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The challenge is that this country has soooo many suburbs. It's easy to get lost in a particular type of suburb and generalize. It's also impossible to talk about suburbs or cities in a specific context because there are so many variations.
Yea, if low-density / low-walkability neighborhoods weren't say, 85% of the country but say, 50% few posters would complain about them; they just wouldn't think much about them.
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I know the problem I have with some suburbs and some cities is that driving a car is the only realistic way of getting around. It stinks to sit all day at work (if you work an office job), only to sit in a car on the way home, and then to get home and not have anywhere to walk to run your errands.
Yea, it's horrible. It's "I'm home... and there's nothing here". Even if you don't have any errands to do, I'd go for neighborhood walks in the town center just to get out where yes, there's people about.
Though, if you have a family you probably are going to stay at home anyway. And someone in a small apartment is more likely to want to get out than a big house. I've noticed a lot of posters in the "I love the suburbs" focused on just their home and its personal space.
Some of us don't want to live in the city because we don't like the hustle and bustle or the noise. I don't need a sandwich shop below me or a coffee shop a block away.
Of course that's not to say I necessarily want to live in some suburbs either as I don't like HOAs or the cookie cutter houses clumped so close together that you can spit and hit the one next door.
Everyone has a preference, I suppose.
I can understand a difference in preferences, but how many neighborhoods are loud/busy outside of NYC? There are urban neighborhoods that are quiet, convenient, walkable, etc.
Here's one in Richmond that is walkable with amenities but there's not really any hustle and bustle:
Yea, if low-density / low-walkability neighborhoods weren't say, 85% of the country but say, 50% few posters would complain about them; they just wouldn't think much about them.
Yes, exactly. There is a huge supply of suburbs and a smaller supply of urban neighborhoods with low crime and good schools. It's a real issue for many people who want to have families in the city (like a good friend of mine). It definitely results in frustration.
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Originally Posted by nei
Yea, it's horrible. It's "I'm home... and there's nothing here". Even if you don't have any errands to do, I'd go for neighborhood walks in the town center just to get out where yes, there's people about.
Though, if you have a family you probably are going to stay at home anyway. And someone in a small apartment is more likely to want to get out than a big house. I've noticed a lot of posters in the "I love the suburbs" focused on just their home and its personal space.
Because suburban living is so prominent, I find a lot of misconceptions in this forum about what it's like to live an urban life. Loud, lots of traffic, drunk people, etc. My reality is quite different. There are a ton of families with children, parks nearby, etc. And there are some large houses for those with more than two children, although the sqft/person is still lower than the burbs. But then again, many people are out more, yes even with kids. Not at bars and restaurants, but at fountains, parks, ice cream shops, walking, etc.
In other words, I find it very reasonable to come home to a family and not have a desire to stay in the house every day. I love my home, but I really love where I live and my community. Just my personal opinion.
I can understand a difference in preferences, but how many neighborhoods are loud/busy outside of NYC? There are urban neighborhoods that are quiet, convenient, walkable, etc.
Here's one in Richmond that is walkable with amenities but there's not really any hustle and bustle:
But even one block over from places like this can be very quiet.
You make the point that no one wants to live above retail shops or a bar. Well, no one past the age of 25 or so who has to get up in the morning to be at work at 7.
I can understand a difference in preferences, but how many neighborhoods are loud/busy outside of NYC? There are urban neighborhoods that are quiet, convenient, walkable, etc.
Even my hood in Philly, which is very urban, is really quiet.
I see three cars on that street in the street view. Might be random, but definitely more noise than I'm used to. I remember walking around Philadelphia and thinking "there's cars everywhere". Sure, slow-moving light traffic can be tuned out but it's more noise than I'm used to.
It's still better than that "rural secondary road" I showed. When cars are moving by a house at 40+ mph, the noise carries for a long distance.
I hear that more often from people in the city. Everything is a xx minute train ride or a xx minute walk.
It's funny. . . after you posted that, I heard a story on NPR about a town that is "1 hour from d/t London via the tube". I guess it's a common expression everywhere.
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Originally Posted by nei
Yea, if low-density / low-walkability neighborhoods weren't say, 85% of the country but say, 50% few posters would complain about them; they just wouldn't think much about them.
Yea, it's horrible. It's "I'm home... and there's nothing here". Even if you don't have any errands to do, I'd go for neighborhood walks in the town center just to get out where yes, there's people about.
Though, if you have a family you probably are going to stay at home anyway. And someone in a small apartment is more likely to want to get out than a big house. I've noticed a lot of posters in the "I love the suburbs" focused on just their home and its personal space.
People in my neighborhood are out walking a lot. There are a lot of dog owners, and one also sees couples walking after dinner in the months when it's still light then. Town center? Yeah, we have a downtown. I know not all suburbs do, but most have some sort of town center, strip malls, etc where there is quite a bit of activity.
