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Old 06-30-2010, 08:42 AM
 
Location: On our boat!
5,682 posts, read 10,504,262 times
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This reply is to Jonne: My wife knows just how much "REALITY" I am! The REALITY of it is that age discrimination does happen and happens quite often! Just like qualifying for a job......an older person can completely qualify for a warehouse position, but once that pre-employment physical is taken and the results show past surgeries done, that person can easily get a call from the company stating "I'm sorry, but your pre-employment physical showed some things that we can not accept for this position. Again, sorry."
As far as working with seniors go........I worked for a Senior Healthcare company and the Transportation drivers told me some stories about how nasty some seniors could get on the their buses b/c they couldn't get their own way on something. Also had "first-hand" seeing seniors at our healthcare centers sitting outside in a wheelchair holding/smoking a cigarette in one hand while an oxygen tank was on the other side of them. They needed oxygen to breathe at times, but were still smoking!!
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Old 06-30-2010, 08:58 AM
 
Location: In my view finder.....
8,524 posts, read 8,317,300 times
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I would say age discrimination happens more than racial discrim.




Quote:
Originally Posted by LoveBoating View Post
This reply is to Jonne: My wife knows just how much "REALITY" I am! The REALITY of it is that age discrimination does happen and happens quite often! Just like qualifying for a job......an older person can completely qualify for a warehouse position, but once that pre-employment physical is taken and the results show past surgeries done, that person can easily get a call from the company stating "I'm sorry, but your pre-employment physical showed some things that we can not accept for this position. Again, sorry."
As far as working with seniors go........I worked for a Senior Healthcare company and the Transportation drivers told me some stories about how nasty some seniors could get on the their buses b/c they couldn't get their own way on something. Also had "first-hand" seeing seniors at our healthcare centers sitting outside in a wheelchair holding/smoking a cigarette in one hand while an oxygen tank was on the other side of them. They needed oxygen to breathe at times, but were still smoking!!
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Old 06-30-2010, 09:58 AM
 
Location: Raleigh, NC
8,177 posts, read 10,795,785 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nicet4 View Post
[snip]

House and everything is all paid for, I get social security which I can live on so if work slows up I'll just stay home until it heats up.

I would never ask for a raise because I don't need the money.
These two things can be seen as a detriment by some employers: if you "don't need the money", there can be a presumption that the minute you're asked to do something you don't want to, you'll quit, or at least that you'll complain a lot because, y'know, you don't need the money so what do you have to lose. I remember encountering this attitude in previous managers of mine when I was a junior manager. Yet another stereotype about the aged (or, in this case, about anyone who is "set" financially).

Quote:
I am very stable, don't do drugs, drink or run around with women other than my wife.
None of which has anything to do with age. There are 25-year-olds to whom this applies and 65-year-olds to whom it does not.
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Old 06-30-2010, 10:52 AM
 
Location: St Thomas, US Virgin Islands
22,482 posts, read 27,048,543 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by email_lover View Post
Generally not! I find that many applicants are over the hill and not as sharp and aggressive at that age and also are less likely to get along with their coworkers who are mostly in their 20s and 30s. Another problem with older workers is they are set in their ways and are not computer savvy which is the key to corporate office jobs. Others are coasting to retirement and are just putting in their time until social security.

On the other hand, while I am only in my 30s I do strongly consider applicants in their 40s and 50s because they have less drama and more self confidence than younger employees.
Quote:
Originally Posted by email_lover View Post
If being 60 years old is just so great in the world of work then why is it so hard for older workers to get a job? Because of bias based on employers bad experiences with older workers in the past.

Now I am sure some of the older posters are as sharp as a tact and they are still working at age 70. If so great, but you are an exception. Most workers start to slip and lose interest in the late 50s and slide to retirement. (I agree many younger workers are not too impressive either)
Well you're certainly getting a lot of flak with your ageing-biased assumptions. Not to mention sharp as a tack which was addressed. Tact is another whole ballgame and something you might research before making comments.

