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Hypothetical types of biochemistry. And NASA has found a new kind of life. "Instead of using phosphorus, the newly discovered microorganism—called GFAJ-1 and found in Mono Lake, California—uses the poisonous arsenic for its building blocks." NASA Finds New Life (Updated) Who knows what weird and wonderful kinds of life has yet do be discovered on the Earth not to mention the whole universe.
Is this microorganism wonderful for any particular reason? Is it sentient? Does it have a conscious? Does it make art? Is it INTELLIGENT?
I don't think unusual microorganisms are proof of anything other than life at the cellular level is diverse. Nevertheless, going from there to the equivalent of a human being isn't common or likely.
When truly intelligent, self conscious life is discovered elsewhere in the universe, then we can have a deeper discussion. Until then, "imagining" what might be out there is sci fie, not sci fact.
Well actually, are you quite sure SOMEBODY had to win? You presume so, but it is not necessarily the case that life, of one kind of another, HAD to exist. Even if it might be completely foreign to our understanding of basic biology, there is no law that says life is required.
The argument that because we exist, we must have therefore have drawn the lucky numbers, presupposes there are many different possible forms of life, we just got lucky. I'm not a scientist but it seems the conditions under which life can exist are not so many - unless one theorizes that intelligent life can be of a nature so vastly different from our own that we cannot even comprehend it. There is no scientific proof of this - to the contrary in fact. It would be a faith based POV.
A universe in which th rules are so different yet some kind of life, intelligent or otherwise, exists, seems more like sci fie than sci fact.
We have no evidence that intelligent life, on our level, can exist under extreme conditions such as are found in our planets furthest reaches, or on other far away planets. Truly intelligent life cannot form in deep sea underwater vents, for example, as far as we can tell, or in extreme cold or heat.
The universe is extremely inhospitable to life beyond earth, so far as we know. While that knowledge could change one day, until it does I'd say the odds are pretty good we are here more than just because of pure damn good luck.
Well, that is one of the best arguments for a plan rather than luck. Of course, in a universe as large as the one we know then the odds against nobody winning are inconceivable. Probably a lot of people have won. This is just on the best guesses and we can't know, but the stats should imply that there must be other lifeforms out there.
That said I can't deny the sheer luck of us being here is staggering. But then, consider out of all the humans that have existed, dying of plague in 1315, in the Tai-ping rebellion or as a mujik in Tsarist Russia. Billions of chances - and you and I lucked out so we live in the affluent west in the technological 21st c. What are the odds? You and I won the lottery.
And there's this. Suppose our existence was planned. Then surely a couple of major extinctions weren't needed to clear out the other dominant forms to give mammals a chance. The way it looks is that we have been lucky. It's not proof positive, but it is a counter case. And then I look to see evidence of the designer apart from the provision of suitable conditions and there isn't any. Nor any sign of a designer providing any after sales service. Nothing that isn't poor science, doubtful anecdotes and frankly imagination.
Now the cold feeling tilts the other way and odds or not, unplanned begins to look the better odds. That won't convince the believer of course, but it should explain why 'chance' is far from the unfeasible atheist-faith belief that theists would like to say it is.
And suitable conditions (with First cause) is the better of the arguments for some sort of creator - god. The rest are nothing like so worthy of consideration. D'you see what a thin case theism really has?
Hypothetical types of biochemistry. And NASA has found a new kind of life. "Instead of using phosphorus, the newly discovered microorganism—called GFAJ-1 and found in Mono Lake, California—uses the poisonous arsenic for its building blocks." NASA Finds New Life (Updated) Who knows what weird and wonderful kinds of life has yet do be discovered on the Earth not to mention the whole universe.
So what? Is there a point? Does that somehow disprove God?
Is this microorganism wonderful for any particular reason?
Did you read the links? It is wonderful because it "is unlike anything currently living in planet Earth."
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Is it sentient? Does it have a conscious? Does it make art? Is it INTELLIGENT?
Why would those be requirements for being unique or wonderful?
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I don't think unusual microorganisms are proof of anything other than life at the cellular level is diverse. Nevertheless, going from there to the equivalent of a human being isn't common or likely.
And your evaluation is based on what?
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When truly intelligent, self conscious life is discovered elsewhere in the universe, then we can have a deeper discussion. Until then, "imagining" what might be out there is sci fie, not sci fact.
What a perfect description of religion and the Bible. Because we haven't actually discovered intelligent, self conscious life elsewhere in the universe so therefore the Bible must be sci-fi. Right?
So what? Is there a point? Does that somehow disprove God?
Redrum22 said: "The universe is extremely inhospitable to life beyond earth, so far as we know. While that knowledge could change one day, until it does I'd say the odds are pretty good we are here more than just because of pure damn good luck." My point was that our knowledge changes constantly and that nobody knew that arsenic based life forms existed or even could exist until a few years ago. We don't know what kinds of life the different conditions in the universe are hospitable to.
Redrum22 said: "The universe is extremely inhospitable to life beyond earth, so far as we know. While that knowledge could change one day, until it does I'd say the odds are pretty good we are here more than just because of pure damn good luck." My point was that our knowledge changes constantly and that nobody knew that arsenic based life forms existed or even could exist until a few years ago. We don't know what kinds of life the different conditions in the universe are hospitable to.
ahhh...gotcha. k...I missed that one.
I personally am not a huge fan of the inhospitable argument for that reason. I saw a small article awhile back, though, that said they were mistaken....that there was not a form of arsenic-based life forms discovered. Funny how it was trumpeted loud and clear when they thought they had discovered it....but not much was said when they found out they were wrong.
I personally am not a huge fan of the inhospitable argument for that reason. I saw a small article awhile back, though, that said they were mistaken....that there was not a form of arsenic-based life forms discovered. Funny how it was trumpeted loud and clear when they thought they had discovered it....but not much was said when they found out they were wrong.
Good catch! And I understand you not being a huge fan of the inhospitable argument... an arsenic rich environment can't be said to be exactly hospitable...
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