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I finally made it up to NYC this past weekend. My wife and I went to the World Trade Centers. My first thought upon seeing Ground Zero was subtle amazement.
My first thought walking into the memorial building brought it into perspective for me. On one wall are photocopies of the actual missing posters of many of the people.
On another wall, behind a glass case, are pictures of the people that died. Well, about half of them. It was then that I realized, looking into all those bright shining faces who had so much taken away from them that God must certainly not exist.
I can understand perhaps the difference in good and evil in a childish concept of mischief vs. good. But, is it so necessary to take away almost 3000 people in one fell swoop? Is it entirely necessary to allow things like that to occur? Was it necessary for each one of those families to experience the tragedies that they did? All for what? What was God's purpose for that?
Was it to get people closer to him? Was it to allow people to see him better? To ask him questions? To allow people to commit atrocities like that in HIS name? No, I say. No!
There is no such thing as God. Something like that was not necessary. Sometimes you don't realize the true tragedy until you can experience it in some small way. If there is a God, than I want no part of him for he is as wicked as the men who flew those airplanes into the building for allowing it to happen.
This is only one idea of what God could be.
What if God is suffering?
What if God is not something you can just blame things on and wish upon?
My experience should never be consider a threat. I am only telling you what will be. And I can do that, because of my own experience. Your life will not end at physical death. The real shock comes when your physical body nolonger funtions, yet you discover you see everything as if it did. And that is when you know, that there is something beyond this physical existence. I'm sorry if that upsets you.
Sorry to hear that, but that has nothing to due with God. You had electricity flowing through you, you could have seen the giant easter bunny for crying out loud.
No, I did not see a giant easter bunny. I did see the neighbor woman from across the street. And I was looking right into her face when my head was turned the other way. And she was asking everyone if I was dead. I did not see her with my physical eyes, yet I saw her. And at the time I could not understand why she thought I was dead.
My experience should never be consider a threat. I am only telling you what will be. And I can do that, because of my own experience. Your life will not end at physical death. The real shock comes when your physical body nolonger funtions, yet you discover you see everything as if it did. And that is when you know, that there is something beyond this physical existence. I'm sorry if that upsets you.
You aren't upsetting me at all. You and I just have very different opinions. I respect yours. I wish you would stop trying to change mine. It just sounds like you are trying to scare me. It's not working. You can move on. This isn't even on topic.
For the record, even if there is a God - I don't believe that he has the characteristics that many believe that he has. I don't think it would be anything that specific and defined. Just my opinion.
You aren't upsetting me at all. You and I just have very different opinions. I respect yours. I wish you would stop trying to change mine. It just sounds like you are trying to scare me. It's not working. You can move on. This isn't even on topic.
For the record, even if there is a God - I don't believe that he has the characteristics that many believe that he has. I don't think it would be anything that specific and defined. Just my opinion.
Well the topic is, "I am now certain that God doesn't exist." My experiences suggest that He does. Are you just looking for people who agree with you? And for the record, if your opinion is just based on your opinion, how much of that opinion can one believe?
Limitations comes in many packages. the inability to see good in bad occurrences, the possibility that nothing is ever lost but transmuted. or that people did those things, God neither allowed or disallowed. People made some bad choices, thinking they are going to reach heaven, only to find out their karmic debts are many now. God help those lost souls find light and a way to make amends.
The people that left the bounds of the earth have had a tremendous impact. their sacrifice was for so much more than w see.
You do not have to believe in God, he still believes in you.
I WANT my experience to be Godly! I do, I Do, I DO!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Campbell34
My experience should never be consider a threat. I am only telling you what will be. And I can do that, because of my own experience. Your life will not end at physical death. The real shock comes when your physical body nolonger funtions, yet you discover you see everything as if it did. And that is when you know, that there is something beyond this physical existence. I'm sorry if that upsets you.
Ahhh yes... And you KNOW this how again?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Campbell34
No, I did not see a giant easter bunny. I did see the neighbor woman from across the street. And I was looking right into her face when my head was turned the other way. And she was asking everyone if I was dead. I did not see her with my physical eyes, yet I saw her. And at the time I could not understand why she thought I was dead.
Hmmm... yep: similar to what I experienced when I came to after launching a Lotus sports car off a cliff many years ago, and rolling down the rocky cliff 150 feet. Knocked me out (concussion) and damaged me significantly. The first stirrings of a return to consciousness can be easily misinterpreted. As your mind re-boots, it starts hearing, then seeing tho' you'll probably claim your eyes were not open. Not what the attending EMTs always say though.
NPR recently covered a story of an Army major who was hit by a bullet in his femoral artery in Afghanistan, and as they rushed to try to save him, he felt himself losing consciousness quite deliberately. His mind went into slo-mo, but eventually he said it just faded to black. BTW, he was a Christian, but also you don't usually get to be a major by being a wishful unrealistic dreamer.
Anyhow, when he came to 4 hours later, it was simply that. He regained consciousness slowly, out of the blackness, first realizing there were nurses and docs in the room, before he could verbally or physically respond. No bright lights, no godly invocations or messages from hovering angels.
Seems some just plain want to creatively imagine this stuff, but then their stories are oddly similar once they have heard it on radio, TV, print or in person from some other person professing "It happened this way to me!"
The power of positive suggestion and wishful thinking combined for sure.
Does the 'worm' link (' the early birds gets the WORM remark, hmmm?) with or without Laws of Nature? Unconsciously it was imagined in the light; also unconsciously it was remembered in the dark.
There's something really remarkable of typing on the MAC to light up with secretary work.
What was God's purpose for that? Was it to get people closer to him? Was it to allow people to see him better? To ask him questions? To allow people to commit atrocities like that in HIS name? No, I say. No!
I agree, the answer is "No," God did not guide those souls to attack the trade towers, they were following the evil in their hearts. God gives every soul the choice. Follow God, or not.
I will argue against the point that the lost died for no good cause. Their deaths did serve to wake us up to the suffering that the world outside the US has suffered for decades. While it is true that no other attack was so "successful" in killing so many, each terrorist attack in the world has struck terror in the hearts of others. That is the work of souls that have turned from good to evil.
People kill people. God's guidance has always been to Love one another, as I love you.
I suspect you will continue to grapple with your questions. I grappled with mine for nearly forty years. Then, one day I took all my questions directly to God, and screamed them out, one by one. We were walking along a meadow outside Elgin, IL, and I have no idea whether others were witness or not. Angry, frustrated, and exhausted from my struggles, I didn't hold back one accusation. I let it all out. Then, I shut up and listened. I listened long and hard. I heard nothing.
Dejected, I walked back to our RV. Disconsolate, I spent my evening dark and gloomy, and went to bed. Then, when all thoughts were gone, spent, I lay in the darkness and stared into the gloom.
That's when a passage came into my head: "Be Still and know that I AM God." From my heart came a reply: "And not Me."
I accepted that I didn't have to understand the world. The world isn't about God -- that's evil's territory. What others think and do isn't my business, God will take care of them. Suddenly I felt a warm glow of love and peace move through me, and I knew I was with God, and God was with me.
Since then, that's all that really matters. If you are truly interested in God, seek within your own heart -- not your mind, your heart. That is God's territory, as long as you give it to God.
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I WANT my experience to be Godly! I do, I Do, I DO!
