Welcome to City-Data.com Forum!
U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Retirement
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 03-08-2014, 11:27 AM
 
6,324 posts, read 4,323,868 times
Reputation: 4335

Advertisements

The graveyards of history are filled with the corpses of once-great civilizations that resisted change and believed they could keep doing things the "same old way." And thus the world got up and left them behind, left them to wither into being inconsequential lapdogs for more adaptive nations or they cease to exist altogether.

America is facing that crossroad now, but I think our stubborn pride and arrrogance - the refusal to incorporate good ideas that America didn't invent - will result in a big red-white-and-blue tombstone with America's name on it.

Being the only industrialized nation on earth that does not have universal health care is a cultural embarrassment; I have yet to hear a single Canadian, Asian, or European say they regret their health care system and wish they had ours. Because no one does.

The system we have now is unsustainable. As it stands now, the average family of four pays in excess of $20,000 per year on health insurance for a policy that actually covers something and doesn't have a bank-breaking deductible. And while these families are paying almost half the average household income on health insurance, they're also trying to pay mortages, student loans, rent, and a plethora of other things.

Hell, even with Obamacare, my father, a former steelworker, was paying over $200/month for insurance that only covered catastrophic health issues and one single "preventative care" doctor visit per year. And it had a $5,000 deductible. Most families can't afford a sudden $5,000 debt without dipping into their savings - and with ALL of this going on, they're supposed to save for retirement?

That's not even being fair much less realistic. Oh sure, the out-going baby boomers don't have it so bad so there's a lot of "I'm alright, Jack" attitudes floating around. They don't have to worry about what life will be like 20 or 50 or 100 years from now and probably won't be around to see it if their own children backslide into poverty because a low wage job was all that was available (67% of all jobs created since 2010 have been low wage jobs).

And STILL, we're supposed to put money aside for retirement - and not $5 in a mason jar every paycheck. It has to be a substantial savings for it to work for you during all of your retirement years. My grandfather lived to be 92, so if you're like him and live 30 more years beyond retirement, you better have some serious cash tucked away in that mason jar.

The only real way to do that is to have good job that pays well ... and those jobs are disappearing faster than you can say "welfare."

Our entire system, quite frankly, sucks. It disenfranchizes honest people, rewards those who game the system, and it leaves the truly disabled out in the cold. Our health care system well ... it sucks. We have the best doctors in the world, but fewer and fewer Americans can afford them. It's like having a Rolls Royce dealer on every corner - who really cares how good the cars are if only a few can buy one? We are becoming a health care boutique, the kind of place where the wealthy shop for their treatment while the rest of us find ourselves priced out of the neighborhood. And judging by the profusion of advertizing on cable, it's pretty apparent where all of our money is going when we pay extravagant prices for our medications.

Any for-profit endeavor is only interested in one thing: Profit. If the industry could actually make money by closing every hospital, they would - because making money is the ultimate goal. Actually helping people comes in at a very distant second. I guess that's why so many doctors' offices these days have a big sign when you walk in, a sign that reads something like: "Payment arrangements must be made before the doctor will see you."

A for-profit system works fine when you're selling televisions or couches, but it's a bad idea when selling life, and that IS what is being sold. Our precious founding documents say that the right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness are inalienable - yet we ignore those rights in favor of big profit margins and dividends for shareholders. One can hardly be given the right to life if you die from lack of treatment, and one certainly doesn't have the right to pursue happiness when he or she is crippled up with a chronic condition left untreated due to either the cost or due to an insurance company that refuses to pay a claim.

Insurance ... hah. What a business model, the ONLY industry that makes its money by NOT providing you the services you pay for. And yet Americans, complacent in their affuence, accepts such a ridiculous model and some even champion it. I dare say, how long would you keep your cable company if the cable was down 75% of the time because ComCast or Time Warner makes more money by not airing shows than it does by airing them?

And that's something to think about, too. Just how quick do you think a for-profit industry wants to cure cancer? What real incentive do they have in eradicating a disease that nets these people hundreds of billions each year for surgeries, treatments, and office visits. It's actually more profitable to keep the patients sick and simply treat them for the rest of their lives than it is to actually cure them.

