You bunch of atheists that were ex Christians (grace, believing, religion)
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i know this and i still want that relationship with God, and i still pray to him.
Ahh yes; the key thought in your post. Agreed: need makes for spiritual feelings.
Quote:
Originally Posted by branfan
there was a woman who just died of cancer from the church i'm with. many people lifted up prayer to God for her constantly. she still died.
A recent admittedly unscientific poll at my wife's church showed that the last 10 cancer victims who were congregation members alldied despite the fervent (and, no doubt, personal fear-filled..) prayers of their friends. I have no doubt that the previous ten or 50 before those folks also died. Prayer does not work, and in fact, has been shown to hinder proper medical treatment, and thus has certainly hastened death in some documented cases. Oh-ohh, huh?
Quote:
Originally Posted by branfan
what were you praying for?
also, i believe God exist, and i can see evidence of him all around me.
NO, you choose to give Him credit, when there are obvious alternative answers that also might make far more sense.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticPhD
It is essential for Christians to believe Christ . . . not just believe IN Him. God is only concerned with our spiritual development and maturity . . . nothing of this physical world.
Oh. I see. How convenient, Mystic! (PS: folks can't just divorce themselves from the more wack-job parts of Greater Christianity, can they?)
Location: where you sip the tea of the breasts of the spinsters of Utica
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rafius
"You may ask me for anything in my name, and I will do it."
John 14:14
Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticPhD
It is essential for Christians to believe Christ . . . not just believe IN Him. God is only concerned with our spiritual development and maturity . . . nothing of this physical world.
Belief in Jesus has only a little to do with our spiritual development - in the sense that following any great spiritual master can help with that. It's not the belief in Jesus, but the practice of what he taught, that helps one to develop.
And again, the quote from John proves that the Bible is not the perfect word of God. We've all prayed for something that wasn't done. Usually Christians say in response to that, "Oh, God answers all prayers, even if they're denied or answered in a way not asked for."
But the verse says, You may ask me for anything AND I WILL DO IT. It does NOT say, "I will answer the prayer in some way", it says "I will do it".
Among MANY other problems with the Bible. We don't know for sure what Jesus said exactly, and thus it can't be "God's perfect manual for life on this planet".
Belief in Jesus has only a little to do with our spiritual development - in the sense that following any great spiritual master can help with that. It's not the belief in Jesus, but the practice of what he taught, that helps one to develop.
Agreed . . . but believing Him IS the road to spiritual maturity (whether or not you even know of Him). It is His path (Way) that is the truth . . . "love God and each other." (They are one and the same).
Remember that key verb: CHOOSE. Not necessarily a reflection of reality, but rather of one's personal needs and desires.
Go for it! I won't stop you, that's for sure, long as you don't call me one-them danged debil-atheists! Or I'll have-tah come on over and haunt your home for a while!
Remember that key verb: CHOOSE. Not necessarily a reflection of reality, but rather of one's personal needs and desires.
Go for it! I won't stop you, that's for sure, long as you don't call me one-them danged debil-atheists! Or I'll have-tah come on over and haunt your home for a while!
hey, i meant to put I choose. just wanted to clearify that. take care ok!
Agnostic atheists are atheistic because they do not hold a belief in the existence of any deity and agnostic because they claim that the existence of a deity is either unknowable in principle or currently unknown in fact.
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Ah yes! You DID get it right!