Not everyone is as bright and sparkling at 60 or 70 or 80 as they were at 20 or 30 or 40 but neither are we all standing there with one foot in the grave, shuffling around and drooling. I think I speak for my generation when I say that your sweeping comments are not only derogatory but, well, just plain ignorant. And you speak from the "experience" of being an office drone who, by your own admission, sits at a job which is boring because there's no work to do and you spend your day emailing your friends and creating new threads on CD forums. Oh, and allegedly the boss wants you to hire an Administrative Assistant to help you out because you have no work to do?

At 30+ years old*you have much to learn. FYI, I've been working since I was 16.5 years old. I've worn many different hats over many years in several different and very complex arenas and have twice owned my own business. At 64 years old I am now 15 years into owning and operating a restaurant in a highly competitive market where such businesses usually have a lifespan of max 5 years. I am the owner/operator. I do all the cooking, prepping, ordering, yard work, much of the basic mechanical fixes and I also scrub the floors and clean the toilets. Oh, and I rescue animals and oh, I'm female.

Many of my friends in their 60s are still operating sail charters, running other businesses and living essentially as do I - busting arse but basically enjoying it because we're good at what we do and we enjoy it. I invariably wake up with aches and pains and live with creaks and groans but accept that getting older isn't as good as it's sometimes cracked up to be. In fact the older I get the more vastly over-rated it is. The acquired knowledge is indeed priceless but thank goodness I always look into the mirror WITHOUT my glasses on and also have a good chiropractor.

Those such as you who sit on their duffs in an office chair using company time to post silly threads and make general comments which are so flawed, seriously need to get a life and stop wasting your boss's time. Find a way to make your hours on this earth rather more productive than is evidenced by your postings and threads since you recently joined CD.


Quote:
Originally Posted by GaBison2007 View Post
I would...but seeing as how I'm being trained with older people...they do have one MAJOR flaw that works against them...

The willingness to be open...their experience basically works against them...I mean if I hear one more older person say "well I know this because I have experience in this and that" and then they STILL mess up or make excuses. Or better yet, when they fall behind on certain things and use the excuse "well this is all just so new" or this is just "too much"...like it isn't "new" for ALL of us or that we aren't dealing with an equally heavy workload. It almost implies that their age justifies them doing their work less efficiently than others. I just see some (not all) older people at first just being so rip-raring ready to go and talking about how fast they can adapt and their VAST experience but once they get to work and fall behind, all of that "I'm just as energetic and efficient as anyone" goes out of the window. They just need to understand that every new job they encounter which may be in a new field has different things to learn and it's going to take effort to learn...every job is not the same...

also they should be willing to embrace anything that comes with that job including learning new technology, keeping up to date with news pertaining to their field, and taking advice and direction from younger managers(and even more tenured co-workers who could help) as well instead of looking down upon them......they were chosen to be managers for a reason and not just there for their "supple" skin....
I hear you and it's not an uncommon gripe. However, it also works in reverse and I'm sure you're smart enough to understand that. The young ones are so impatient and so many have been raised on the computer which I frankly find rather scary because their computer knowledge so often negates the base of computer technology such as, for instance, the ability to accomplish something as simple as manual alphabetical filing.

Just a thought but if the world wide satellite system crashed, where would your generation be? That scenario isn't an improbability and may not necessarily encompass global proportions but you're so used to your internet and games being available, so used to your cellphones being up but if and when push comes to shove and you can't function then what do you have to fall back on where basic survival and "making do" is concerned? Those who have gone through major disasters probably see things a little differently.

And I confess that I was never impatient with people older than I who had something to share. I reveled in their knowledge.

Quote:
Originally Posted by malamute View Post
If you're really looking for computer savvy, you almost have to go with an older person. If you need someone who understands machine language, assembly language, even DOS programming, you have to go with older.

