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Good Afternoon, Texans
New to the forum, have read various threads on here about this question but many seem years old at this point and don't quite address the questions of which ya'll may be able to give me some insight on.
My girlfriend (28) and I (30) currently reside in the San Leandro, California area. As the cost of living here has sky rocketed we no longer see it worth trying to make a future here when it seems like there are blue skies and opportunity where our dollars will take us further elsewhere.
My brother moved out to East Texas last year to isolate himself in the woods and have some land to raise some cows, do some farming etc and after visiting him out there and spending a week in the area, we both were very impressed with the natural beauty of the area as well as the nice small townish feel Longview had. Where it isn't the biggest town, it still felt like whatever you'd really want, you wouldn't be missing out on (GF used to live in Oroville and Crescent City, Ca), and felt really homey, my brother mentioned it being one of the quickest expanding cities in the US. When it comes to affordability, I personally have years of experience working a parts counter (gf works in steel estimating/project management kinda stuff) and it seems as if the dealerships out there would actually pay me more than I make out here given some research I've done and it seems as if we could get a decent house out there for not much money.
The last day we were there we spent in Dallas, going to the aquarium, eating at a restaurant in that west end district, then cruising around the city before flying home. Where Dallas/Fort Worth also seem to be within reach, the properties seem smaller and I've been reading quite a bit about high crime areas in the DFW. The crime thing makes me think as we both grew up on the border of Oakland CA (the worst area of Oakland) and San Leandro and never really had any problems, maybe it's different in Dallas. Fort Worth seems a bit cheaper and looks nicer when it comes to affordable neighborhoods, but we didn't get to spend all too much time in the area.
Given we've been in the Bay Area rat race for so long we aren't looking for much when it comes to entertainment (Dallas is only about 2 hours away from Longview), ritzy shopping, as we've kind of been there and done all that, we're just kind of torn between the two and I'm just looking for opinions/ideas of the two areas. Ultimately we're just looking for a decent place to call home. Any help would be appreciated.
If you like things about Dallas but don't want to live there, you may want to look into Tyler, which is between Longview and Dallas. It's less than an hour from Longview, only an hour and a half to Dallas, and it has a better overall economy than Longview.
Sure, Longview does feel more townsy, even than Tyler, but seriously, the crime rate is higher in Longview. Now, the crime rate is likely not nearly as high as you have experienced.
However, for more job opportunities, in general, Tyler is better.
More traffic in Tyler, a much larger "feel" town than Longview, which may make Longview a better fit for you.
For more "bling" for gf in Tyler. More major touring group performing arts in Tyler. Longview is slowly coming along with the Beicher Center. Tyler has had the Cowan Performing Arts Center on the campus of the University of Texas at Tyler for over 25. The East Texas Symphony is quite good in Tyler. Established about 80 years ago. I have Houston as a comparison when I compare Longview and Tyler. Born in Tyler, visited Longview often, uncle lived there, lived in Houston 25 years, back in Tyler the last 28 years.
Frankly, Tyler is much more white collar, Longview blue collar, but if that matter either way? Longview is barely growing, information you have is not accurate. Tyler is growing slowly. But for you and gf skills, actually Longview, COULD be better.
Census Estimates for July 1, 2015, July1, 2016, July 1, 2017 for Longview - 81,875 81,690 81,522 small losses. Tyler 102,721 103,930 104,991 small gains.
Check them out, as Kathyrn said, Tyler is 30-45 minutes closer to DFW. Search jobs before you move, unless you have funds or friends, relatives to live for a unknown amount of time, just saying you likely know, but some make the mistake that all of Texas is booming, not true.
DFW, you could get a job right away. Boom towns of America are in DFW. Which you are young enough to really enjoy all that. Not me anymore. But all is available in DFW.
Thanks for the responses guys, definitely gives me more to think about.
My brother initially suggested that I look in Tyler if I was interested in Texas. When we visited the area we didn't get to spend any time in the town, but passing through it, Longview seems woodsier and that is very appealing.
