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"And in hell he lifted up his eyes, being in torments, and saw Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom. And he cried and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me and send Lazarus so that he may dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue, for I am tormented in this flame."
(Luke 16:23-24)
"The Son of Man shall send out His angels, and they shall gather out of His kingdom all things that offend, and those who do iniquity, and shall cast them into a furnace of fire. There shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth."
(Mat 13:41-42)
"So it shall be at the end of the world. The angels shall come out and separate the wicked from among the just, and shall cast them into the furnace of fire. There shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth."
Mat 13:49-50
"Then he will say to those on his left, 'Away from me, you that are under God's curse! Away to the eternal fire which has been prepared for the Devil and his angels!"
"These, then, will be sent off to eternal punishment, but the righteous will go to eternal life."
(Mat 25:41 & 46)
"And if your foot offends you, cut it off. It is better for you to enter into life lame than to have two feet to be cast into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched where their conscience dies not, and the fire is not quenched."
(Mark 9:45-46)
"And in hell he lifted up his eyes, being in torments, and saw Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom. And he cried and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me and send Lazarus so that he may dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue, for I am tormented in this flame."
(Luke 16:23-24)
"The Son of Man shall send out His angels, and they shall gather out of His kingdom all things that offend, and those who do iniquity, and shall cast them into a furnace of fire. There shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth."
(Mat 13:41-42)
"So it shall be at the end of the world. The angels shall come out and separate the wicked from among the just, and shall cast them into the furnace of fire. There shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth."
Mat 13:49-50
"Then he will say to those on his left, 'Away from me, you that are under God's curse! Away to the eternal fire which has been prepared for the Devil and his angels!"
"These, then, will be sent off to eternal punishment, but the righteous will go to eternal life."
(Mat 25:41 & 46)
"And if your foot offends you, cut it off. It is better for you to enter into life lame than to have two feet to be cast into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched where their conscience dies not, and the fire is not quenched."
(Mark 9:45-46)
RESPONSE:
>>How Can Folks Read The New Testament And Claim Hell Isn't Flames <<
By taking it as the allegorical work of men, not the word of God. If you have evidence to the contrary, please present it.
Hint: "I can't help but believe..." isn't evidence.
>>How Can Folks Read The New Testament And Claim Hell Isn't Flames <<
By taking it as the allegorical work of men, not the word of God. If you have evidence to the contrary, please present it.
Hint: "I can't help but believe..." isn't evidence.
Hey...you're preaching to the choir. I don't believe any of it. After billions of hell fire and damnation sermons preached across a thousand years many Christians have begun to deny a burning hell. When I was a youngster Baptist preachers had to preach one involving hell about once every five weeks...ten a year. Now the word is seldom used and most preachers steer clear of it all the time. The point is that the scripture is still there except in a few very modern translations where they purposfully omit any mention of eternal flames.
In my opinion the church has decided that since public opinion about eternal flames as a punishment has lost any popularity they will drop it. They did the same thing concerning witchcraft, infant baptism, slavery, women's rights etc. All the scripture which was used to support those ideas is still there but never mentioned. Evidently if the gross take on Sunday morning begins to fall off they try to get to the bottom of the cause and modify accordingly. If I were to prophesy a little here I'd bet homosexuality is the next thing to be taken off the preacher's agenda.
Last edited by Melvin.George; 03-14-2011 at 01:34 PM..
"And in hell he lifted up his eyes, being in torments, and saw Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom. And he cried and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me and send Lazarus so that he may dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue, for I am tormented in this flame."
(Luke 16:23-24)
"The Son of Man shall send out His angels, and they shall gather out of His kingdom all things that offend, and those who do iniquity, and shall cast them into a furnace of fire. There shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth."
(Mat 13:41-42)
"So it shall be at the end of the world. The angels shall come out and separate the wicked from among the just, and shall cast them into the furnace of fire. There shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth."
Mat 13:49-50
"Then he will say to those on his left, 'Away from me, you that are under God's curse! Away to the eternal fire which has been prepared for the Devil and his angels!"
"These, then, will be sent off to eternal punishment, but the righteous will go to eternal life."
(Mat 25:41 & 46)
"And if your foot offends you, cut it off. It is better for you to enter into life lame than to have two feet to be cast into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched where their conscience dies not, and the fire is not quenched."
