of young black men (14-28) who typically have performed a large volume of urban crime in this country.

[Minervah]

Originally Posted by Deezus

There's a huge range of neighborhoods on the Eastside. I mean it's not that far from the old mansions of Alameda Ridge to a place like Cully(and both aren't that far from a trendy area like Alberta).

The old classifications of what places used to be like though is slowly going out the door. I live like 10 blocks east of 82nd on the edge of Montavilla and Mt. Tabor and houses go from upper-middle class homes to lower rent apartments in a few blocks. Montavilla up to 82nd is slowly changing as a lot of young couples priced out of inner SE buy up homes in the area. Though even 82nd is changing with Asians opening more and more restaurants and groceries.

That being said, Brentwood-Darlington has some shabbier areas.

Just as my area close-in SE was bought up by young couples who couldn't afford more expensive homes in the more affluent parts of the SE parts of town. During the early part of the 80's when I lived along Bvrtn Hlsdl Hwy it was rumored to be a pretty high trafficking drug area. It certainly didn't fit the stereotype in appearance but then again, she had lived there for a long time so I think she knew what she was talking about. I never saw it but my landlady cautioned be to be careful at night especially and neighbors warned me to be sure to lock my doors because the apartment complexes there were pretty fair game for burglaries.

The point is, neighborhoods do change and things are not always what they seem.

[pdxMIKEpdx]

That being said, Brentwood-Darlington has some shabbier areas.

That area is also slowly being "gentrified".

Funny, we old uns used to say that "the neighborhood is getting a little better these days".
Now there's a word for it!

Imagine that.

[FSF]

Originally Posted by ccjarider

I think you're wrong with your "Wild West scenario." People have the right to carry firearms in Portland and Oregon now and have for years. I do not see the huge murder rate increase you fear.

To the contrary, across the nation violent crime has been trending down as firearm restrictions have decreased. I am not sure the two pieces of data correlate - but it is an observation.

While controversial, there are articles stating that crime decrease is due to several generations of abortions in the black community. There is an argument put forethe that abortion has decreased the number of young black men (14-28) who typically have performed a large volume of urban crime in this country.

That people have a right to carry doesn't mean that they do. No one can know for sure, but I'm comfortable that a very tiny fraction of people carry around loaded firearms. The fact is, if the majority of people carried around guns, it wouldn't take a genius to figure out that MANY MANY more murders would occur. People are emotional. And if they have ready access to a weapon, a person could self rationalize in a hysterical moment the need to use such a weapon for even seemingly benign occurrences like cheating partners or cases of being bullied, even without being physically harmed, or even because they felt "threatened" by a panhandling homeless person.

As for your casual observations of cause and effect, there are so many points of data that one can pull from that I could easily state that the decrease in crime is all due to more Asian Indians immigrating to this country and because Ghandi was their role model, that they are showing Americans the way to be more peaceful. I mean, the "two pieces of data correlate", right? There are infinite observations and data combinations we can derive to make conclusions about the reasons why something is happening. I find that "articles" are usually written by those with an agenda, and a formulated conclusion, and that they generally cling to "data" that correlates with, and only with, their preconceived beliefs.

[pdxMIKEpdx]

That people have a right to carry doesn't mean that they do. No one can know
for sure, but I'm comfortable that a very tiny fraction of people carry around
loaded firearms. The fact is, if the majority of people carried around guns, it
wouldn't take a genius to figure out that MANY MANY more murders would occur.
People are emotional. And if they have ready access to a weapon, a person could
self rationalize in a hysterical moment the need to use such a weapon for even
seemingly benign occurrences like cheating partners or cases of being bullied,
even without being physically harmed, or even because they felt "threatened" by
a panhandling homeless person.

The problem with the above is that you never know who is carrying and who is not.
And you can't judge a book buy it's cover.

You are making an assumption (which may be true) that most people don't carry, but you never know who is, what kind of training they have, etc....it's still an assumption. You maybe surrounded by concealed weapon carriers (legal and otherwise) and you would not ever know it.