When it comes to living in Dallas (or Fort Worth) I wouldn't "not want to" live there, the only real concern I'd have (beyond lot size) would be crime. Crime because a lot of the houses in Dallas itself wind up being in the east or south east side, two areas which I've seen folks warned about on previous threads I've read about the Dallas area and beyond that we've looked in Fort Worth and Arlington which people also warn about with crime. I guess, again, given the experiences I've had living a stones throw away from pretty bad areas of the Bay Area I just wonder how bad it could really be.
With Dallas I've seen people warn folks about traffic, but Bay Area traffic is insane at any time of the day so more traffic would be nothing new, in fact, wouldn't even be much of a bother when rent isn't 1500 for a 1br apartment.
The other thing I've mulled over with East Texas would be race relations, some of the threads I had read about the East Texas accused the area of being "backwards" in this regard. I don't mean to propagate a stereotype of "southern racists" and I feel as if it's an unfair demonization of good, kind people (those are the experiences I had) but I guess I just wouldn't know what to expect living there, I personally believe that if you walk around looking for racism you will find it and if you walk around looking to be outraged, you will be outraged. As I note this, I'll throw in that I am castizo looking of a Mexican familial background (an American first is how I see it), most assume me to be Portugese or Italian.
Any insights on any of this or the areas would still be helpful
Tyler proper is more woodsy than the area near west of Tyler. North, Northeast, East, Southeast, and South is about as woodsy as the area that encircles Longview. Longview has the beautiful tall pine forest. More pines than Tyler, Tyler is on the edge of The Pineywoods of East Texas Area. Many more hardwoods, many huge. More fall color in Tyler. Just south of Tyler are larger rolling hills of East Texas, as you go into Jacksonville, is the Love's Lookout Scenic overlook. Beautiful drive. Only 20 miles to Jacksonville.
Tyler IMHO, is more Southern than Western, slightly more urban therefore a little more diverse than Longview, even two mosques here. All types live here, you're slightly more likely to encounter a few more, excuse me, rednecks in Longview, now everyone try not to get upset, that is just being honest. You're even MORE likely to run into a more live and let live here than anything, IMHO.
Last edited by Mark Senior; 10-31-2018 at 07:04 PM..
Tyler proper is more woodsy than the area near west of Tyler. North, Northeast, East, Southeast, and South is about as woodsy as the area that encircles Longview. Longview has the beautiful tall pine forest. More pines than Tyler, Tyler is on the edge of The Pineywoods of East Texas Area. Many more hardwoods, many huge. More fall color in Tyler. Just south of Tyler are larger rolling hills of East Texas, as you go into Jacksonville, is the Love's Lookout Scenic overlook. Beautiful drive. Only 20 miles to Jacksonville.
Tyler IMHO, is more Southern than Western, slightly more urban therefore a little more diverse than Longview, even two mosques here. All types live here, you're slightly more likely to encounter a few more, excuse me, rednecks in Longview, now everyone try not to get upset, that is just being honest. You're even MORE likely to run into a more live and let live here than anything, IMHO.
Mark, you took the words right out of my mouth. Sorry but that description is accurate.
OP, Tyler's economic base is more diverse and more professional and more white collar than that of Longview. I speak from experience here, having lived and worked in both small cities. I have lived in the Tyler area for about 20 years and the Longview area about 7 years.
I have a racially diverse family, and I raised my biracial kids in Tyler. Texas in general and Tyler specifically is not beset with racial problems. Like anywhere in the US, smaller towns tend to attract more racist views and more small minded views in general, but overall, race relations in East Texas are fine. Texas is one of only three or four minority majority states, where white, non Hispanic people make up less than 50 percent of the population. East Texas has more African Americans than West Texas but fewer Hispanics, so it evens out. Anyway, I personally have always liked the diversity of East Texas and so have my kids. One of them (they are all adults now) was just talking yesterday about how he appreciates being raised in Tyler, Texas because of it's overall lack of racism. Not saying it doesn't exist, but it's definitely not a pronounced issue.
