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Ok, back from visiting her. Had a great time. Lot of cuddles, almost constantly. She didn't sleep with her "boyfriend" at all either nights. I really wonder what this guy is thinking. He comes to his girlfriend's house, hangs out in her room without interacting with her, sleeps in her bed without sharing it with her, she instead sleeps with her Internet "friend" who has her listed as his girlfriend on Facebook... It's weird.
Anyway, as for the move I promised myself I'd make, her body language wasn't receptive to kissing... even though we literally cuddled for HOURS AND HOURS each day, both in bed and beyond it. She never outright rejected a kiss, but at the same time, it was clear that she wasn't having it. It really seems that she's into this thing just as much as me, and there's no way she didn't realize that I was "trying" to kiss her practically the weekend. And at no point did she seem annoyed at me for all the nuzzling and pecking I pulled off while cuddling. I didn't bring the topic up because that would be a really awkward conversation, but I think the only roadblock here is her casual relationship... that's apparently just serious enough for her to put the brakes on anything physical with me beyond cuddling.
However, at the same time, she went out of her way to hide how close we were being whenever there was a chance of this guy finding out. I thought she was being open with him before and he was OK with it, but she's definitely hiding it... and doing a pretty poor job of it, I might add. There's no way this guy doesn't know SOMETHING is going on, although I suppose his imagination would probably be a lot more extreme than the reality. Either way, they're apparently not even fighting about this problem. He might be cheating on her, she's having an emotional affair; and neither wants to fight about it? Honestly, I wouldn't be surprised if he was really just using her because her house is a lot closer to his work than his actual home.
Anyone got any tips on getting her to actually go through with breaking up with this guy like she said before? I'd like to avoid an ultimatum, but I feel like that might be exactly what I need to do if this doesn't get resolved pretty quickly. "I need to be more than friends or I need to pull back and spend less time with you." I'm definitely not going to be able to keep things up at this rate for much longer. It's rough feeling this close to this girl, sharing that physical intimacy of cuddling, but then not being able to kiss her when I want to. I definitely need to either take a step forward or a step back before long, but I don't want to actually SAY THAT to her.
I've been planning for a few months now that I'll be going up to her neck of the woods this weekend as well for a convention. While I was there, she kindly pointed out that I'd be leaving her place on Monday and coming back on Thursday. There are only two days in between. Two. The first words I got from her upon arriving home were "i miss uuuuuuuuu". The plan is to spend just two days apart and she's giving me this message before I even get home, and yet at the same time doesn't want me to kiss her on the lips. Anyway, I got in to work and discovered that I ACTUALLY had requested Wednesday off in addition to Thursday. When I told her this, she immediately flew into trying to plan herself a way to come down here for a few days starting on Wednesday before going driving back up there this weekend for the convention that starts on Friday. I don't think it'll happen, but it's nice to know that she wants to.
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who would want a relationship with this type of woman who goes around cuddling in bed with other men while having a boyfriend?
She's not serious with this guy. She wasn't like this at all when she was serious with her SERIOUS boyfriend before (you know, the one she was with for YEARS who had been cheating on her the whole time). If this works out into being a boyfriend/girlfriend kind of thing for she and me, I would just be sure that we're serious enough that she wouldn't do that kind of thing. I'm not worried about that.
Not my idea of how you act in an opposite sex friendship.
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Originally Posted by Time2Improve
Why are you cuddling in the first place? She's not your gf or wife!
Lots of people do - nothing wrong with this. The issue for me would solely be if the people engaged in it feel the need to hide it - lie about it - or do it in secret. If so then likely someone is crossing established boundries within another relationship - and THIS is a bad thing.
However there are many of us out there who openly and honestly have friends and even relatives where the relationship is significantly more tactile than others. There is no written requirement that a cuddler or cuddlee has to be an official gf or wife.
Communication - as ever - is the main key - and if people can not get that part right they are going to end up in some confused and unusual places.
I'd be interested in an elaboration if you don't mind. Am I delusional for thinking that she's as interested as I am in her? That she really intends to end it with her guy? That I ever had a chance? That she wouldn't screw around behind my back like she is with this emotionally distant dude who wouldn't even give her a hug?
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By all means, carry on wasting you're time
Even if I never get the relationship upgrade, this is still my best friend. I don't think I'd ever classify time spent with her as a waste.
