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My brother in law is on disability soc security. I think that's what it's called. He applied some years ago and was getting $770 a month. He tells me that they reduced it to $550 because he moved from Florida to Brooklyn, and then they reduced it more because he cannot prove he is paying rent. I find that difficult to believe. But I am not sure. He is asking for $$, and we've been having problems with him. His mother died, she used to take care of him. I feel bad that he is so ill (mentally), but we can't keep giving him money if I don't understand the situation.
Does anybody know if soc. sec. disability can reduce payments because they claim you're not paying rent? That's what he's telling us.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cindi Waters
I just spoke to my BIL and he now says he was getting SSI and SSDI. He says the SSI was reduced. It's just more than I can handle because I don't understand how it works.
Supplemental Security Income (SSI) is $750/month.
If he is getting more than $750/month then he cannot be getting SSI, rather it must be SSDI.
Your BIL is flat out lying to your face.
Neither SSI nor SSDI is affected by your residence. It doesn't matter where you live in the US, your SSI or SSDI payment will always be the same.
Neither SSI nor SSDI require proof of rent, and in fact, you are not obligated to pay any rent at all. You will collect the full amount for each SSI or SSDI whether you rent or whether you live with a family member or friend and pay no rent at all.
Neither SSI nor SSDI can be attached by private entities, meaning it doesn't matter how many judgments or garnishments you have against you, they cannot take the money.
However, the federal government can and does attach SSI and SSDI if you owe student loans, taxes, fines, fees or penalties, including criminal judgments and fines.
It may also be attached for back child support payments.
You don't need 40 credits to qualify for SSDI.
The number of required credits is prorated based on your age.
If you are 24 and under, you only need 6 credits, but your disability has to have started within 3 years of the last day you worked.
So, if your last day of work was June 1, 2015 and you have 6 credits and then you became disabled June 30, 2018, you don't qualify for SSDI, but you will qualify for SSI.
And, yes, it will increase in January, because SSI gets the same COLA increases OASI and OADI get.
If you're between 25 and 31 years, you only need 12 credits and then at age 32 you need 20 credits and it goes up one credit for each year thereafter.
You need to confront him and tell him he's lying, and that you know he's lying, and when he decides to stop lying, you'll discuss the matter with him further, and if he insists he's not, tell him to have a nice life and not to contact you ever again.
Aside from that, you can't force him to do anything he doesn't want to do. Moving to Brooklyn was stupid given the high Cost-of-Living compared to Florida. He needs to go back to Florida, and he probably needs a payee to manage his money for him, and social services will hook him up with that, but he has to want to go, and if he doesn't want to go, there's nothing you can do about it.
If he is getting more than $750/month then he cannot be getting SSI, rather it must be SSDI.
Your BIL is flat out lying to your face.
Neither SSI nor SSDI is affected by your residence. It doesn't matter where you live in the US, your SSI or SSDI payment will always be the same.
Neither SSI nor SSDI require proof of rent, and in fact, you are not obligated to pay any rent at all. You will collect the full amount for each SSI or SSDI whether you rent or whether you live with a family member or friend and pay no rent at all.
Neither SSI nor SSDI can be attached by private entities, meaning it doesn't matter how many judgments or garnishments you have against you, they cannot take the money.
However, the federal government can and does attach SSI and SSDI if you owe student loans, taxes, fines, fees or penalties, including criminal judgments and fines.
It may also be attached for back child support payments.
You don't need 40 credits to qualify for SSDI.
The number of required credits is prorated based on your age.
If you are 24 and under, you only need 6 credits, but your disability has to have started within 3 years of the last day you worked.
So, if your last day of work was June 1, 2015 and you have 6 credits and then you became disabled June 30, 2018, you don't qualify for SSDI, but you will qualify for SSI.
And, yes, it will increase in January, because SSI gets the same COLA increases OASI and OADI get.
If you're between 25 and 31 years, you only need 12 credits and then at age 32 you need 20 credits and it goes up one credit for each year thereafter.
You need to confront him and tell him he's lying, and that you know he's lying, and when he decides to stop lying, you'll discuss the matter with him further, and if he insists he's not, tell him to have a nice life and not to contact you ever again.
Aside from that, you can't force him to do anything he doesn't want to do. Moving to Brooklyn was stupid given the high Cost-of-Living compared to Florida. He needs to go back to Florida, and he probably needs a payee to manage his money for him, and social services will hook him up with that, but he has to want to go, and if he doesn't want to go, there's nothing you can do about it.
