Family moving from DC to Bay (Oakland, Concord: apartments, rental, condos)

[eka]

I am considering an opportunity to relocate to the Bay Area from northern Virginia and would appreciate some advice from knowledgeable forumers. I would earn a decent salary (low $200s), and I could put $300k down on a home. In most of the country, I'd be sitting pretty, but with a spouse and five kids to think of (ages 4 to 14), finding good housing options in the Bay Area is much more complicated. Here's my ideal scenario:

• <= 60-minute commute to Financial District on transit (BART/bus/ferry -- I have no desire to drive alone.)
• At least 2,000 sq ft or room to add on (We'll be "simplifying" from 5,800 sq ft.)
• $800k purchase or purchase + renovation price (I enjoy fixing up older homes, but want something livable.)
• Safe, walkable neighborhood with lots of children (The latter are notably absent from our Virginia neighborhood.)
• Close to Trader Joe's, Sprouts, or other ogranic market (We like good food, but not Whole Foods prices.)
• Convenient access to parks, recreation, libraries, arts (We especially like to participate in community theater and choral groups.)

Local schools are not too important since we plan to use an independent study charter school. We're motivated to move to escape northeastern winters, be closer to family in adjacent, but colder states, and to find more friendly and open-minded neighbors. Am I dreaming? Where do the large families live?

We may rent initially to get a better feel for the area, so I'd appreciate rental advice as well. Thanks much!

[comingbacktocali]

you may want to check out Brisbane. we just bought a house there. a hidden gem if you ask me!

[CirclingLogan]

Grand Lake/Lakeshore in Oakland.

Right off of beautiful Lake Merritt in Oakland, it's currently transitioning from pleasant, middle class to fashionable upper-middle class neighborhood. Adjacent to Piedmont, Piedmont Ave., Crocker Highlands and Adam's Point, which are all solid, safe areas. You could look into those neighborhoods as well, though Piedmont and Crocker Highlands are likely outside of your price range, and Adam's Point is more apartment-dominated. Piedmont Ave. area would be good though. Don't let the Oakland reputation worry you too much. This is a far nicer area than you'd find in SF or the Peninsula for the same price.

Very family-friendly w/ many single-family homes, but also a good mix of apartments as well, which keeps things more lively. Very walkable, with a Trader Joe's, Safeway, Grand Lake Movie Theater, and dozens of cafes, shops and restaurants. You'll see plenty of children. Plenty of parks and libraries around. A bit far from ferry or BART, but should be no problem grabbing public bus, commuter shuttle or casual carpool. Your budget may still be strained, but some friends of mine bought 3-bedroom with walk-out basement for $750k a year ago.

Not many good DC-area comparisons, but structurally, at least, it sort of reminds me of the Cleveland Park/Woodley Park area. Not as white and stuffy, though. Very diverse and progressive (though getting more whiter and wealthier).

People will tell you about El Cerrito and Albany, but most people move there for the schools. If that's not something you're worried about, the nicer neighborhoods of Oakland are far more cosmopolitan and interesting. Speaking of, you could look into Temescal and Rockridge area of Oakland as well. Rockridge is likely too pricey, though and I don't think Temescal offers as good of a value as Grand Lake, but it is right on BART. You could try Berkeley, but it's fairly pricey and I suppose you could look way out at the Walnut Creek area, but that's very Fairfax County-like, so if you're looking for open-minded neighbors, I wouldn't recommend it.

[jade408]

Originally Posted by CirclingLogan

Grand Lake/Lakeshore in Oakland.

Right off of beautiful Lake Merritt in Oakland, it's currently transitioning from pleasant, middle class to fashionable upper-middle class neighborhood. Adjacent to Piedmont, Piedmont Ave., Crocker Highlands and Adam's Point, which are all solid, safe areas. You could look into those neighborhoods as well, though Piedmont and Crocker Highlands are likely outside of your price range, and Adam's Point is more apartment-dominated. Piedmont Ave. area would be good though. Don't let the Oakland reputation worry you too much. This is a far nicer area than you'd find in SF or the Peninsula for the same price.

Good suggestions here! There are lots of large homes mixed in in Adams Point. Also you might find a few in Cleveland Heights.

Another note, Sprouts is coming soon to Oakland at about 30th/Broadway. I think it is slated to open next spring.

Those areas around the lake, are about a 40 minute bus to commute on the NL bus. And there is casual carpool as well. Bus to BART would work out to be about 30-35 minutes too.

