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This is perhaps a fitting finale to this thread, because it demonstrates the futility of attempting to have a discussion when there is no common understanding of terminology -- not to mention the fact that you apparently did not even read the link you posted. The statement of mine that you purport to refute with the link is that the large majority of Americans are Christians “and thus creationists.” This statement is true by definition. It is impossible to be a Christian without a belief that we live in a created reality of which the God of the Bible is the creator. Anyone who claims to be a Christian but denies that we live in a created reality of which the God of the Bible is the creator is simply using the term "Christian" in the sense of "admirer of Jesus," but this is not a Christian by any even vaguely orthodox definition. Every Christian is a creationist in this basic sense of believing in the creator God, regardless of whether he or she is a Young Earth Creationist,an Old Earth Creationist or simply someone who believes we live in a created reality of which the God of the Bible is the creator without any interest in the difference between the Young Earth and Old Earth views. From the Stanford Dictionary of Philosophy: “At a broad level, a Creationist is someone who believes in a god who is absolute creator of heaven and earth, out of nothing, by an act of free will. Such adeity is generally thought to be constantly involved (‘immanent’) in the creation, ready to intervene as necessary, and without whose constant concern the creation would cease or disappear. Christians,Jews, and Muslims are all Creationists in this sense.”
You and several others on this thread seem to believe that the term “creationist” implies Young Earth Creationist – which, as my original post on this thread makes clear, is simply not true. The link you posted concerns a Gallup poll in which 46% of Americans (not just Christians) identified themselves as Young Earth Creationists: “Forty-six percentof Americans believe in the creationist view that God created humans in their present form at one time within the last 10,000 years. The prevalence of this creationist view of the origin of humans is essentially unchanged from 30 years ago, when Gallup first asked the question. About a third of Americans believe that humans evolved, but with God's guidance; 15% say humans evolved, but that God had no part in the process.” The poll thus actually supports precisely what I originally said.
Those opposed to Christianity have co-opted the term “creationism” to mean “anti-science” or “anti-evolution,” when most Christians are neither anti-science nor anti-evolution (but certainly do believe we live in a created reality of which the God of the Bible is the creator). This is like the homosexual community's co-opting of the term “gay.” This thread thus makes about as much sense as if I had said that most Christians are “cheerful and gay,” meaning happy, and had launched a debate in which many posters took me to task for suggesting that most Christians are cheerful homosexuals. I am not obligated to use the term “gay” to mean “homosexual,” and I am likewise not obligated to use the term “creationist” to mean “anti-science” or “anti-evolution" just because this is how atheists would like to frame the discussion.
This is perhaps a fitting finale to this thread, because it demonstrates the futility of attempting to have a discussion when there is no common understanding of terminology -- not to mention the fact that you apparently did not even read the link you posted. The statement of mine that you purport to refute with the link is that the large majority of Americans are Christians “and thus creationists.” This statement is true by definition. It is impossible to be a Christian without a belief that we live in a created reality of which the God of the Bible is the creator. Anyone who claims to be a Christian but denies that we live in a created reality of which the God of the Bible is the creator is simply using the term "Christian" in the sense of "admirer of Jesus," but this is not a Christian by any even vaguely orthodox definition. Every Christian is a creationist in this basic sense of believing in the creator God, regardless of whether he or she is a Young Earth Creationist,an Old Earth Creationist or simply someone who believes we live in a created reality of which the God of the Bible is the creator without any interest in the difference between the Young Earth and Old Earth views. From the Stanford Dictionary of Philosophy: “At a broad level, a Creationist is someone who believes in a god who is absolute creator of heaven and earth, out of nothing, by an act of free will. Such adeity is generally thought to be constantly involved (‘immanent’) in the creation, ready to intervene as necessary, and without whose constant concern the creation would cease or disappear. Christians,Jews, and Muslims are all Creationists in this sense.”
You and several others on this thread seem to believe that the term “creationist” implies Young Earth Creationist – which, as my original post on this thread makes clear, is simply not true. The link you posted concerns a Gallup poll in which 46% of Americans (not just Christians) identified themselves as Young Earth Creationists: “Forty-six percentof Americans believe in the creationist view that God created humans in their present form at one time within the last 10,000 years. The prevalence of this creationist view of the origin of humans is essentially unchanged from 30 years ago, when Gallup first asked the question. About a third of Americans believe that humans evolved, but with God's guidance; 15% say humans evolved, but that God had no part in the process.” The poll thus actually supports precisely what I originally said.
Those opposed to Christianity have co-opted the term “creationism” to mean “anti-science” or “anti-evolution,” when most Christians are neither anti-science nor anti-evolution (but certainly do believe we live in a created reality of which the God of the Bible is the creator). This is like the homosexual community's co-opting of the term “gay.” This thread thus makes about as much sense as if I had said that most Christians are “cheerful and gay,” meaning happy, and had launched a debate in which many posters took me to task for suggesting that most Christians are cheerful homosexuals. I am not obligated to use the term “gay” to mean “homosexual,” and I am likewise not obligated to use the term “creationist” to mean “anti-science” or “anti-evolution" just because this is how atheists would like to frame the discussion.
If you are a Young Earth Creationist, you are, by default, anti-science. You CANNOT be pro-science and a proponent of Young Earth Creationism - even if you try abysmally to use science to prove an unscientific claim.
If almost a majority of people (who are undoubtedly Christians) actually believe in YEC (something that really makes me ashamed to be an American, I might add), then almost a majority of Americans are anti-science.
Yeah, I get what you're saying about being a "creationist," but I suppose most of us assume that a "creationist" is someone who believes humans were created from a pile of dirt and a rib in our present form. It mostly applies to evolution, not the Big Bang, and thus those Christians who believe that we evolved aren't usually considered to be creationists. The fact that Christians believe that God created the universe is a given ... the word "creationist" is used to describe that special brand of Christian who actually thinks the story of Adam and Eve belongs in a history book.
But ... where did God get the food that he ate to process into poop in order to create the universe?
Since there was nothing but God floating around then ....
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