Too often younger workers think they know computers because they grew up playing computer games but they don't have a clue how they work in business. Even if a younger person is a little computer savvy, it just means they're going to chat on the internet while being paid. And they cannot put down their cell phones for two minutes.
An interesting comment. Technological advancements have enabled even the most inept to surf the net via PC, desktop, laptop, cellphone or whatever. I believe the major systems used by world governments and in major security systems are still based on the original DOS system and far greater new versions of that.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron. View Post
I would say age discrimination happens more than racial discrim.
I would bet it's 50/50.
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Old 06-30-2010, 12:02 PM
 
Location: Spokane via Sydney,Australia
6,608 posts, read 6,966,626 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LoveBoating View Post
"Stereotyping"......no, don't think that's what the person is doing. In all reality, myself (age 61 now) have seen too many people in my age bracket that do the "hunt and peck" type keyboarding that I, and my wife, don't do. We both use a computer/Internet quite often at home and have plenty of experience in using one in the workplace. Another thing, many people in that age bracket are also afraid of using the Internet for whatever reasons. Some of these folks are as slow in using a computer as they are in driving a car on a street or freeway! Wife and I "put the pedal to the metal" in driving (not real fast though) as well as letting our fingers "fly on the keyboard" of a computer.
fwiw I don't consider being able to type on a computer keyboard and use the internet as being "computer savvy".

Yes, some folks are SLOW, some aren't, and that has nought to do with age.

By the way , what do you mean "age bracket"? You said in your OP 60 plus, but you never specified a bracket per se. Do you mean 90 year olds, or do you mean say 60-70? There's a BIG difference there regarding computer familiarity and usage.
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Old 06-30-2010, 12:26 PM
 
Location: Kentucky
12 posts, read 26,084 times
Reputation: 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by LoveBoating View Post
This reply is to Jonne: My wife knows just how much "REALITY" I am! The REALITY of it is that age discrimination does happen and happens quite often! Just like qualifying for a job......an older person can completely qualify for a warehouse position, but once that pre-employment physical is taken and the results show past surgeries done, that person can easily get a call from the company stating "I'm sorry, but your pre-employment physical showed some things that we can not accept for this position. Again, sorry."
As far as working with seniors go........I worked for a Senior Healthcare company and the Transportation drivers told me some stories about how nasty some seniors could get on the their buses b/c they couldn't get their own way on something. Also had "first-hand" seeing seniors at our healthcare centers sitting outside in a wheelchair holding/smoking a cigarette in one hand while an oxygen tank was on the other side of them. They needed oxygen to breathe at times, but were still smoking!!
My initial response was to your original post. You posed this question : Would you interview or hire someone 60 Plus Yrs Old?

Yes, age discrimination happens, but it should not. You asked if someone should interview/hire someone who was 60 yrs or older. I said age discrimination is wrong-whatever the age. Any form of discrimination is wrong in my opinion. As with anyone's opinion one can only go by their own experiences.

You also mentioned seniors "nasty" attitudes, physical ailments, etc. The same applies to people of all ages. There are lots of "nasty" attitudes out in the world and there are many people with physical ailments, illnesses, etc. Is that reason to not hire someone because they fall into the "stereotype" of senior citizens? My main point was do not overgeneralize a population of people.
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Old 06-30-2010, 12:44 PM
 
6,387 posts, read 5,743,444 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Francois View Post
These two things can be seen as a detriment by some employers: if you "don't need the money", there can be a presumption that the minute you're asked to do something you don't want to, you'll quit, or at least that you'll complain a lot because, y'know, you don't need the money so what do you have to lose.
Other than to commit fraud I can't imagine being asked to do something I wouldn't want to do.
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Old 06-30-2010, 12:47 PM
 