NO! NO! NO!
I am Autistic, and because of this I am a Disabilities and Autism activist. Most Autistic people have HORRENDOUS Executive function. I do, and so do, not only my fellow Autistics, but my "cousins", which I assume your BIL is.This would make it difficult if not impossible for him to figure this out on his own. I have helped many disabled people figure the ssi and ssdi out.
Your BIL is probably NOT lying, at least based on what you have written.
One, there is indeed only one across-the-board federal SSI ammount. Many states choose to supplement it, by varying ammounts, most common is $20 I think. [ I mostly help people in Colorado so I am not sure which states supplement in what ammounts] So, please, ignorance of the facts does not make a person an expert at who is a liar!
Secondly, yes, a person CAN often receive both SSI and SSDI. One person living here receives both. This is how. They are someone who DID work for a certain length of time, but even with the required quarters, their SSDI would only come to four hundred and something a month. When that happens, SSI fills in the gap to ensure that the recipient is not penalized by haviing worked. They only give enough SSI so that the SSDI and the SSI would equal the ammount the person would receive on SSI alone.
Thirdly, this is how his check was probably cut. [my executive function is now being highly effected, so I hope I can post this in a way you can understand]If for ANY reason SSI believes that someone has paid for or enabled a person on SSI to pay "less than their fair share" for rent [does not include subsidized housing for some reason] they will cut down the benefit. A simple question like "IS anyone being nice and giving you a break on the rent?" will cause that reduction.
The other less likely possibility is that he missed a reassment meeting and lost his SSI and has only his SSDI left. From what you have posted I would think the first possibility rather the the second.
PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE do not believe what the person above posted. People with mental diseases have an incredibly high suicide rate. Calling him a liar when it sounds so much like the truth and there is NO reason to misbelieve him could just trigger that in him. I am not sure what the rate of suicide is for some of my "cousins" but among my "high functioning, with at least one cognitive issue [ I have NEVER met an Autistic person without cognitive issues] is 30 years less than the average persons, and most of that is from suicide. And heart disease from all the stress.
PLEASE help your BIL. There is a lot going on in our "community' but hopefully that will be over soon and possibly he could live here. Whatever, please help him. I am BEGGING you.
I reread the post quoted again. Being I am not a fan of "alternate facts" I need to correct something else. IT is highly unlikely that your BILs' benefits are being garnished by the feds. They can take a maximum of 20% off of SSDI for unpaid taxes. They can take nothing off of SSI for unpaid taxes. They rarely take for the other things listed. I will never understand cruelty for the fun of it and I am glad that my "inferior" mind never will. PLEASE HELP YOUR BIL!
The government administers two different disability programs. One is called SSDI and that program is for disabled workers. It functions more or less the same way Social Security does. The amount you get each month depends upon how many quarters you worked and contributed to payroll taxes while you were still healthy. Since SSDI is for disabled WORKERS, it is treated as money you have earned over the course of your career, and it will not be garnished the way SSI can be.
On the other hand, the SSI program is for those who never really were able to work - maybe they were born with a serious birth defect or maybe in their teens they developed schizophrenia or some other mental illness which prevented them from joining the workforce. Bottom line, the government considers SSI to be the same as welfare. If your BIL was getting $770/month, he is probably on SSI. Trying to figure out SSI is often a nightmare for an individual with a mental disability. For example, if your BIL is on SSI and someone starts giving him a certain amount of money every month, he is required to report this and his check will be docked accordingly. The same would be true if the folks at SSI believe that someone is giving him free rent.
I have worked with schizophrenics, and their situation is often heartbreaking. They lose important paperwork because their voices keep them confused and distracted. Street people will pretend to be their friends and then rip them off for every penny they have. Schizophrenics are often terrified of those in authority (often for good reason), and as a result, they avoid going to appointments and they don't ask questions.
My suggestion would be for you to call Social Security and make an appointment for the two of you so you can know just what your BIL's situation is. It sounds like he is incapable of taking care of his own finances. I don't know if you have the energy or time, but you might consider becoming your BIL's representative payee. You would then be in charge of his SSI check and you could use that money to make sure his rent is paid (and get receipts). Check with your local HUD office and/or Social Services and check to see if you get him on the list for a room or an apartment in a housing unit set aside for the elderly and the disabled.
And kudos to you for being concerned for your relative who sounds like he has all the cards stacked against him. Best of luck to you both.
