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I'm looking at a potential role at Amazon. I'll be based at the Boren Avenue campus.
For personal reasons, we'd like to get out of Minnesota for weather and commute primarily and Amazon really appeals to me professionally so we have motivation to relocate. We also love hiking and biking and this really dropped off when we moved from California to Minnesota. We're British, so found California to also be expensive and accept Seattle is too.
1) What areas should I absolutely avoid looking at? I realize some places are a none starter due to the cost of real estate like Belleview and Issaquah. Others like Kent apparently have gangs/drugs? This true?
2) What areas are served by local colleges that do dual credit? Any to avoid?
3) If I was to commute from far out, which freeways choke up and at what time does this happen? Example I commute 36 miles from south to north right now and can get to my destination in under 50 minutes (without snow) but I leave at 6.30 am in order to accomplish this. If I left at 8.00 am it would be an extra 20 or 30 minutes. With snow I can tack on 2-3 hours each way.
4) I90 is a toll road I believe, what's the cost of that daily? Is there a monthly pass I can get that makes it cheaper?
Looking for a 4 bed home that doesn't cost the earth.
Thanks!
Last edited by mazzer; 03-17-2015 at 11:40 AM..
Reason: added a statement
I'm looking at a potential role at Amazon. I'll be based at the Boren Avenue campus.
For personal reasons, we'd like to get out of Minnesota for weather and commute primarily and Amazon really appeals to me professionally so we have motivation to relocate. We also love hiking and biking and this really dropped off when we moved from California to Minnesota. We're British, so found California to also be expensive and accept Seattle is too.
1) What areas should I absolutely avoid looking at? I realize some places are a none starter due to the cost of real estate like Belleview and Issaquah. Others like Kent apparently have gangs/drugs? This true?
2) What areas are served by local colleges that do dual credit? Any to avoid?
3) If I was to commute from far out, which freeways choke up and at what time does this happen? Example I commute 36 miles from south to north right now and can get to my destination in under 50 minutes (without snow) but I leave at 6.30 am in order to accomplish this. If I left at 8.00 am it would be an extra 20 or 30 minutes. With snow I can tack on 2-3 hours each way.
4) I90 is a toll road I believe, what's the cost of that daily? Is there a monthly pass I can get that makes it cheaper?
Thanks!
1. A bit more information on your housing needs, preferences and budget would be very useful. There are good neighborhoods and bad neighborhoods in virtually every city in the region; labeling places as "no-go" because of drugs or gangs is using too broad a brush.
2. Note sure what you mean by "dual credit." Do you mean colleges where you can transfer credits from another institution? Most allow that, but again more specifics will help. Seattle has several major universities and there are numerous "community colleges" in the region, most with reciprocal relationships for transfer students.
3. For single-occupant vehicles, no major highways are exempt from rush hour traffic. A 36-mile commute from pretty much anywhere to Amazonia will take upwards of an hour most days, and could well be longer depending on the specifics. However there is plenty of affordable real estate well inside that time/distance contour, so again, see question no. 1.
4. I-90 is not tolled, SR 520 (the northern bridge across Lake Washington) IS tolled. At peak times the toll is either $3.00 or $3.80 each way with an electronic sensor, $4.60 or $5.40 without (they mail you a bill.)
All of the freeways choke up. If you find a section that doesn't currently don't bet on it staying that way. I-90 (non-toll by the way) is probably the most open at this point, but with all of the building going on east of Bellevue I wouldn't expect that to last for long. Issaquah is already a huge bottleneck. People moving here thinking there's some inexpensive area 36 miles out with a good commute are in for a bad surprise. If the commute was good, it would be just as expensive as any other area with a good commute.
More important: Do you have kids in school or plan to soon? That will determine which areas are 'good' and 'bad' in your search.
The impression I get is a lot of the Amazon people choose to live in Seattle, not far out in the burbs. Some do, but the in city neighborhoods are being overrun with Amazon transplants the past few years. That seems to be the point of putting the campus in SLU instead of building a big suburban campus the way companies did back in the 80's and 90's. The in city neighborhoods are't really all that urban once you get outside of downtown. If you've ruled them out for some reason, I'd reconsider. There are a lot of nice neighborhoods in the city that are older but offer a good variety of housing choices, as well as new houses. New houses tend to be just as expensive as Bellevue and more expensive than Issaquah however.
