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I don't want to generalize because I know some women don't fall in line with my theory, but I beleive most women want what they had growing up or better than they had growing up, and if they don't think a man can provide that just based off of thier initial instinct of a guy then they totally cut that guy off from any opportunities. Either that or they have been brainwashed into wanting what society has told them success is when looking for a man. By that I mean the media, and the feminist movement have played a big part in defining what women should want, and I think it has destroyed thier views on what a man is supposed to be. What do you think?
I don't want to generalize because I know some women don't fall in line with my theory, but I beleive most women want what they had growing up or better than they had growing up, and if they don't think a man can provide that just based off of thier initial instinct of a guy then they totally cut that guy off from any opportunities. Either that or they have been brainwashed into wanting what society has told them success is when looking for a man. By that I mean the media, and the feminist movement have played a big part in defining what women should want, and I think it has destroyed thier views on what a man is supposed to be. What do you think?
So you get an inclination that if a guy cannot provide that social upward mobility, then a woman deems him less desirable/inadequate?
There could be some truth to this, but depends on the person's individual values. True hardcore feminists don't view men as subordinates, but as their equal. So maybe the ability for women to be more independent and lead more self-sufficient lifestyles have caused some women to not want to be with men for very conventional reasons?
My intuitive guess is, there are various reasons for why we are attracted to people we love in our lives, and a lot of it stems from unconscious unfinished business from our pasts, whether or not those earliest memories were positive or negative, we want to better ourselves as individuals, and we do so by breaking the cycle and hoping to find someone we see eye-to-eye with so we can become 'whole' as human beings. Not everyone relishes on the materialistic lifestyle as everyone is assumed to be 'chasing after.' We desire our basic needs at a certain level, but humans aren't cut and dry and selfish as the media/society portrays us to be.
Depends on a person's level of insight, values, background, and what they see important is to them. If you look for someone who shares cookie-cutter values, then you will get a cookie cutter person to spend your life with. Some people like that Truman Show lifestyle. Some don't. It's matter of what works for you, and what doesn't. So maybe you go with what your initial impression is, and if it serves to work for you for whatever reason, then that's something to explore and work through with that special someone you end up in a relationship with. No black and white, right or wrong answers, here. G'luck!
I think most people want their equal, or someone 'better' than they are.
I do find it interesting that you mention 'feminism' has destroyed what women expect, but the same guys complaining about feminism are usually the ones complaining that women expect them to provide and support them. Wasn't that men's role before feminism? So, now a woman is terrible for expecting a man to provide for her when that was the 'man's role' all along?
I guess I'm just confused on what a man's 'supposed' to be. Would you care to explain it to me?
I don't want to generalize because I know some women don't fall in line with my theory, but I beleive most women want what they had growing up or better than they had growing up, and if they don't think a man can provide that just based off of thier initial instinct of a guy then they totally cut that guy off from any opportunities. Either that or they have been brainwashed into wanting what society has told them success is when looking for a man.
You could also say the same thing about men and their expectations of women, too.
Quote:
Originally Posted by RazorRob305
By that I mean the media, and the feminist movement have played a big part in defining what women should want, and I think it has destroyed thier views on what a man is supposed to be. What do you think?
The feminist movement did play a big role in defining what women today want. But it didn't destroy women's views of men as much as it destroyed men's views of women. After the Great Depression, two world wars and a police action, women had been pretty much left to fend for themselves economically for decades. And they managed quite well on their own, certainly better than men though they would. First-wave feminism was just the philosophical exploration and formulation of that experience: if women didn't need men to bring money into the household, what else didn't they need men for? And out of that exploration, women's expectations of men have changed dramatically from the "he brings home bacon, she cooks it" model of pre-WW1 America.
The media's role in this has been market enforcement rather than deliberate propaganda; the media has catered to feminism because feminism reflected changes in economic power already underway in the greater society, and media companies saw more revenue by backing those changes, creating a positive feedback loop. The same has been true of internet and social media in the past ten years.
Lots of men have accepted the changes that feminism brought; men age 40 and younger have grown up in first- and second-wave feminism, so for them, feminism has been The Status Quo. But a large segment of Baby Boomer men have doubled down on the pre-WW1 model, and some younger men have attached onto their more conservative view. And it's that view--that the pre-WW1 model must be better simpliciter--that is being destroyed. And as the Baby Boomer segment declines in economic resources and power, the pre-WW1 model they espose will decline as well, and appeal to a smaller, more radical set.
I don't want to generalize because I know some women don't fall in line with my theory, but I beleive most women want what they had growing up or better than they had growing up, and if they don't think a man can provide that just based off of thier initial instinct of a guy then they totally cut that guy off from any opportunities. Either that or they have been brainwashed into wanting what society has told them success is when looking for a man. By that I mean the media, and the feminist movement have played a big part in defining what women should want, and I think it has destroyed thier views on what a man is supposed to be. What do you think?
I want what I had growing up or better, so I work my a** off to get it. I dont rely on anyone but myself.
I think most women know exactly the type of man they want and they keep looking for that man and don't settle for less if they are smart. Obviously not all women do this but in my opinion the women who are secure with themselves don't rely on anyone but themselves to take care of them and their choice of men is equal to them and their personalities balance them as a couple.
I do not think we can paint all women with a broad brush like that.
I am not sure it was the OP's intent, but the theory makes it sound like the majority of women are materially/financially greedy in seeking men, and insisting that the man they find be able to provide them with a higher social status/class than they have enjoyed growing up.
Although I would say that most Americans strive to do better, and want to be as financially stable and secure as possible, I do not think this is a totally accurate portrayal.
Basically, men or women, I think, would prefer someone who is responsible financially, with a strong work ethic. It shows the person's character, which I suspect is more important to actual current material or financial wealth. (Example, a hard worker, who is not independently wealthy, may appear as a more attractive catch than someone with a bank account, who is lazy and has a feeling of entitlement).
If you change the word "women" to the word "people," and the word "man" to "potential mate," and "feminist movement" to "culture," your post is on the way to making sense.
I think most people want their equal, or someone 'better' than they are.
I do find it interesting that you mention 'feminism' has destroyed what women expect, but the same guys complaining about feminism are usually the ones complaining that women expect them to provide and support them. Wasn't that men's role before feminism? So, now a woman is terrible for expecting a man to provide for her when that was the 'man's role' all along?
I guess I'm just confused on what a man's 'supposed' to be. Would you care to explain it to me?
You're not the only one. Men are facing a real confusion in their lives: They are being told conflicting information about who they're supposed to be. They have no real role models, so a vast majority of men become hyper-masculine without any form of maturity. They define themselves through their wealth, or abs, or number of women slept with. They live at home with their parents until they're 30, 35 or older. Men are often absentee father figures, with only television providing any kind of role model and that only providing a twisted funhouse mirror reflection of what being a man should be.
Women are told they can be anything, do anything. They are outstripping males in going to university in nearly every university in North America and the United Kingdom. Males are living in a perpetual adolescence.
Someone needs to define what it means to be a man again, and that message has to get out there. Too many men are confused and have turned into whiny, intractable, ignorant children masquerading their sneaking suspicion that they don't know what it means to be a man with hyper-masculinity.
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