Maybe you mean I'm wasting my time by not looking at other girls? Because I totally am. Not a lot of prospects in my social circle, but I'm doing the OKCupid thing. And that's all I would be doing right now if she wasn't in my life at all.
In the moment, if I'm not in an entirely sober, awake mind, I realize I might try to kiss too, but I realize that that wouldn't be a good idea. That is NOT something that I want to happen.
I am not lying to myself. I do not want to be her boyfriend, and I'm not looking for sex either. Kissing would probably feel pretty good, but I think that would be the thing that would open the door to jealousy and really awful emotional bullcrap that comes with romantic attachment. And I don't want that even a little bit.
The best way to avoid doing what you "don't want" to do is to stay sober. And if you truly care about the girl, don't toy with her. Cuddling may have a completely different effect on her than it does on you.
The best way to avoid doing what you "don't want" to do is to stay sober. And if you truly care about the girl, don't toy with her. Cuddling may have a completely different effect on her than it does on you.
That was a long time ago, we've moved past that. I think that the cuddling was always having the same effect on her that it did on me.
Now I DO want to kiss her. I want that kind of relationship. I think that she does too. Today, she told me a story about something that happened 2+ weeks ago wherein she admitted to crushing on me. We've only gotten closer and closer since then.
And this weekend we're going to a convention together. Actually, not even this weekend, I'll be seeing her again on Thursday. We have a hotel room for the convention and she's excited to drink alone in the hotel room on Friday. I'm excited too.
Still in the hotel where the convention is. Last night we each had one can of cider and ended up making out a bit. I asked her why she didn't want to kiss me and she said she was "scared" and even tried friendzoning me while we were tightly embracing about to kiss. But it happened. Feels good, man.
We haven't had much alone time to talk about what this means going forward, but I'm optimistic.
I met this girl on the Internet a few years ago. I had a crush on her almost right away, but chose to not act on it at all due to the large distance between us. I live in southeast Michigan, she was near Toronto. I didn't think I would ever see her in person, so I decided she'd just be a friend. Not long after this however, we met in real life on a road trip with a bunch of other friends. One of these mutual friends and this girl had already decided they were dating before meeting in person. The girl knew I had a crush on her at the time, but she was always super cool about it.
Some time after this, she and her boyfriend coincidentally both moved to the area where I lived. The boyfriend moved from Kansas to get near the border to have a relationship with her, while she moved to Windsor for university. So I hung out with them frequently. This girl was seriously devoted to this guy, and seeing this helped me get over the crush. I was able to honestly be just friends with her without any issue. In fact, she helped me a lot when I had another unrequited crush on her roommate, which I was eventually able to kick. I've never had a lot of friends, and she came to be my best friend.
After a while, I found myself a girlfriend in another social circle. I ended up spending all of my time with this girlfriend. I barely saw my Internet friends anymore. At some point, the girl and her boyfriend broke up. He had done some awful things. She moved back to her parents' house, far away.
However, this girl still loves this guy who cheated on her with her best friend and committed various unspeakable acts. Recently, she thought they might be able to get back together, but instead the guy dicked her around. He had gotten a new girlfriend, and he did it the same weekend when he knew she was planning on visiting to try to reconcile. But she still loves him, even if she's angry at him. I think that if he called her up, gave a lipservice apology, and asked to get back together, she'd love to do it.
So, I was with my girlfriend for some time and I basically lost touch with these people. I had no idea all of the terrible things had happened until very recently. Prior to learning what was going on with them, my own relationship had turned sour and I ended it just before this Internet girl was coming back to town for that visit. And spending time with her recently reminded me of how important she is to me, how stupid I was to ignore her all that time. My emotions are a little confusing, but I want to say that I have a strong platonic love for her. However, I also have been feeling attracted to her as well lately, something that hasn't really been a problem since I first got over the crush ages ago.
During her visit, she stayed at another mutual friend's house, and I crashed there as well a few nights. A lot of marijuana was involved. However, due to cramped sleeping arrangements, we ended up sleeping in the same bed together two times. The thing is: in my intoxicated state, I ended up spooning her, cuddling her all night as we slept.