(Mark 9:45-46)
Melvin.George, it has been my experience outside of the Bible. That demons do exist, and they have a great fear of Hell. I never gave much thought of Hell or demons myself. However in 1973 I encountered two of them. And after that everything changed for me. The Bible had it's stories, yet they were stories that I kind of ignored. When reality set in, it was a real shock. And even the church I went to told me they could not help. They as you tried to ignore such things. There is a big difference between the reality of the Bible, and what people now believe in the church today.
Last edited by Campbell34; 03-14-2011 at 02:50 PM..
Hey...you're preaching to the choir. I don't believe any of it. After billions of hell fire and damnation sermons preached across a thousand years many Christians have begun to deny a burning hell. When I was a youngster Baptist preachers had to preach one involving hell about once every five weeks...ten a year. Now the word is seldom used and most preachers steer clear of it all the time. The point is that the scripture is still there except in a few very modern translations where they purposfully omit any mention of eternal flames.
In my opinion the church has decided that since public opinion about eternal flames as a punishment has lost any popularity they will drop it. They did the same thing concerning witchcraft, infant baptism, slavery, women's rights etc. All the scripture which was used to support those ideas is still there but never mentioned. Evidently if the gross take on Sunday morning begins to fall off they try to get to the bottom of the cause and modify accordingly. If I were to prophesy a little here I'd bet homosexuality is the next thing to be taken off the preacher's agenda.
I agree. It's the process of sanitizing the bible for modern consumption. After all, which sensible, upstanding, civilized, 21st century person wants to be associated with a primitive tribal god who will find pleasure in tossing unsavory characters into an eternal cauldron of fire? How do you continue to put faith in this deity??? Well, just gloss it over with a healthy heaping of "spirituality" and magically make the original intention and interpretation(s) disappear. This is akin to the modern day, peace loving, non-violent Muslim cleaning up the word jihad to remove suspicion. "Of course "jihad" does NOT mean all out war on heathen pigs (those not like us). It NOW means internal warfare upon one's inner demons." This while the fanatics are working with the original definition and intention behind that definition.
I agree. It's the process of sanitizing the bible for modern consumption. After all, which sensible, upstanding, civilized, 21st century person wants to be associated with a primitive tribal god who will find pleasure in tossing unsavory characters into an eternal cauldron of fire? How do you continue to put faith in this deity??? Well, just gloss it over with a healthy heaping of "spirituality" and magically make the original intention and interpretation(s) disappear. This is akin to the modern day, peace loving, non-violent Muslim cleaning up the word jihad to remove suspicion. "Of course "jihad" does NOT mean all out war on heathen pigs (those not like us). It NOW means internal warfare upon one's inner demons." This while the fanatics are working with the original definition and intention behind that definition.
I often think back to my childhood. We were on a farm and of course there was no such thing as cooling, or lights because prior to 1950 my grandparents didn't even have power or indoor plumbing on their place. In the summer after supper everybody sat on the porch until about an hour after dark waiting for the house to cool enough to even try to go to sleep. My grandfather and uncles would tell ghost stories which they made up. So help me by the time we went inside I would jump in the bed, cover up my head, scared to death and finally go to sleep after my mind had cleared. That's what the whole thing is...2000 year old ghost stories for adults.
Last edited by Melvin.George; 03-14-2011 at 04:09 PM..
I often think back to my childhood. We were on a farm and of course there was no such thing as cooling, or lights because prior to 1950 my grandparents didn't even have power or indoor plumbing on their place. In the summer after supper everybody sat on the porch until about an hour after dark waiting for the house to cool enough to even try to go to sleep. My grandfather and uncles would tell ghost stories which they made up. So help me by the time we went inside I would jump in the bed, cover up my head, scared to death and finally go to sleep after my mind had cleared. That's what the whole thing is...2000 year old ghost stories for adults.
Do 2,000 year old ghost stories smash Christian crosses to the floor, and attack Christian holy pictures?
I really don't have a clue what that means...or what you intend it to mean.
Often during home hauntings, Christian crosses or Christians pictures hanging on the walls will be thrown to the floor by an invisible force. And this happens sometimes while others look on.
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This while the fanatics are working with the original definition and intention behind that definition.