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This is why philosophical naivete' can be such a problem in discussing these issues. Consciousness is a real, tangible, objective phenomenon in reality that exists as some composite form of resonant neural energy. Its content is not directly measurable with our sensory limited instruments because it is non-material (as we use that term to describe our physical reality).The existence of subjectivity (phenomenologically) is reveals this truth philosophically. Subjective experience can NOT be accounted for or accommodated within a materialist reality. It requires the non-material substrate of the universal field to contain our consciousness energy composite.
Yeah right...Our consciousness resides solely between our ears, as does the consciousness of every creature that has senses, and that is the only place it exists...Now bring on the insults, as is your habit.
This is why philosophical naivete' can be such a problem in discussing these issues. Consciousness is a real, tangible, objective phenomenon in reality that exists as some composite form of resonant neural energy. Its content is not directly measurable with our sensory limited instruments because it is non-material (as we use that term to describe our physical reality).The existence of subjectivity (phenomenologically) reveals this truth philosophically. Subjective experience can NOT be accounted for or accommodated within a materialist reality. It requires the non-material substrate of the universal field to contain our consciousness energy composite.
The problem with this is, is it measureable, can you measure consciousness, if it is objective then you would be able to measure it directly, due to you would have created it in form. The problem with measuring consciousness directly is, first there is no way to do it, we can measure it's behavior but this isn't the same thing. Furthermore, no matter what the technique for measuring consciousness, there is always the problem that the person interpreting the measurement is aware of only the contents of his or her own mind, never of anybody else's.
This is the nature of consciousness, it only belongs in your mind and you mind alone, therefore, it is by it very nature subjective.
I wonder how creationists view the other great apes...who are conscious and have self-awareness...as well as rudimentary language and can learn numbers and hundreds of hand signs and literally communicate with other apes (including humans). There have even been experiments where they record the noises chimpanzees make when a banana is shown to them..then they took some chimpanzees, played the recording and the chimpanzees always chose the banana on the screen suggesting they have a type of "spoken vocabulary".
Consciousness simply comes from the brain, and other animals also have a consciousness..even if they are less intelligent than us. Another example are dolphins and whales.
MysticPhD, I'll add this also, the consciousness is unique within every person, no one person will experience the same thing in exactly the same way. We can share our concept of the experience and relate to one another based on mutual experiences, but never in the exact same way, because everything we do belongs only to the doer and is experienced in their subject consciousness. We then communicate these experiences in a conceptual way which then is interputed by the other person based on their experiences. If it were objective, we would have the same exact experience, but seeing how you can never experience my mind nor I yours, it all becomes subjective.
The problem with this is, is it measureable, can you measure consciousness, if it is objective then you would be able to measure it directly, due to you would have created it in form. The problem with measuring consciousness directly is, first there is no way to do it, we can measure it's behavior but this isn't the same thing.
This is the same problem we have with 95+% of the universe which is comprised of dark energy and dark matter. They are non-baryonic and since they comprise the bulk of available substrate in our universe . . . it is reasonable to hypothesize that our consciousness is of the same non-baryonic energy/matter.
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Furthermore, no matter what the technique for measuring consciousness, there is always the problem that the person interpreting the measurement is aware of only the contents of his or her own mind, never of anybody else's.
This is the nature of consciousness, it only belongs in your mind and you mind alone, therefore, it is by it very nature subjective.
I understand the tendency to refuse to consider our consciousness phenomenologically. We tend not to think about our thought processes as phenomena to be thought about because we are using them to accomplish the thinking. However, everything that exists in our reality is comprised of some form of energy/matter (they are different manifestations of the same thing). So where the "mind" IS becomes the essential question. The universal field as the substrate is the ONLY feasible locus for it in its non-baryonic energy form because no matter could accommodate it. The equivalent problem in baryonic form would be containing a nuclear explosion (pure baryonic energy) in any form of matter.
Last edited by MysticPhD; 02-21-2012 at 12:18 PM..
Yeah right...Our consciousness resides solely between our ears, as does the consciousness of every creature that has senses, and that is the only place it exists...Now bring on the insults, as is your habit.
I disagree with the common perception of the location of Consciousness being in the head. We tend to believe this because when we introspect, we seem to look inward on an inner space somewhere behind our eyes. But what on earth do we mean by " Look?" We even close our eyes sometimes to introspect even more clearly. Upon what? Its spatial characther seems unquestionable. This is just natural assumption. We assume consciousness is behind the eyes of others, so we try to maintain eye contact when we speak to them. We assume there is a space behind their eyes into which we are talking.
But science knows perfectly well that there is no such space in anyones head at all! There is nothing inside our heads except physiological tissue of one sort or another. There is no location for consciousness in the body, Consciousness is a Spirit thats in the body; the whole body.
Huh? Consciousness is chemical and electrical processes in the brain...and as said above other animals also have a conscious..so not quite sure where you came up with this "spirit" thing. In Japan they have even created a machine which attaches to the head/brain..and can create a picture of what a person is thinking...so it's pretty obvious that thoughts/consciousness etc is all in the brain..and that's it.
Huh? Consciousness is chemical and electrical processes in the brain...and as said above other animals also have a conscious..so not quite sure where you came up with this "spirit" thing. In Japan they have even created a machine which attaches to the head/brain..and can create a picture of what a person is thinking...so it's pretty obvious that thoughts/consciousness etc is all in the brain..and that's it.
Well no, I certainly disagree that Consciousness is the result of electrical impulses and brain matter, their is nothing physical that accounts for Consciousness; and we are not frankenstein beings stimulated by electricity on any level. Consciousness is a " Spirit in Humans", which is imparted by God. And thats it. If consciousness was merely physical matter combined with chemicals and electrical impulses, man could create consciousness himself; duplicate it.
But it cannot be duplicated in a lab, because labs cannot create the Spirit in man.
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