Texas: A Shopping Paradise (Houston, Dallas: purchaser, bankrupt, income)

[james5219]

Originally Posted by lonestar1963

Once again, I respect your point of view but disagree. My hope from the original post was to get perspective on why Houston is growing and maintaining luxury retail better than Dallas right now. Any thoughts out there on why Dallas isn't growing luxury retail as quickly and doesn't maintain it as well as Houston? Also any insight on true luxury retailers like Kiton, Chopard, John Lobb, or Van Cleef & Arpels that might be coming to Dallas would be appreciated.

Hi, new here but I think I can kind of answer your question. Dallas isn't seeing as much growth as Houston, in my opinion, just because there isn't the space for it. While Houston has seen 300k SF+ of luxury retail come online in the past year, in Dallas, no major center has opened or expanded recently and space is fully booked at the two established retail centers - Highland Park Village and NorthPark. Dallas is still seeing some great openings like Céline, Etro, Christofle, Canali, Longchamp, Fendi, Rimowa, etc. but the space just isn't there. Also, a lot of Dallas' growth is centered on contemporary brands who are newer and don't hold as much weight as older brands but are still great (Bandier, Tory Sport, Theory, SuitSupply, Shinola, Filson, AG, Alice & Olivia, STAG, Aesop, Outdoor Voices, John Varvatos, AllSaints, Johnny Was, Nars, Rebecca Taylor).

Of the brands you mentioned closing, most have been closed for a while now and shuttered during the downturn in the economy in 2008-2010. The others (Thomas Pink & Tourneau) were one of the few surviving luxury brands at Galleria Dallas, and I think the closing can be blamed less on them and more on the mall as a whole underperforming. Galleria Dallas has lost its luster the past years and it just can't support high end brands anymore besides the big ones - that ship has sailed to NorthPark and HPV.

[lonestar1963]

Great insight, and thanks! It definitely explains the lack of growth. What about the inability of Dallas to maintain stores that Houston continues to maintain? I'm particularly interested in why a store like Tourbillon closed at Northpark last week but continues to maintain at the Houston Galleria? It just seems stores shutter at Dallas' top performing mall more frequently than they do at Houston's top
perfoming mall.

[smuboy86]

Originally Posted by lonestar1963

Great insight, and thanks! It definitely explains the lack of growth. What about the inability of Dallas to maintain stores that Houston continues to maintain? I'm particularly interested in why a store like Tourbillon closed at Northpark last week but continues to maintain at the Houston Galleria? It just seems stores shutter at Dallas' top performing mall more frequently than they do at Houston's top
perfoming mall.

Northpark as a whole wants unique, or flagship experiences. What exactly did tourbillon carry that isn't available as at least one other retailer in the mall or multiple stores in the dallas region? How was their customer service? Dallas consumers are used to receiving some of the best customer service in the world. What did they do to earn customer loyalty? There is a reason Neimans and Nordstrom have succeeded where Saks and barney's have failed.

[Yellow pool of piddle]

Originally Posted by james5219

Hi, new here but I think I can kind of answer your question. Dallas isn't seeing as much growth as Houston, in my opinion, just because there isn't the space for it. While Houston has seen 300k SF+ of luxury retail come online in the past year, in Dallas, no major center has opened or expanded recently and space is fully booked at the two established retail centers - Highland Park Village and NorthPark. Dallas is still seeing some great openings like Céline, Etro, Christofle, Canali, Longchamp, Fendi, Rimowa, etc. but the space just isn't there. Also, a lot of Dallas' growth is centered on contemporary brands who are newer and don't hold as much weight as older brands but are still great (Bandier, Tory Sport, Theory, SuitSupply, Shinola, Filson, AG, Alice & Olivia, STAG, Aesop, Outdoor Voices, John Varvatos, AllSaints, Johnny Was, Nars, Rebecca Taylor).

Of the brands you mentioned closing, most have been closed for a while now and shuttered during the downturn in the economy in 2008-2010. The others (Thomas Pink & Tourneau) were one of the few surviving luxury brands at Galleria Dallas, and I think the closing can be blamed less on them and more on the mall as a whole underperforming. Galleria Dallas has lost its luster the past years and it just can't support high end brands anymore besides the big ones - that ship has sailed to NorthPark and HPV.

The Galleria Dallas should be back on the rise after the reconstruction of the LBJ freeway. Dallas is a much more dynamic luxury market than Houston. We aren't talking about the size and growth of the metropolitan areas, but the surrounding market which is substantially larger in North Texas.
There are four major luxury shopping districts in Dallas. As you said, North Park and Highland Park Village are two of them. Another major luxury district is downtown around the Joule hotel, the original Neiman Marcus department store, and a new 37,000 square foot Forty-Five-Ten department store. Finally, the area around The Crescent could end up surpassing the prestiege of both Highland Park Village and NorthPark Center.

[james5219]

Originally Posted by lonestar1963

Great insight, and thanks! It definitely explains the lack of growth. What about the inability of Dallas to maintain stores that Houston continues to maintain? I'm particularly interested in why a store like Tourbillon closed at Northpark last week but continues to maintain at the Houston Galleria? It just seems stores shutter at Dallas' top performing mall more frequently than they do at Houston's top
perfoming mall.

No problem! I agree that NorthPark really focuses on stores that offer something not available in the market - Tourbillon primarily offered brands like Harry Winston, Omega & Swatch that all had stores in Dallas or others that were available at Neimans down the way. Same is true for Intermix. Galleria Houston has 2.2m leasable square footage vs. NorthPark's 1.8m so its got more space for a larger diversity of brands and multiple selling points for sure.