Now, I loved it. I haven't felt so great cuddling someone in ages. Remember that my own relationship had turned bad before I recently ended it, so it's been a while since I felt so good spooning someone. She didn't say anything about it though, whether positive or negative. However, she did willingly get in bed with me the second night and didn't say anything when I cozied myself up against her as we were falling asleep. An implicit acknowledgment, I guess.
The thing is that I'm not looking to make her my girlfriend, she's already "seeing" someone anyway, and I don't really want to have sex with her either. I love her, I care about her a lot, but you could say that I'm not IN love with her. I'm physically attracted to her, and I think she knows that now. I'd really like to snuggle up with her some more too. I mentioned as such to her, asking that she doesn't share my cuddling indiscretion with the guy she's seeing because I wouldn't want my best friend's semi-boyfriend to hate me (even though she obviously doesn't consider it to be remotely serious with this guy), and she indicated she'd be keeping it a secret but didn't really say much else. She didn't say if she liked it or didn't like it, and although I said that I wanted to do it again, she didn't say whether or not she wanted to. Oh wait, she did say one thing: she thinks the guy she's seeing wouldn't even mind that her friend who is a male spooned her all night when she was out-of-town. She thinks that he wouldn't mind because she says he's open to polyamory, but yet she emphatically said she had already decided to keep the cuddling a secret. Incidentally, I am NOT on board with polyamory, and although I don't know EXACTLY what her stance on it is, she, like me, is apparently completely OK with what we've done so far.
The last few days, she keeps suggesting I go visit her at her parents' house since I've been talking a lot about how bored and lonely I am since my breakup. She's bored too, probably because her best friend back home is no longer a friend after having cheated with her boyfriend before. I get the feeling that her current somewhat-boyfriend is the only one she hangs out with over there. She says that she wants to drink with me since we didn't get the opportunity when she was in town recently. I want to go visit her, and I might be able to this weekend. I think that her implicitly allowing me to spoon her that second night before is a sign that she'd be OK with doing so again, but I was just looking for a little outside insight. I don't think she's ever expressed an attraction toward me at all, and this case of us cuddling together while sleeping is the closest thing to it. Her body language during also suggests that she definitely was a willing participant in both cases. However, when we met in person for the very first time before, she was willing to share a bed with me due to limited bedding, so although I never touched her that time, she might just be REALLY open about sleeping situations.
If I visit her and we do cuddle together, I also think there is a good chance that I might escalate once I get there in the moment. I'm not trying to have sex with her, become her boyfriend, or even ruin her semi-relationship with whoever it is she's "seeing", but I think it's pretty likely I might try to kiss her if I'm intoxicated and we cuddle. Now, I do want to get intoxicated with her (it's always been one of our shared interests!) and I want to cuddle her, but I think kissing might be too much. Not only do I think she wouldn't be OK with that due to her semi-relationship if nothing else, but I feel like it might open the emotional floodgates on me, and I don't want to open that whole can of worms while I'm still dealing with a little emotional fallout from my recently-ended relationship.
Sorry if my story/thoughts are a little rambly, so to wrap it up: I had a crush on this girl, got over my crush, she's never expressed any attraction toward me, she broke up with her boyfriend she still loves and I broke up with my girlfriend, we cuddled together and nothing else, I want to cuddle again but I am not really looking for anything else other than keeping her as my best friend. I guess ultimately my question is if this is all really weird, what she might be thinking but not voicing, and how should I handle this?
No, and no again. She might be up for anything with anyone she is under the influence with, for all you know. But you're hoping. It should not take all of that, and quite honestly, you should want her sober. Nothing good could come out of the situation.
Something good already has come this. At least for now.
And we kissed sober a few times since then when we could steal a few moments away from our friends who are sharing the hotel room. Sober is good, but we've always shared this hobby. I don't see the problem and I don't see why you would try to remove all of our agency due to intoxication. As if being intoxicated made you want to cuddle and make out with ANYONE.
Something good already has come this. At least for now.
And we kissed sober a few times since then when we could steal a few moments away from our friends who are sharing the hotel room. Sober is good, but we've always shared this hobby. I don't see the problem and I don't see why you would try to remove all of our agency due to intoxication. As if being intoxicated made you want to cuddle and make out with ANYONE.
Because your agent is clouding your senses. But hey, whatever floats your boat.
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