36 miles is what I do currently and I'd like to reduce that if possible. I did 120 round commute in LA and that was painful but could be done in an hour. Just comparing nightmare journeys to get a baseline on what you mean by nightmare commute in Seattle!
4 beds would be realistic for us and we do have kids, so schools would be realistic and we have some ideas of where goods ones are at, obviously realize poor school districts and home prices are reflective.
Toll road prices would add a significant cost to my daily commute at those sort of costs!
In terms of burbs vs city we've never lived in the city before but wouldn't be opposed to that if we can find somewhere reasonably priced. I really liked the look of West Seattle, the northern part looks really nice, but we're priced out of that area.
We've found any number of homes we can afford (and we're using 250-425 as our search filter) dotted around the Seattle districts, using Amazon as the starting point and trying to reduce my commute, working back in - Tacoma (which is really too far), Auburn, Des Moines, Kent, Tukwila, SeaTac, White Center and then north of Amazon Edmonds and Lynwood. Beyond those areas East Renton and Snoquamlme have a couple of possible homes. Of these areas some have good schools others not so. Depending on advice from other forums, SeaTac, Kent, Auburn are to be avoided due to crime or poor schools. Lynwood appears to be the next Bothell for recommended community for decent schools and homes at nearly affordable prices.
Location: East of Seattle since 1992, 615' Elevation, Zone 8b - originally from SF Bay Area
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With our traffic, a 36 mile commute can be over an hour, depending on the time of day and how much is on freeway vs city streets with long lights. I commute 23 miles, and when I drive it's 40 minutes in the morning, 55+ in the afternoon. That's working 6:30am-2:30pm, it was worse when I started later. The "commute hour" here lasts several hours, because the large employers such as Microsoft, Boeing and Amazon have people starting at different times. Other than a few pockets none of the cities mentioned have serious crime, mostly it's property crime and minor, but a lot of it, such as car prowls. I wouldn't recommend Seatac at all but Kent and Auburn both have nice areas. Lynnwood actually has brand new homes in your price range. Being near the mall doesn't help with the crime rate but the residential areas themselves are fine. Most people look at the school ratings sites and would consider the schools there to be pretty low at 6-7 compared to the more expensive areas at 9-10, but hopefully people with kids there will comment.
My office is right next to the new Amazon campus and I live in Maple Valley.
I catch the Sounder from Kent and it is a short 20 minute drive to the free parking garage. Then it's a short 20 minute ride on the train and then across the street to the transit tunnel and then a light rail/bus ride to Westlake Center and a short walk to work.
Overall, my commute is 75 minutes at the cost of $7.00/day ($126/mo) and it is reimbursed by my employer.
Median housing cost here is around $350K and Tahoma is a top notch school district.
Most of the places you're naming are going to have a nasty commute (i.e. over an hour on a good day unless you are right next to the light rail, etc.). 4 bedrooms is your price range is honestly not realistic for the area unless you're willing to either a) have a nasty commute or b) take on a major fixer-upper.
Our real estate prices are gnarly, more-so as you move closer to Amazon. My husband works for Amazon. We're 5 miles from his work and his commute is 20 minutes in the AM. In the PM, it's 45 minutes. He can bus, but that, too, is a 45 minute commute after the bus changeover.
Living close, along a bus or public transit route is crucial--which is something we didn't know when we moved here 2 years ago. Large doesn't happen in the city without the price being $$$$. Case in point, we came from a 3000 sq. ft. 4 bedroom home that cost us $164K. 2 years later, we moved here. Our tiny, tiny 1100 sq. ft. 2 bedroom condo cost us $300K, and that was during the low spot. Our condo is now valued at $450-$470K.
If you want everything on your checklist (good schools, 4 bedroom, good commute, etc.), you're going to need a MUCH bigger budget.