Longview IS more blue collar and while there is nothing wrong with that at all (to me, a dollar earned should be respected regardless of whether the collar worn while earning it was blue or white), but it does make a difference in the feel of a place. Longview and that area has been more oil and gas dependent than Tyler for decades, so now that oil and gas isn't booming in this area (it's better now but REALLY slumped for about five years) Longview's economy has really suffered. Like Mark pointed out, Longview doesn't have a healthy growth pattern, so yes, OP, your information on that is wrong. I've watched Tyler consistently grow and I've watched Longview stay about the same size as long as I've lived here (27 years). I got married and moved to the Longview area but as soon as my husband's son graduated from Kilgore College and moved to Austin, we quickly bought a house in the Tyler area and moved here -we were both glad to get out of the Longview area and move to Tyler.
Longview has more pine trees but Tyler has more hardwoods. Next time you are in the area, drive around downtown Tyler, south Tyler, and southwest Tyler. Whitehouse, Flint, Gresham, Bullard, Chandler, even Edom and Troup. I think you will change your mind about the trees, and the hills and rolling countryside are beautiful.
The growth in Tyler is more to the south and west of Tyler, not as much the east (Chapel Hill, Overton, etc). North is a mixed bag - Lindale is growing like crazy, but that's just off I-20. Otherwise, north Tyler is not growing nearly as fast as the south and southwest are.
All of this certainly helps, thanks again to you all. We will have to broaden our East Texas horizons to include Tyler as well it seems to be better favored by you folks who are from the area. Also, thanks for addressing the race relations thing as well, I'm a pretty libertarian guy, so "live and let live" is always the way I've seen it and it seemed like that was the overall feel of the area when we were there, had just been something on the back of my mind being from a place like the Bay Area.
On the DFW, I loosely know a few folks who are from Arlington, one who moved out there from the Bay Area, and one who I've only had as a friend on FB and they seem pretty happy with the area, never see them complaining at all. Are some of these suburbs really as bad as they are made to sound on these various threads? My experience with living near Oakland has only been a few vehicle break-ins/theft (one car was one that's pretty popular in "side shows" out here - stolen almost 3 times in the same year), but aside from that it seems to be so long as you aren't walking around the wrong neighborhood at night (which will be very obvious) it's usually not so bad and Oakland is one of the higher crime (3rd most dangerous according to Forbes).
All of this certainly helps, thanks again to you all. We will have to broaden our East Texas horizons to include Tyler as well it seems to be better favored by you folks who are from the area. Also, thanks for addressing the race relations thing as well, I'm a pretty libertarian guy, so "live and let live" is always the way I've seen it and it seemed like that was the overall feel of the area when we were there, had just been something on the back of my mind being from a place like the Bay Area.
On the DFW, I loosely know a few folks who are from Arlington, one who moved out there from the Bay Area, and one who I've only had as a friend on FB and they seem pretty happy with the area, never see them complaining at all. Are some of these suburbs really as bad as they are made to sound on these various threads? My experience with living near Oakland has only been a few vehicle break-ins/theft (one car was one that's pretty popular in "side shows" out here - stolen almost 3 times in the same year), but aside from that it seems to be so long as you aren't walking around the wrong neighborhood at night (which will be very obvious) it's usually not so bad and Oakland is one of the higher crime (3rd most dangerous according to Forbes).
I doubt anyone on the Tyler Sub-Forum would have a better opinion about crime in the DFW suburbs than the people who live in the various mega suburbs of DFW. But if you would like/need any other information on this area, we will attempt to help. In my case, direct correspondence will work as well. Best to you.
The east and south sides of Dallas that we warn newcomers about are not areas where you would want to be living. Those areas are Pleasant Grove, Fair Park, and South Oak Cliff. Yes, they are bad. And the minute you drove through the neighborhood, you would realize this. But this is a small part Dallas, not the entire south and east sides. There are many gorgeous homes in the Lakewood and Forest Hills areas of east Dallas, some of which are quite high-dollar, and the Dallas Arboretum and White Rock Lake parks are some of the best areas in Dallas. So, don't write off half of Dallas!
I will say for your significant other's career options, you may have to live in a bigger city. I'm not sure how opportunities on her career field will be in a smaller town.
OP, I'm sorry - what does your significant other do career wise? I have gone back over your posts but I must be missing it.
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