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Old 12-28-2012, 12:20 PM
 
Location: Minneapolis (St. Louis Park)
5,991 posts, read 8,315,951 times
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I would like to introduce the data and study shown below that somebody else provided on another forum. This is the pre-war (1940) population of the 20 largest U.S. metros, and consequently, the 20 largest cities in terms of pre-war housing stock and pre-suburbia (as we know it today) urbanity.

I think it offers a good starting point when discussing the feeling of "urban-ness" between cities, particularly those that may not have the population to support high metro marks or density statistics, yet feel very urban nonetheless (e.g. STL, BUF or CLE).

Enjoy!


1. New York ----- 10,135,000
2. Chicago ------- 4,210,000
3. Philadelphia ---- 2,538,000
4. Los Angeles ---- 2,268,000
5. Detroit --------- 2,041,000
6. Boston --------- 1,746,000
7. San Francisco -- 1,156,000
8. Pittsburgh ------ 1,134,000
9. St. Louis ------- 1,102,000
10. Cleveland ----- 1,079,000

11. Baltimore -------- 992,000
12. Minneapolis ------ 886,000
13. Washington ------ 800,000
14. Buffalo ---------- 708,000
15. Milwaukee ------- 705,000
16. Kansas City ------ 632,000
17. Cincinnati -------- 559,000
18. New Orleans ----- 557,000
19. Houston --------- 471,000
20. Seattle ---------- 451,000

source: http://www.peakbagger.com/pbgeog/histmetropop.aspx
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Old 12-28-2012, 12:30 PM
 
Location: Charlotte, NC (in my mind)
7,946 posts, read 15,043,716 times
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Interesting list. This really shows the effect suburbanization has had on the more historic cities. Some of them I don't know if that many people in the urban core could work in 2012. Could you cram 1.1 million people in SF city limits with 2012 living standards?
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Old 12-28-2012, 12:33 PM
 
Location: "Daytonnati"
4,245 posts, read 5,984,874 times
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"Film Noir Urbanism"...the US city in the 1940s...before the big time warp into "modern times".

@@@@

Interesting to see Houston was already pretty big back then. Aeriels Ive seen of their downtown makes it look like blocks and blocks of stuff was torn down to make way for parking lots.


I'm a bit familiar with Cleveland and if you look at old pix of the city you'll see it seemed "bigger" back in those days, too.

I think you cant avoid thinking of the planned mass demolitions and restructuring that went along with urban renewal and then the more random, piecmeal demolition that happened via abandonment.
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Old 12-28-2012, 12:40 PM
 
Location: Pasadena, CA
10,087 posts, read 13,110,077 times
Reputation: 3982
Quote:
Originally Posted by Min-Chi-Cbus View Post
I would like to introduce the data and study shown below that somebody else provided on another forum. This is the pre-war (1940) population of the 20 largest U.S. metros, and consequently, the 20 largest cities in terms of pre-war housing stock and pre-suburbia (as we know it today) urbanity.

I think it offers a good starting point when discussing the feeling of "urban-ness" between cities, particularly those that may not have the population to support high metro marks or density statistics, yet feel very urban nonetheless (e.g. STL, BUF or CLE).

Enjoy!


1. New York ----- 10,135,000
2. Chicago ------- 4,210,000
3. Philadelphia ---- 2,538,000
4. Los Angeles ---- 2,268,000
5. Detroit --------- 2,041,000
6. Boston --------- 1,746,000
7. San Francisco -- 1,156,000
8. Pittsburgh ------ 1,134,000
9. St. Louis ------- 1,102,000
10. Cleveland ----- 1,079,000

11. Baltimore -------- 992,000
12. Minneapolis ------ 886,000
13. Washington ------ 800,000
14. Buffalo ---------- 708,000
15. Milwaukee ------- 705,000
16. Kansas City ------ 632,000
17. Cincinnati -------- 559,000
18. New Orleans ----- 557,000
19. Houston --------- 471,000
20. Seattle ---------- 451,000

source: http://www.peakbagger.com/pbgeog/histmetropop.aspx
These are for the urban area and not just the city limits, right?
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Old 12-28-2012, 12:40 PM
 
507 posts, read 659,276 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bchris02 View Post
Interesting list. This really shows the effect suburbanization has had on the more historic cities. Some of them I don't know if that many people in the urban core could work in 2012. Could you cram 1.1 million people in SF city limits with 2012 living standards?
I think the population pertains to the metro.
Edit: I know see it pertains to city limits, Chicago, Baltimore, Cleveland, Pitts and St. Louis are the most impressive

Last edited by the Instigator; 12-28-2012 at 12:55 PM..
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Old 12-28-2012, 12:43 PM
 
Location: "Daytonnati"
4,245 posts, read 5,984,874 times
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In 1940 you probably didnt have a lot of suburbia as we know it today. You might have seen early versions of automobile-oriented suburbia, but much of the built environment would have been perhaps denser & more traditional...at that time newer housing being bungalows or that cape code/tudor cottage thing that was getting popular in the 1930s. The concept of auto-oriented retail, such as supermarkets, would have been fairly new, too....
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Old 12-28-2012, 12:48 PM
 
Location: roaming gnome
12,391 posts, read 24,565,147 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bchris02 View Post
Interesting list. This really shows the effect suburbanization has had on the more historic cities. Some of them I don't know if that many people in the urban core could work in 2012. Could you cram 1.1 million people in SF city limits with 2012 living standards?
Most definitely, see Chicago and NYC. SF will not build upwards like them though.
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Old 12-28-2012, 12:54 PM
 
Location: Philadelphia
11,884 posts, read 10,385,743 times
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Very interesting indeed.


Cities no longer in TOP 20 US Metros

Pittsburgh #23
Cleveland #29
Buffalo #50
Milwaukee #40
Kansas City #30
Cincinnatti #28
New Orleans #47


Cities added to TOP 20

Dallas #4
Miami #8
Atlanta #9
Riverside #12
Phoenix #14
San Diego #17
Tampa #18

Cities that have remained in TOP 20

New York #1
Los Angeles #2
Chicago #3
Houston #5
Philadelphia #6
Washington #7
Boston #10
San Francisco #11
Detroit #13
Seattle #15
Minneapolis #16
St. Loius #19
Baltimore #20


Buffalo has fallen the furthest.
Dallas has grown the most.

Last edited by 2e1m5a; 12-28-2012 at 01:04 PM..
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Old 12-28-2012, 01:00 PM
 
507 posts, read 659,276 times
Reputation: 293
Whoaa! Am I seeing things or was Boston at 1.7 million in 1940! If this is true then Boston takes the cake
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Old 12-28-2012, 01:05 PM
 
933 posts, read 1,607,539 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the Instigator View Post
Whoaa! Am I seeing things or was Boston at 1.7 million in 1940! If this is true then Boston takes the cake
It's urban area, not city limits. The only cities that topped 1m within city limits that are on that list are New York, Chicago, Philadelphia, Los Angeles, Detroit and Houston.
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