Thank you very much for your consideration. I was sick when I was a young woman, and that was about 50 years ago. I got better but it took a loooonnnngggg time. I was diagnosed as borderline schizophrenic. My husband married me over 40 years ago, and while we certainly have had our troubles, he helped me get well. (Well, ok, better -- not "well," but better than I was.) We both put up with each other. So what I am trying to say is I understand and appreciate your statement about those being terrified of people in authority, possibly with good reason. In those days when I was really sick, and because I was on drugs, they put some people in confined state hospitals. My parents, middle class though they were, and me with scholarships, etc., decided to "send me away" for a while to get away from my drug-oriented friends. I saw things done by doctors that were similar to One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest. Tragic. Very, very tragic. It naturally frightened me to see a screaming, crying woman dragged away for "treatment." I am glad they didn't give me shock by force. I also saw someone with a lobotomy, gratis the state. Horrible and horrifying. So I am really glad you spoke of rightful fear of doctors. Now that I am better, I can let a doctor know in a respectful manner what I want and what I don't want. Thank God.
So I am going to say you must be a very kind and understanding person to say what you did.
One of the reasons I would not want to become his payee is because he is living in another state and frankly, I do not want him near us. Not because he is dangerous, but because he is so impulsive and believes he is right about how he does things. He is not my child. He is over 60. And more than that, he borrows from friends right and left, so being his payee would not mean much. And he finally admitted, after a big verbal confrontation on our part, that he has been lying to us. Meantime we are trying to help him.
Thanks again for your consideration.
I spoke to a counselor at CUCN (Columbia University foundation re the homeless, etc.). She gave me some information about emergency housing. So far he is not in a dangerous setting. With God's help, we'll keep working on this. Thanks. Just to let you know, I say this with tears in my eyes for your understanding.
I reread the post quoted again. Being I am not a fan of "alternate facts" I need to correct something else. IT is highly unlikely that your BILs' benefits are being garnished by the feds. They can take a maximum of 20% off of SSDI for unpaid taxes. They can take nothing off of SSI for unpaid taxes. They rarely take for the other things listed. I will never understand cruelty for the fun of it and I am glad that my "inferior" mind never will. PLEASE HELP YOUR BIL!
Hi again. I got some more info from my BIL. FINALLY he broke it down for me to the best of his knowledge. He is getting a little under $300 SSDI. He said that is in stone, the govt cannot change or lower that. It is the SSI that was lowered. He says he was getting over $500 SSI, but they lowered it to only $44. Then he says they said that was a mistake, but he has to come in to the office in January. That's a long way off, and no guarantee they will rectify it, OR that he will have the proper documentation. I truly am not sure why, but it has something to do with his housing situation. He is living with a friend, and hasn't been paying him rent for months because he says he didn't have it, but I believe he did have it. He may have told SS the truth about not paying rent (although he spent money on "special foods" he insists he needs). He believes he has celiac disease, I don't know if he really does. I was supposed to have had celiac disease when I was a child, my mother gave me a special diet, but then she decided I didn't have it (after I cried enough about not having ice cream), and she gave me a regular diet. When I was an adult, I spoke to a doctor about that, and he told me that the only way to really diagnose it is to take a tissue sample of the colon, I think. I never had that one. And I am pretty sure my BIL did not have that done either.
Nevertheless, he evidently spent money on special food he claims he needs and wasn't paying his friend rent. PLUS to make it worse, his friend is a little scared because he thought my BIL would only stay a few months, but it's turning into much longer than that. And the friend is worried that he will lose the apartment. I THINK it's subsiized housing, I'll have to check that out.
He asked me if I want to see him starve, and I told him that if necessary he can either beg on the street corner with a can, or maybe even sing (he has a nice voice). He then asked if I want to see him get sick and go to the hospital (We are sending him $50, though.) I told him hopefully he will get food in the hospital. :-)
Yes, I feel sorry for my BIL, but he may be coming to his senses, since his brother and I told him that we can only afford $50 and not the $150 he asked for. AND he is beginning to make sense. BUT I was dizzy yesterday after a long angry discussion with him.
(Thanks for your response.)
I reread the post quoted again. Being I am not a fan of "alternate facts" I need to correct something else. IT is highly unlikely that your BILs' benefits are being garnished by the feds. They can take a maximum of 20% off of SSDI for unpaid taxes. They can take nothing off of SSI for unpaid taxes. They rarely take for the other things listed. I will never understand cruelty for the fun of it and I am glad that my "inferior" mind never will. PLEASE HELP YOUR BIL!