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Originally Posted by AJNEOA
I can understand a difference in preferences, but how many neighborhoods are loud/busy outside of NYC? There are urban neighborhoods that are quiet, convenient, walkable, etc.
Here's one in Richmond that is walkable with amenities but there's not really any hustle and bustle:
But even one block over from places like this can be very quiet.
I've lived in two large cities, Pittsburgh and Denver. Both have busy noisy areas.
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Originally Posted by AJNEOA
Yes, exactly. There is a huge supply of suburbs and a smaller supply of urban neighborhoods with low crime and good schools. It's a real issue for many people who want to have families in the city (like a good friend of mine). It definitely results in frustration.
Because suburban living is so prominent, I find a lot of misconceptions in this forum about what it's like to live an urban life. Loud, lots of traffic, drunk people, etc. My reality is quite different. There are a ton of families with children, parks nearby, etc. And there are some large houses for those with more than two children, although the sqft/person is still lower than the burbs. But then again, many people are out more, yes even with kids. Not at bars and restaurants, but at fountains, parks, ice cream shops, walking, etc.
In other words, I find it very reasonable to come home to a family and not have a desire to stay in the house every day. I love my home, but I really love where I live and my community. Just my personal opinion.
I don't know what you think goes on in the suburbs. I'll get shot for this (or my post will get deleted for saying it) but there seems to be a general attitude on this forum that "suburbanites" come home from work/school, never to leave the house again till the next morning, that children are kept virtually locked up inside the house and never leave, that families never do any "family fun" activities, etc. Where does this idea come from? It's certainly not from observation.
Yes, people who work all day usually come home, eat dinner and relax. That relaxation can take the form of watching TV (I mean, we suburbanites all like "Dancing With the Stars", right?), reading, doing hobbies, doing yard work, whatever. What's so different in "the city"? I don't live differently than I did in "the city". I didn't spend every evening out at the theater, or at a museum, or volunteering at the food bank or whatever. Sometimes, eating dinner means going out to eat. There are plenty of restaurants in suburbs. They're not all chains, either. There are a lot of indy restaurants in strip malls. In some tonier burbs, there are even a few high end places. As far as kids, yes, people go out for ice cream in the suburbs too. Once the kids get older, they can get consumed with many sports, extracurricular and school activities. Just go over to the parenting forum and take a look around at the threads there. How is that different in the city?
Speaking of community, what do you do for your community? Do you volunteer? Do you follow local politics? Are you on a board or commission?
In other words, suburban households do not hibernate. That's a ridiculous (as in to be riduculed) notion.
People in my neighborhood are out walking a lot. There are a lot of dog owners, and one also sees couples walking after dinner in the months when it's still light then. Town center? Yeah, we have a downtown. I know not all suburbs do, but most have some sort of town center, strip malls, etc where there is quite a bit of activity.
I though most don't. Few people walk to/from strip malls in my experience.
I've lived in two large cities, Pittsburgh and Denver. Both have busy noisy areas.
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I don't know what you think goes on in the suburbs. I'll get shot for this (or my post will get deleted for saying it) but there seems to be a general attitude on this forum that "suburbanites" come home from work/school, never to leave the house again till the next morning, that children are kept virtually locked up inside the house and never leave, that families never do any "family fun" activities, etc. Where does this idea come from? It's certainly not from observation.
Can't answer AJNOEA's question, people aren't walking out in their neighborhood, you see the people going out more so it gives the impression people go out. In the walkable neighborhood I lived in, you'd see people going to/from home the town center, some families out. But I'd guess, more people living in low-density areas tend to stay at home in the evening. At least to me, there's a lot more appeal in leaving the house if there's something around to walk in rather than have to drive and leave... ugh back inside.
AJ didn't have a question, just a lot of declarations about someplace he doesn't live. He thinks everyone in the burbs drives home from work, uses their electric garage door opener to get in the house, closes the door and never goes out again until the next morning. Likewise, suburban kids come home from school, do not go outside again until they go to school the next morning in his world view. In summer, I guess they just stay inside all day long.
That's a very interesting mental gymnastics of yours, that if you see people out in the burbs, they're conspicuous because no one goes out, so you think there are a lot of people out. Perfect 10, Bart! (Conner, former gymnast) If you see people out, it's because they're out! Interestingly, my husband came home from a walk after I last posted, and said there were so many people out it seemed like a weekend day!
I don't know why you think there's more appeal in being able to walk to the ice cream store than driving to it. The goal is supposed to be the ice cream, not how you get there. And almost all suburban neighborhoods have a park nearby to walk to.
I didn't say people walk to strip malls, though some do. But there is somplace to "go".
Could you please fix your post to reflect my quotes correctly?
Which is exactly what I stated. So, I do know something about the west.
But not Colorado! We're the wild west out here!
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