It's not like they have to wear a sticker on their forehead to ID themselves if they carry a concealed weapon.

[RunTheDistance476]

Wow, I'm not shocked at all at the very Northwest attitudes I got in this thread. No one believes people should be allowed guns to protect themselves and of course, even though every single person seen in the video who was out there was black, the black people had nothing at all to do with it.

My point is this:

People always complain that the PNW is soo white and needs more diversity because there aren't any African Americans in this area. Even with that statement being true, somehow the small percentage of African Americans still manage to commit a significant amount of both Seattle and Portland crime. Its sad really, just like national average, way above their proportion of the population.

Also, there was a woman who was being dragged out of her car screaming for help. These kids just didn't hit two guys and throw rocks at one, they were trying to cause some serious damage, dont make excuses for them, that's ignorant.

Another point is that this is why we need to keep out right to bear arms, because sometimes we you get ganged up on, you can't fight your way out and or protect your own family.

Banning guns wont mean the gangbangers wont have them anymore, it just means the innocent civilians wont have a way to protect themselves.

[skiffrace]

A bunch of graduating middle schoolers threw a unsupervised party that got way out of control...Those kids probably came from all over Portland using our excellent public transportation system.

Really? I see it quite differently. Off the top of my head, a few similar incidents, all within last year or less.
Any of these would not make the news in Detroit, but people move to Portland NOT to see this type of crime.

Laurelhurst mob attacks:
Portland police shorten hours at Laurelhurst Park after reports of group of teen boys attacking others | OregonLive.com

Lloyd Center flash mob attack:
Police arrest 2 in Lloyd Center flash mob theft | kgw.com Portland

Albertson flash mob attack:
Police: Group of teens 'flash robbed' grocery store | Local & Regional | KATU.com - Portland News, Sports, Traffic Weather and Breaking News - Portland, Oregon

This could have happened anywhere in Portland, not just the east side.

You mean theoretically?
Well, theoretically, the entropy can spontaneously decrease, and the broken glass self-repair. But it never happens in practice.

[Steve Pickering]

Originally Posted by wlw2009

... ... This is exactly why we need the right to bear arms in this country. ... ...

I mean, as the citizens of Portland, how do you think you should be allowed to defend yourselves in this situation? (Be careful, though, or you'll be on a murder trial for shooting someone who is beating your brains out.)

A little extreme to say the lest, and it was Man not Men, and Two not Hundreds.

I carry 24/7. Always have and always will. But I would never consider a punch in the face justification for taking a human life.

Now, if I attempted to defend my self with like force and the situation became one where I was in fear of my life, I would use what force was necessary up to, and including, deadly force. I would not turn it into a case of Mutual Combat either.

Also a weapon should never be used as a threat, either to prevent an attack, or to scare someone. If you must use it do so, but otherwise it remains out of sight.

Oh, and incase you forgot ... We already have the right to bear arms in this country.


I just can't figure out what an inflammatory post like this has to do with Diversity, or Relocation?

You do understand this is a relocation forum and not a chat room or a place to rant, right?

[pdxMIKEpdx]

Steve, somebody wants to "experiment" and see what happens when voicing their racist and pro gun agendas in the Portland forum.

Wow, I'm not shocked at all at the very Northwest attitudes I got in this
thread. No one believes people should be allowed guns to protect themselves and
of course, even though every single person seen in the video who was out there
was black, the black people had nothing at all to do with it.

Please do us the courtesy of listing the numbers of the posts in this thread where everybody says guns are bad and where it's said that "black people" had nothing to do with it...
Thank you.
You must be getting this thread confused with another.

Typical PNW attitudes......................Sheesh.

You mean theoretically?

Well of course I mean it theoretically.
I heard nobody gets robbed, burgled, shot, raped, conned, assaulted, or anything else on the west side of the Willamette River.
I see that lack of west side crime in the news everyday.