I needed the facts. Before I just send him money. As I may have said, he finally broke down and admitted he had been lying over the months. He told us he paid rent to his roommate, he apparently did not. Look, there is no way someone is going to convince me that one cannot eat properly as a single person on $300 a month. While he was supposed to pay his roommate $200, which he did not. But that took some time, I managed to speak to his roommate privately, finally. When my BIL was not there. And he told me that my BIL had NOT paid him rent for months. My BIL threatened to get even with his roommate for telling me that, and PLUS threatened me, to come and hurt me because I said something about his dear, sainted mother who put up with his shenanigans all those years. His father was also out of the house, not wanting to cope with family problems, so he worked, fought with his wife at home, and went out most of the time.
So when my BIL threatened to come and get ME -- I told him I wasn't afraid of him, but if he does that, he's sure to get himself in trouble. And maybe he'll be better off in jail. (LOL) He called me back crying, saying how sorry he was and do I forgive him. I said yes, I forgive him. But that he can't keep lying to me, and he can't get even with his roommate who has done nothing but help him. (He agreed.) So we'll keep trying. His roommate picked up the phone a few times after that and did not seem upset or troubled, so I'm assuming my BIL did not "get even" with him for telling me anything. We'll see. Thanks for your help, yes, I intend to be as kind as possible under the sad circumstances.
If he is getting more than $750/month then he cannot be getting SSI, rather it must be SSDI.
Your BIL is flat out lying to your face.
Neither SSI nor SSDI is affected by your residence. It doesn't matter where you live in the US, your SSI or SSDI payment will always be the same.
Neither SSI nor SSDI require proof of rent, and in fact, you are not obligated to pay any rent at all. You will collect the full amount for each SSI or SSDI whether you rent or whether you live with a family member or friend and pay no rent at all.
Neither SSI nor SSDI can be attached by private entities, meaning it doesn't matter how many judgments or garnishments you have against you, they cannot take the money.
However, the federal government can and does attach SSI and SSDI if you owe student loans, taxes, fines, fees or penalties, including criminal judgments and fines.
It may also be attached for back child support payments.
You don't need 40 credits to qualify for SSDI.
The number of required credits is prorated based on your age.
If you are 24 and under, you only need 6 credits, but your disability has to have started within 3 years of the last day you worked.
So, if your last day of work was June 1, 2015 and you have 6 credits and then you became disabled June 30, 2018, you don't qualify for SSDI, but you will qualify for SSI.
And, yes, it will increase in January, because SSI gets the same COLA increases OASI and OADI get.
If you're between 25 and 31 years, you only need 12 credits and then at age 32 you need 20 credits and it goes up one credit for each year thereafter.
You need to confront him and tell him he's lying, and that you know he's lying, and when he decides to stop lying, you'll discuss the matter with him further, and if he insists he's not, tell him to have a nice life and not to contact you ever again.
Aside from that, you can't force him to do anything he doesn't want to do. Moving to Brooklyn was stupid given the high Cost-of-Living compared to Florida. He needs to go back to Florida, and he probably needs a payee to manage his money for him, and social services will hook him up with that, but he has to want to go, and if he doesn't want to go, there's nothing you can do about it.
Thank you for trying to help.
According to what I understand, the SSI (not the SSDI) can be affected by one's living arrangements, if a person pays rent or not, they factor those things in.
Yes, my BIL finally admitted he was lying. That took a lot out of me to get him to tell the truth. Sad.
The counselor at a reputable foundation told me that SSI can be affected by moving from one state to the other, and in fact, my BIL finally told me it actually would go up from Florida to NY. SSDI apparently does not change from state to state.
I agree moving to Brooklyn was not necessarily a good idea, but evidently he had a long time friend in Brooklyn, and when his mother died, couldn't find a place that would take him. He says he wants to move back to Florida when he reaches 62. I agree. But he will need help to figure things out, because now it becomes a problem finding him a residence at that point, even if he has SSDI and SSI. If I can find a decent place that will take him, I will recommend it to him. Here where we live in PA, there are home-type settings where people have a room that are fairly well run. If he doesn't want to go to a decent place upon exploration, I give up. Waiting lists are long. If I don't understand something, I try to check it out. Since I am not POA and on't want to be, (or guardian) I can't check out his stories. But if it doesn't make sense, then I generally don't give money. Money is a bottom line for many people.