My two cents about Kent, etc:
Many of the towns in the south suburbs get tarnished with a broad brush. Kent and Auburn have some very nice areas with good schools. But they also have small areas with more run down houses, poverty, higher crime, and bad schools. These areas ( the good and the bad) are not near each other. In a place like Sammamish, there's not a whole lot of economic diversity, there's a homogeneity ( is that a word?) that a lot of people want. Kent is different. Most people in Kent do not work in the tech industry. I have an attorney friend who lives in Kent, who chose to live in Kent because of the lower housing costs, and that he works in Tukwila. He and his wife do not have school aged children. But if they did, they could have found parts of Kent that have good schools. Crime exists everywhere, and in Kent it's pretty concentrated on the East Hill and downtown. If you're living in the NE part of Kent near the Renton border, it's typical suburban, and there are no gangs running around, or people dealing drugs on street corners.
You might not like the commute. You might not like the fact that none of your neighbors designs software. But I really wouldn't worry about gangs. I'd also throw SE Renton into the mix, the part that is in the Kent school district, as the best schools in the Kent school district have Renton addresses.
And if you can bear an hour commute, Maple Valley is a good choice.
36 miles is what I do currently and I'd like to reduce that if possible. I did 120 round commute in LA and that was painful but could be done in an hour. Just comparing nightmare journeys to get a baseline on what you mean by nightmare commute in Seattle!
4 beds would be realistic for us and we do have kids, so schools would be realistic and we have some ideas of where goods ones are at, obviously realize poor school districts and home prices are reflective.
Toll road prices would add a significant cost to my daily commute at those sort of costs!
In terms of burbs vs city we've never lived in the city before but wouldn't be opposed to that if we can find somewhere reasonably priced. I really liked the look of West Seattle, the northern part looks really nice, but we're priced out of that area.
We've found any number of homes we can afford (and we're using 250-425 as our search filter) dotted around the Seattle districts, using Amazon as the starting point and trying to reduce my commute, working back in - Tacoma (which is really too far), Auburn, Des Moines, Kent, Tukwila, SeaTac, White Center and then north of Amazon Edmonds and Lynwood. Beyond those areas East Renton and Snoquamlme have a couple of possible homes. Of these areas some have good schools others not so. Depending on advice from other forums, SeaTac, Kent, Auburn are to be avoided due to crime or poor schools. Lynwood appears to be the next Bothell for recommended community for decent schools and homes at nearly affordable prices.
Thanks again.
I'd look at schools and school pyramids vs school districts. Seattle as a district is middle of the pack, but some of the school pyramids are far better than even the highest rated individual districts. The catch is that these areas are generally just as expensive as any other with high rated schools. Unfortunately, starter homes are generally around $600K now.
I think the days of buying a decent 4 bedroom house with a decent commute in an area of good schools around here for under $425K are largely gone. Possible exception are fixer-uppers in Bothell where I think you can still find an ugly, neglected 1950s-1980's house in the mid $300's and have a fairly nice place for about $425K after renovating. Doubtful that will be the case for long.
As for West Seattle - if you're considering Lynnwood, some of the less expensive parts of West Seattle (not right on the north tip) have similar schools. The houses won't be as new as what you'd get in Lynnwood for the same money, but there are some deals out there if you're not hunting for the absolute top rated schools in the area. Bottom line though, $425K just doesn't leave you with many options anymore if you want to commute to downtown.
My husband can bike to work from Ballard in about 30 minutes (we live 6-7 miles from work). He works within 1 mile of Amazon. If he drives, however, the drive home is usually longer and has been an hour. An hour to go 6-7 miles. With the mountains and water there are lots of bridges and bottle necked highways that can't be widened. There is no where to go, so you will just sit in traffic, unless you take the train. I used to work next to Amazon and it took me 20 minutes with no traffic to drive to work. If I was to take the bus I would have had to transfer and it would have taken over an hour. I tell you all this to give you an idea of how bad the commutes are around here.
Because of those commutes, the closer to the city, the more expensive the house. Our house has doubled in value in 13 years. We could not afford to buy in our neighborhood if we were looking today. It was noted on the radio the other day that our traffic delays increased by 100% in the last 4 years. Four years!! And loads of people are still moving here.
I'm telling you this because I don't think you have a realistic view of our traffic and housing prices and it is a very big move to make without a realistic view. Keep digging for more info before you leap. Good luck!
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