Some stores also struggle because Dallas has a very strong loyalty to Neiman's, and so when other multibrand stores come in, it takes a lot of effort for the community to start shopping there. They have to have a high level of community interaction in the form of events, sponsorships, etc. I feel like Houston doesn't place as much emphasis on that sort of PaperCity magazine lifestyle, so maybe that's why stores have an easier time gaining the customer's acceptance there.

Yellow pool,
hopefully the Galleria does make a comeback, that would be great! Super excited to see what happens in the downtown area as well, Forty Five Ten should have a huge impact.

[TheOverdog]

the Galleria does make a comeback, that would be great!

Dallas Galleria is not going to make a comeback until the Midtown project brings some new high income back to the area. It's draining out right now, through a huge hole to uptown Dallas and major corporate partners in the towers are moving to northern suburbs.

The construction during the 635 rebuild probably made it a little worse as it kept some people away, but now a higher speed freeway allows people to zip past. Same difference.

[Yellow pool of piddle]

Originally Posted by TheOverdog

Dallas Galleria is not going to make a comeback until the Midtown project brings some new high income back to the area. It's draining out right now, through a huge hole to uptown Dallas and major corporate partners in the towers are moving to northern suburbs.

The construction during the 635 rebuild probably made it a little worse as it kept some people away, but now a higher speed freeway allows people to zip past. Same difference.

The situation with the Galleria Dallas is very similar to what happened to NorthPark during the lengthy reconstruction of Central Expressway. The falling off of business happened a few years before the start of reconstruction and the uptick of it a few years before its completion.
The amount of retail that once existed around the Dallas Galleria is mind boggling. To the east a half mile away was Valley View. To the west was the North Dallas Design District which was the largest collection of furniture and home furnishing stores in the nation. A mile and a half to the north was both the Prestonwood Town Center and the Sakowitz Village shopping center.
After the falling off of this area, luxury then refocused in the Willowbend Mall following Neiman Marcus relocation from Prestonwoood to it.
This is why I said that Dallas is a much more dynamic luxury market than Houston. In Houston, over the last fifty years, luxury has focused around the Houston Galleria.

[madrone2k]

I think the reason for Houston having more luxury-retail openings recently is a consequence of the boom here, up to 2014-2015. Quite a few of the high-end stores that opened here in 2015-2016 were already in the works during the prior boom period.

It will be interesting to see how The (Houston) Galleria and River Oaks District fare in their competition for high-end stores. I'm skeptical about the viability of having so many open during the economic slowdown that is occurring here (Houston) now.

That said, The Galleria here continues to get a lot of business from wealthy Mexicans who fly in for shopping trips, often combined with visits to the Texas Medical Center.

By the way, a high-end jewelry store (out of Dallas) in River Oaks District suffered a smash-and-grab robbery in broad daylight earlier this month. The layout of that place seems more conducive to quick-getaways, compared to The Galleria ... although I think some have happened there, also.

[Yellow pool of piddle]

Originally Posted by madrone2k

I think the reason for Houston having more luxury-retail openings recently is a consequence of the boom here, up to 2014-2015. Quite a few of the high-end stores that opened here in 2015-2016 were already in the works during the prior boom period.

It will be interesting to see how The (Houston) Galleria and River Oaks District fare in their competition for high-end stores. I'm skeptical about the viability of having so many open during the economic slowdown that is occurring here (Houston) now.

That said, The Galleria here continues to get a lot of business from wealthy Mexicans who fly in for shopping trips, often combined with visits to the Texas Medical Center.

By the way, a high-end jewelry store (out of Dallas) in River Oaks District suffered a smash-and-grab robbery in broad daylight earlier this month. The layout of that place seems more conducive to quick-getaways, compared to The Galleria ... although I think some have happened there, also.

We speak of luxury today as an import. According to Brian Bolke of Forty-Five-Ten fame, thirty years ago, luxury was being exported from the United States from two areas with they being New York City and Dallas. Women in the south and around Dallas weren't afraid to wear white is the reason he gave. In other words, women's fashion was the sledge hammer that the city of Dallas welded in terms of luxury. Dallas set the scale. It has long established its own luxury as it has long been, like Atlanta and Chicago, a primary showcase for it. Over the years, the United States has converted over from being makers of products to making very few products.

Meanwhile, Dallas lost its garment industry. This,in turn, has hurt the area in terms of women's fashion.

Houston today isn't creating its own luxury, but is importing it. What Dallas is still famous for are those numerous boutiques which aren't quite luxury, but are bubbling at the surface of it.

[TheOverdog]

After the falling off of this area, luxury then refocused in the Willowbend Mall following Neiman Marcus relocation from Prestonwoood to it.

What? The Willowbend Mall in west Plano has been struggling for a long time, and even today it's not a luxury mall, it's a middle income mall. Additional housing in that area (wow, there's a pattern here) will move it upscale, but it wouldn't surprise me if instead of moving into the mall, the upscale stores move into sites next to Toyota in the Legacy West area. Which is where Telsa is going, for example. The mall itself admits as much, attempting to diversify by tearing down a long empty Saks Fifth Avenue store for a hotel.

BTW, the difference between Dallas and Houston is that Houston is adding boatloads of population in Houston-proper, while in the last decade Dallas-proper barely added any people. The metro area took all the growth, and shopping followed the rooftops north.

Dallas itself finally realized that was dumb, and are really turning it around since 2012 or so.