Public versus Catholic School (St. Louis, Webster Groves: cliquey, homes, neighborhood)

[olivetree123]

We are new to St.Louis, coming from a very big, multicultural, diverse city. We cannot afford private school, but we can manage the lower tuition of a Catholic school and public schools are obviously an option.

We have been attending an established Webster Groves/Glendale parish and are now considering the school for our kids. However, we cannot help but feel that the Catholic school is VERY conservative and not particularly open minded. There seem to be very few new families. I am kept up at night by the thought that our grade two son may be excluded by all these kids that seem so tight with one another.

Please help!

QUESTION ONE. Do tell - are the Catholic schools here that conservative? We were in a big city Catholic school before and it seemed more diverse and welcoming.

QUESTION TWO. What about public schools? There is decently ranked public school in our area that is suffering from over crowding and plummeting MAP scores. We are caring, involved parents which leads me to believe that we could work through any potential inadequacies. The scores are discouraging, as our the throngs of children that meander the lawn after school. Thoughts? Is security an issue?

Any help would be so very appreciated. It has been a stressful time as we are so unfamiliar with the system.

Thank you!

[zach_33]

Wow, I've always heard great things (about the elementary schools in particular) in WG/Glendale - Bristol Elementary, Avery, Clark-- all very good reputations. Oh well, one never can be sure until they are actually faced with sending their kid to one how they really feel about a given school.

The most diverse/progressive Catholic school I have heard of is St. Margaret of Scotland in the Shaw neighborhood of St. Louis. Lots of professional folks who live in Shaw, Tower Grove, and Compton Heights choose to send their kids there, even if they aren't Catholic from what I have been told.

But by and large, yeah, STL Catholics are conservative (not like ultra conservative, but typical midwestern moderate conservative) and can definitely come across as insular and cliquey. Whether they really are or not is subject to debate, but I would choose to avoid that whole scene if I lived in Glendale/WG personally.

[billiken]

Hmmm, interesting to hear your thoughts on WG schools. When we lived there, the general impression was that the district was pretty solid (but we didn't have kids yet).

[STLviaMSP]

Stick with the public schools. They are only as good as the families that use and invest in them. Webster and basically all the southwest suburbs of STL have solid to excellent public schools, and besides, your tax dollars are paying for them, so why pay out of pocket for the socially insular (and quite likely inferior due to fewer resources) product you'd get in private/Catholic? In the city, the main problem is that the regular public schools are (for the most part) very poor, black monoculture, e.g zero diversity plus loads of disruptive poverty problems that can make them a poor fit for smart, socioeconomically stable students of any race despite the best efforts of teachers and staff. That said, if your kid can get past the entrance requirements for the gifted schools (Kennard, Mallinckrodt) or through the magnet school lottery, the city also has a handful of the best schools, public or otherwise, in the region.

[olivetree123]

Thanks so much for your replies. I was embarassed to be asking, and so grateful for your input! Avery/Bristol/Clark do seem like solid schools, but they are having trouble with numbers and space.

[flynavyj]

My wife and I were products of Catholic schools and plan to use them for our children as well. The Catholic schools do suffer from massive drops in enrollment over the last few decades, which has really hurt the districts overall, and caused the schools to lose some of their programs especially as they compared to surrounding public schools. If lots of extracurricular activities are important, Public schools will win out hands down. Private schools tend to offer small class sizes which can provide more individual attention, a sense of belonging with the small school student body, and a more traditional education.

With regards to your child's "conservativeness/liberalism" much of that will be founded at home with you the parents. Your children will typically look to you for guidance, and will occasionally bump heads with administration depending on how vocal they are about "their/your" beliefs, and how vocal the administration is on pushing their own agendas. Most religious activities don't stretch to far into the political realm, but it isn't uncommon especially on issues such as abortion...gay marriage and other social issues can come up, but I'd say it's pretty rare.

When in grade school the abortion issue came up a couple times in class, a student who was brought up to be pro-life confronted a teacher who admitted to voting for a clearly pro-choice democratic president. The teacher's response was simply "To me, the issue of this election was larger than that one issue"...honestly, I'd be equally as concerned about excessively conservative educators as I would about excessively liberal ones...the old recording of students at an elementary school singing "Barack Hussein Obama, um, um, um" was a bit creepy to me...and i'm pretty middle of the road on the political spectrum. Indoctrination into any political groups should be at the discretion of the parents...and not any administrations.

[linicx]

The biggest difference between Catholic and public is the system they use to educate. As I understand it the Church has two systems. You may or may not like one or both. In theory public schools teach the same subjects each quarter nationally.. therefore if you move your child from MO to Iowa you child will not be behind or a head of his classmates.

In any case the parent who is involved with the child, homework, school activities, friends, teachers and school board from K-12 will have a child who is more prepared for the rigors of college life.

[linicx]

For the doubter I would say to question, research, and investigate. One can find much in regards to different types of education on the web including pre-school and homeschool. I knew nothing about the Catholic school systems until I visited the website of several local parish websites. I think homeschool offers more diversity as it is not as tightly structured. ASFAIK Missouri still tests its homeschooled children yearly.

[zach_33]

there is a story in the dispatch today re:growth in WG elementary schools. Confirms the over-crowding concern.

More students, less space in Webster Groves schools : News

Are the MAP scores really declining? That would be a concern for me. It is kind of hard to tell using the online search tool if there is really a significant decline, and impossible to tell what might be causing it (if a decline actually is happening).

Missouri Comprehensive Data System - District Info

[st. louie louie]

If you're going to live in the city...

Magnet vs. Catholic school...
Both schools are in good physical shape.
Both schools have good equipment.
Both schools have good curriculums.
Both schools have dedicated teachers.
However...
After two years of my kids going to the magnet school, the Catholic school is by far the better option.
The magnet schools lack a family community,
like minded families, the extracurricular activities from sports to singing that the Catholic schools possess.

Check out St. Margaret of Scotland and St Roch's
Forward thinking, education driven, diverse schools.