At any rate, I could write a book on this topic. Suffice it to say that those who think the statistics are "hyperbolic" are the same folks you can blame when and if America lays down in its grave, too stubbornly proud of itself to admit its failings and too arrogant to change. Sure, we can pretend that those statistics mean nothing. I remember playing at make-believe when I was a kid. We can pretend here, too, just like the conservatives during the Christmas of 2008 claiming the economy was doing fine based on the number of cars in mall parking lots. They thought the numbers were hyperbolic, too.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 03-08-2014, 11:37 AM
 
Location: Gorgeous Scotland
4,095 posts, read 5,546,625 times
Reputation: 3351
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shirina View Post
The graveyards of history are filled with the corpses of once-great civilizations that resisted change and believed they could keep doing things the "same old way." And thus the world got up and left them behind, left them to wither into being inconsequential lapdogs for more adaptive nations or they cease to exist altogether.

America is facing that crossroad now, but I think our stubborn pride and arrrogance - the refusal to incorporate good ideas that America didn't invent - will result in a big red-white-and-blue tombstone with America's name on it.

Being the only industrialized nation on earth that does not have universal health care is a cultural embarrassment; I have yet to hear a single Canadian, Asian, or European say they regret their health care system and wish they had ours. Because no one does.
Correct! It's a disgrace. But Americans don't want it. They say it's big bad socialism. And they always jump on some article that says there are long waits for non-emergency procedures (always in some place like London). I am extremely grateful that I'm retired in the UK with this healthcare. It isn't free, it comes out of taxes like everything else. I have great doctors and the hospitals if/when I need them are fantastic. I pay zero for prescriptions and £10 for a thorough teeth cleaning and checkup at my dentist twice a year.

I was very lucky nothing happened during the years in the US when I could not afford health insurance and the employer did not provide it.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-08-2014, 11:42 AM
 
31,683 posts, read 41,045,989 times
Reputation: 14434
Quote:
Originally Posted by 20yrsinBranson View Post
I guess the question is.... Would you have been willing to pay 50% - 60% - 70% of your income in taxes for the past 30 years so that you could have a more "secure" retirement? (whatever that means).

Most people would not. Most people complain that the taxes they pay are already too high. You can't have it both ways.

20yrsinBranson
The more we are personally efficient the less government has to practice inefficiency to cover our tracks.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-08-2014, 11:42 AM
 
Location: Great State of Texas
86,052 posts, read 84,495,743 times
Reputation: 27720
But this is the retirement forum and retired folks in America have medicare.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-08-2014, 11:44 AM
 
Location: Great State of Texas
86,052 posts, read 84,495,743 times
Reputation: 27720
Quote:
Originally Posted by TuborgP View Post
The more we are personally efficient the less government has to practice inefficiency to cover our tracks.
That is true but today we get to keep less.
$.59 of every dollar you earn goes to some government entity (city, county, state, federal).
And people don't even realize that since all the press talks about is Federal Income Tax.
That is just one piece of the pie.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-08-2014, 11:48 AM
 
31,683 posts, read 41,045,989 times
Reputation: 14434
Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyTexan View Post
But this is the retirement forum and retired folks in America have medicare.
And those of lesser means have Medicaid and many of the employed have employer based insurance. How many previously uninsured are now insured under the ACA? Oh yeah transparency has reached that point yet. But we do know about those of us over 65, at least for now. So yup seniors at 62 and 65 have benefits that kick in.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-08-2014, 11:49 AM
 
460 posts, read 988,209 times
Reputation: 628
Well, I'm retired in the USA, and life is great! There is no shortage of healthcare and wealth around here, and the quality of life is excellent.

I don't have any complaints.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-08-2014, 11:54 AM
 
31,683 posts, read 41,045,989 times
Reputation: 14434
Quote:
Originally Posted by Muonic View Post
Well, I'm retired in the USA, and life is great! There is no shortage of healthcare and wealth around here, and the quality of life is excellent.

I don't have any complaints.
Congrats!
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-08-2014, 12:02 PM
 
Location: SW Missouri
15,852 posts, read 35,135,091 times
Reputation: 22695
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shirina View Post
The graveyards of history are filled with the corpses of once-great civilizations that resisted change and believed they could keep doing things the "same old way." And thus the world got up and left them behind, left them to wither into being inconsequential lapdogs for more adaptive nations or they cease to exist altogether.
Ya think?

So have you ever known a business that had been around for 20 or so years, doing just great, enjoying a lot of popularity, having a huge following of loyal customers and then one day, they decide they are going to "expand" and enlarge and remodel and change and IMPROVE their business for their customers and then 6 months later they go bankrupt?

Yeah, me too. Plenty of them.

Growth for growth's sake is the mentality of a cancer cell.

think about it.

20yrsinBranson
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-08-2014, 12:20 PM
 
Location: SW Missouri
15,852 posts, read 35,135,091 times
Reputation: 22695


20yrsinBranson
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:


Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Retirement

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 11:53 PM.

© 2005-2024, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top