I am Autistic, and because of this I am a Disabilities and Autism activist. Most Autistic people have HORRENDOUS Executive function. I do, and so do, not only my fellow Autistics, but my "cousins", which I assume your BIL is.This would make it difficult if not impossible for him to figure this out on his own. I have helped many disabled people figure the ssi and ssdi out.
Your BIL is probably NOT lying, at least based on what you have written.
One, there is indeed only one across-the-board federal SSI ammount. Many states choose to supplement it, by varying ammounts, most common is $20 I think. [ I mostly help people in Colorado so I am not sure which states supplement in what ammounts] So, please, ignorance of the facts does not make a person an expert at who is a liar!
Secondly, yes, a person CAN often receive both SSI and SSDI. One person living here receives both. This is how. They are someone who DID work for a certain length of time, but even with the required quarters, their SSDI would only come to four hundred and something a month. When that happens, SSI fills in the gap to ensure that the recipient is not penalized by haviing worked. They only give enough SSI so that the SSDI and the SSI would equal the ammount the person would receive on SSI alone.
Thirdly, this is how his check was probably cut. [my executive function is now being highly effected, so I hope I can post this in a way you can understand]If for ANY reason SSI believes that someone has paid for or enabled a person on SSI to pay "less than their fair share" for rent [does not include subsidized housing for some reason] they will cut down the benefit. A simple question like "IS anyone being nice and giving you a break on the rent?" will cause that reduction.
The other less likely possibility is that he missed a reassment meeting and lost his SSI and has only his SSDI left. From what you have posted I would think the first possibility rather the the second.
PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE do not believe what the person above posted. People with mental diseases have an incredibly high suicide rate. Calling him a liar when it sounds so much like the truth and there is NO reason to misbelieve him could just trigger that in him. I am not sure what the rate of suicide is for some of my "cousins" but among my "high functioning, with at least one cognitive issue [ I have NEVER met an Autistic person without cognitive issues] is 30 years less than the average persons, and most of that is from suicide. And heart disease from all the stress.
PLEASE help your BIL. There is a lot going on in our "community' but hopefully that will be over soon and possibly he could live here. Whatever, please help him. I am BEGGING you.
Thanks for your story. We are not near him. And his story did not make sense to me. Your account has given me insight into some issues about people with autism. I have impulse control problems, so I am constantly chastising myself. I read the statement from the doctor diagnosing his mental condition (his mother finally gave it to me). Nothing about autism, but I wouldn't be surprised. It was only one meeting with the doctor, so obviously a deep diagnosis was not made. Happy to hear you are helping others to navigate the system, difficult as it is. As for calling him a liar, yes, I did that. I know some more "normal" people than I would not have done that, but I did. And because I caught him in a lie he finally admitted it. Sad to say. You're right in that sense, people don't like being called a liar, and usually I back off from such a confrontation NOW with people. Even if I think they are lying. He finally admitted he was lying and was crying about it to me. He asked me if I forgave him, and I said Yes, of course. But please don't do it again. So far I'm getting better responses from him.
You're right about the fact he is receiving SSI and SSDI> I am finally learning the difference somewhat. So far he seems to be OK, he is getting a lawyer from Legal Aid, thus he must be looking forward to that. And he is talking about moving back to Florida, so I don't think he is, or has ever been suicidal. Life is problematic and we need God's help to have a better outlook. Thanks again.
you need to get informed regarding his financial situation and support him. There is much to know.
If he isn't in a low income apartment complex, he needs to be. Start there.
Yes, we'll talk about that as soon as I can understand what he's saying. He is usually hysterical, and has confessed to often lying to us, so now I don't think he's lying, but that has only been a few days. We'll see. I will try to help him. Thanks.
My brother in law is on disability soc security. I think that's what it's called. He applied some years ago and was getting $770 a month. He tells me that they reduced it to $550 because he moved from Florida to Brooklyn, and then they reduced it more because he cannot prove he is paying rent. I find that difficult to believe. But I am not sure. He is asking for $$, and we've been having problems with him. His mother died, she used to take care of him. I feel bad that he is so ill (mentally), but we can't keep giving him money if I don't understand the situation.
Does anybody know if soc. sec. disability can reduce payments because they claim you're not paying rent? That's what he's telling us.
The only time SS reduces/eliminates payments if if the individual works too many hours or has been deemed to be not disabled. If your BIL is on Supplemental Security Income (SSI,) the rules may be different. I'm not sure. I'm on disability and I'm sure those are the rules about the disability end. Rent or lack thereof has no bearing.
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