359 posts, read 514,611 times
Reputation: 330
Quote:
Originally Posted by LoveBoating View Post
This reply is to Jonne: My wife knows just how much "REALITY" I am! The REALITY of it is that age discrimination does happen and happens quite often! Just like qualifying for a job......an older person can completely qualify for a warehouse position, but once that pre-employment physical is taken and the results show past surgeries done, that person can easily get a call from the company stating "I'm sorry, but your pre-employment physical showed some things that we can not accept for this position. Again, sorry."
As far as working with seniors go........I worked for a Senior Healthcare company and the Transportation drivers told me some stories about how nasty some seniors could get on the their buses b/c they couldn't get their own way on something. Also had "first-hand" seeing seniors at our healthcare centers sitting outside in a wheelchair holding/smoking a cigarette in one hand while an oxygen tank was on the other side of them. They needed oxygen to breathe at times, but were still smoking!!
Of course age discrimination does happen (as does race/sex/disability discrimination) but that isn't the only reason older people aren't hired. A lot of people attribute their lack of success in the job market to their age/race/sex/disability just because they didn't get the job without even considering the possibility that there might have been a more qualified candidate.
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Old 06-30-2010, 02:26 PM
 
Location: On our boat!
5,682 posts, read 10,504,262 times
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"Computer savvy" means knowing how to use a computer, doing it with accuracy/speed.......which does mean knowing the keyboard and the 10-key on it AND knowing how to use the Internet for research, etc.
Believe me, wife and I have known/know people in their late 50's and 60's that will not touch a computer......my brother being one of them (age-65).
I remember doing a "typing speed" type game in my old office with two Transportation drivers watching. They were amazed at how fast/accurate I was on the keyboard doing this game.
I've hear so many complaints about senior drivers going to slow and have encountered those drivers myself. My wife wouldn't ride with her mom any more because she would back up traffic in the Car Pool Lane and that spelled one word......DANGEROUS!!
When I say the words, "age bracket", I mean people in their mid 50's to late 60's. Shoot, I use to work for a Purchasing Manager who refused to use his new computer to order parts with. He kept his "Buy Card" rack next to his desk and continued using it. Not to long later......he was fired by the owner of the company for not using the computer and not ordering enough parts. That was in 1989 and this guy was in his mid 30's.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Opyelie View Post
fwiw I don't consider being able to type on a computer keyboard and use the internet as being "computer savvy".

Yes, some folks are SLOW, some aren't, and that has nought to do with age.

By the way , what do you mean "age bracket"? You said in your OP 60 plus, but you never specified a bracket per se. Do you mean 90 year olds, or do you mean say 60-70? There's a BIG difference there regarding computer familiarity and usage.
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Old 06-30-2010, 02:36 PM
 
Location: Spokane via Sydney,Australia
6,608 posts, read 6,966,626 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LoveBoating;14844910[B
]"Computer savvy" means knowing how to use a computer, doing it with accuracy/speed.......which does mean knowing the keyboard and the 10-key on it AND knowing how to use the Internet for research, etc.[/b]
Believe me, wife and I have known/know people in their late 50's and 60's that will not touch a computer......my brother being one of them (age-65).
I remember doing a "typing speed" type game in my old office with two Transportation drivers watching. They were amazed at how fast/accurate I was on the keyboard doing this game.
I've hear so many complaints about senior drivers going to slow and have encountered those drivers myself. My wife wouldn't ride with her mom any more because she would back up traffic in the Car Pool Lane and that spelled one word......DANGEROUS!!
When I say the words, "age bracket", I mean people in their mid 50's to late 60's. Shoot, I use to work for a Purchasing Manager who refused to use his new computer to order parts with. He kept his "Buy Card" rack next to his desk and continued using it. Not to long later......he was fired by the owner of the company for not using the computer and not ordering enough parts. That was in 1989 and this guy was in his mid 30's.

Typing speed is just that - typing speed/accuracy, nothing to do with being "computer savvy", same with good 10key skills (those also being used on a calculator btw) but being able to navigate around the Net to research, maybe.

To my mind being savvy regarding a computer means more than being able to use it as a "black box", not having to wait for IT every time your pc or printer connection throws a hissy fit etc. or your software (especially MS based) suffers a "fatal error" or does something unexpected because it did what you told it to instead of what you meant.
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