Also check out the Glenview and the Dimond. These areas are a little cheaper than Trestle Glen and Crocker Highlands. A bit less walkable, they both have a pretty well stocked main street, and are about a 40 minute bus commute too. If you are adjacent to main street it is an easy walk, but outside of main street it gets a little hilly fast. You can walk, but you'll hit a good sized hill. There are sidewalks though.

[artemis78]

Originally Posted by CirclingLogan

Grand Lake/Lakeshore in Oakland.

Right off of beautiful Lake Merritt in Oakland, it's currently transitioning from pleasant, middle class to fashionable upper-middle class neighborhood. Adjacent to Piedmont, Piedmont Ave., Crocker Highlands and Adam's Point, which are all solid, safe areas. You could look into those neighborhoods as well, though Piedmont and Crocker Highlands are likely outside of your price range, and Adam's Point is more apartment-dominated. Piedmont Ave. area would be good though. Don't let the Oakland reputation worry you too much. This is a far nicer area than you'd find in SF or the Peninsula for the same price.

Very family-friendly w/ many single-family homes, but also a good mix of apartments as well, which keeps things more lively. Very walkable, with a Trader Joe's, Safeway, Grand Lake Movie Theater, and dozens of cafes, shops and restaurants. You'll see plenty of children. Plenty of parks and libraries around. A bit far from ferry or BART, but should be no problem grabbing public bus, commuter shuttle or casual carpool. Your budget may still be strained, but some friends of mine bought 3-bedroom with walk-out basement for $750k a year ago.

Actually Adams Point would be my top pick--it has some gorgeous older mansions that go for far less than I always think they should (mainly because the schools are mediocre). Sometimes they have been divided into duplexes and you'll need to do some work to recombine them (so be sure to look at multi-family listings for that reason), but they are often gorgeous. You are very near Grand Lake, where there are tons of kids.

The main challenge in the Bay Area is that the neighborhoods with the most kids are where the top schools are (unsurprisingly) and command the highest prices. The trick is to be adjacent to these areas, but over the school lines if you don't need schools so that you aren't paying the school premium, and in areas where there are large older homes. Adams Point and Piedmont Avenue are both great for that. You might also luck out in the area between Grand and Lakeshore Avenues. Once you get east of there, you're into coveted school zones that people pay crazy premiums for, so it doesn't work as well.

Very walkable, relatively easy commute to the city (you can walk or bike to BART, or take commuter buses), great little library branch, Children's Fairyland (which runs a children's community theater program for kids interested in drama), amazing park space at Lake Merritt, TJ's with Sprouts coming soon in addition to several small local produce markets--seems to tick all your boxes. Good luck!

[CirclingLogan]

All points made above are solid.

My only hesitancy about Adams Point is a somewhat shallow one. Much of the interior of the neighborhood is dominated by apartment buildings, with many being somewhat drab 1960s development (think flat plaster and garage doors). Not *bad* in any substantive way, just not the most aesthetically pleasing. It also doesn't have direct access to a buzzing commercial strip as Piedmont Ave, Grand Lake or Lakeshore (though it's close to many).

[04kL4nD]

Parking sucks big time in Adams Point too.

[artemis78]

Those are all true too, but are other reasons Adams Point doesn't command the same prices as Grand Lake or Piedmont Ave--you can't get a 2000+ sf house that's not a complete fixer for $800K in those neighborhoods anymore, sadly. The upside is that you are just a few blocks from the lake, and the vibrancy of the neighborhood commercial district along Lower Grand has improved significantly in recent years. But you do have to walk 15-20 minutes to get to the more buzzed-about commercial districts--Uptown, Grand Lake/Lakeshore, and Piedmont Ave are all within a mile or so. (I would not buy a place without parking, though--luckily almost all of the single-family homes have at least off-street parking, if not garages, but street parking is definitely a nightmare.)

[eka]

Thanks for the feedback, everyone! I am very intrigued by up and coming Oakland neighborhoods and will definitely give them a close look. Despite my comments about walking and transit, however, I think my wife and kids may still be more comfortable in a more suburban setting. Any thoughts on the Walnut Creek - Concord corridor? What's the local nomenclature? Diablo Valley?

[jade408]

Definitely poke around Oakland. There are areas that are denser but they aren't skyscraper dominant and feel fairly suburban albeit with smaller lots. Adams Point has tree lined streets and people walking their dogs.

Walnut Creek is likely out of budget. Pleasant Hill and Concord might be. Logistically, BART could be annoying since plesant hill Bart has mostly condos in walking distance and the wait for a parking permit is about 2 years. Parking fills up by about 7 or 7:15 in the umpermitted spots. Concord BART is a similar story.

You might be able to find a fixer in Alameda. Or try El Cerrito. Both also have bus access to sf and are more suburban.