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Adding to my post above, I read where you train your interns to use Excel and PowerPoint. Unbelievable. I've known how to use these programs for 15 years now and I paid for my own training and learned on my own. Virtually every single place I interviewed at, expected me to know all of Microsoft Office Suite before going to work. Someone coming out of college should know these programs before they enter the workforce. My employers NEVER trained me in any software. I was once terminated from a job position many years ago for not knowing "all" the features of Microsoft Word, and so after that, I trained like crazy to learn all those programs, on my own. Everyone working in a business who uses a computer daily should know all of these programs.
I believe it should be illegal to use interns for work but not pay them. At the very least it is highly unethical and speaks volumes about the company. I am sure everyone at school talks about this particular company and the good students don't apply. If I would have interviewed for an internship and then been offered a position but no pay, I would have laughed in your face.
I’m talking about the inappropriate and unprofessional behavior these interns exhibit: Showing up hours late, spending more time kissing ass of executives then doing the work they volunteered to do, etc etc.Paid or not, it should be common sense not to do this, right? How can they expect us to hire them after college or get positive references?
And no, we do not give the interns mindless grunt work. We teach them Excel/Powerpoint skills, have them do analyses to develop their critical thinking.
Perhaps then, these are an entirely different and unique set of circumstance from that which you came up from. "spending more time kissing ass of executives then doing the work they volunteered to do, etc etc.Paid or not, it should be common sense not to do this, right? How can they expect us to hire them after college or get positive references?"
Sounds to me like these recent college grads have just been "getting by" throughout their entire lives if indeed your organization had to "teach them Excel/Powerpoint skills...develop their critical thinking." If these young people have attended a four year university AND received a Bachelors degree (at the minimum) and they still have to be taught these skills, I am thinking they have far better connections than their peers or counterparts in education and/or industry. Most students learn these skills no later than when they are in High School (depending on 'when' they were in High School).
I am just going to throw this out there and let it fall where it may...perhaps these 'interns' are just taking up space and time and will already have the necessary 'tools' they need to get hired somewhere with 'positive references' already in hand...Mom, Dad, other relatives, well placed insiders in industry, etc., etc.
The well known organization in the industry you are in is just perhaps just the 'designer label' they need to place the 'icing on the cake' as it were. Just a thought, but it sounds as if they may just be spoiled 'entitled' brats.
As far as their "spending more timekissing ass of executives then doing the work they volunteered to do, etc etc." Sounds as if not only will they fit right in wherever they end up...Fortune 500 companies, the Halls of Justice, Big government, Politics...these are exactly the skills they need to have and hone on their 'way up the ladder'.
Having read through some of this, and having interned myself, I'll have to agree that the basic problem here is one of reward.
- College credit. So long as they do the internship, they get it. There's no benefit to good performance.
- Coming in late - So long as they aren't so awful that you get rid of them, it doesn't matter. If they were paid hourly, coming in late directly equals making less money, a strong incentive to work their # of hours.
- References - Are worthless today. Few employers today expect or will contact them. Most companies have it as a matter of corporate policy that their staff can't give references, and there's liability issues with contacting a reference for the company doing the hiring as well.
- Getting hired - I'm guessing that they don't expect to be.
Beyond this, you also have the problem that with the lack of pay you're really cutting down your potential pool of interns. Anyone not well-off is going to want/need paying employment for the summer, even if it's just a service job, they're probably going to take that instead. The well-off.....will probably have some type of connection into a paid or prestigious position. Assuming you're not a charitable organization or something, I'd say not offering pay means your selection pool is the bottom rung of students.
Fire them. Seriously. Their work ethic sucks, and I wouldn't keep them around. Someone wanders in 2-3 hours late, they better understand that that is their last day on the job. Their "pay" is their college credit, and no one forced them to take the internship. Pay, or no pay -- their attitude and behavior is unacceptable. Money is only going to go so far in fixing their attitude -- sooner or later, people like this will decide they aren't making enough money, and will start to slack off in these ways. So it's not just money -- it's attitude. If they accept an internship with the expectation of certain hours each day, and certain tasks to be performed -- then they should have the character to fulfill their end of the bargain.
The other problem is that they have TIME to watch videos on the internet, or spend in long lunch hours. Why aren't they busy? Is work not getting done? Do you have an internship development program, or is this just a hole they fall in to watch what is going on so that they can pick up some easy credits? IS there a spelled-out program of "these are the expectations, and this is how we will achieve the objectives"? (PS: "Forgot to save the document" might work once. Second time -- they're outta there, if they are so stupid they can't figure out how to save a document - when most programs auto-save anyway! -- and are stupid enough to think I don't know that. I despise being lied to.)
Expectations need to be spelled out, in detail, and someone needs to be riding herd on them to teach them what real life in your business is all about. Make it clear that if they are non-performing, they don't get the credit. You wouldn't accept this behavior from an employee -- why in the hell you accepting it from an intern?
Back in the 1990s when I was in college, it was pretty commonplace to have unpaid internships. However, most of those were for about 8 hours a week.
Times have changed.
Many people would take the unpaid internship for the work experience and the references.
Nowadays employers won't even GIVE references, only stating the dates that you worked for the company. So it's useless to work for free for that purpose for many people.
If you did a great job at your internship, you had a real chance of getting a job with the company after you graduated. I know many people who got great jobs after graduation.
Nowadays many of these companies have no intention of hiring their interns after they graduate. They just want the free labor.
Back in the 1990s when I was in college, it was pretty commonplace to have unpaid internships. However, most of those were for about 8 hours a week.
Times have changed.
Many people would take the unpaid internship for the work experience and the references.
Nowadays employers won't even GIVE references, only stating the dates that you worked for the company. So it's useless to work for free for that purpose for many people.
If you did a great job at your internship, you had a real chance of getting a job with the company after you graduated. I know many people who got great jobs after graduation.
Nowadays many of these companies have no intention of hiring their interns after they graduate. They just want the free labor.
The poster who pointed out that private sector is different from public sector is right on. Most of the interns on Capitol Hill are unpaid, and are there to drink in the ambiance and get a gold star on their resume. A very, very few end up getting hired as staffers - maybe one or two a year, out of a Representative or Senate intern staff of 15-30 a year.
I'll gladly point out that there is a huge difference between public unpaid interns and private unpaid interns.
The government continues to (naively) think that they offer your an experience that can't be match by a paid internship. Reality is that while an unpaid internship by the government has no competition from other government internships(funny how that works) the private sector is moving towards more paid internships.
They also regularly reward those who can actually negotiate for money for their efforts. Private paid internships are far superior to the people who accept the pitiful existence of an unpaid internship. You lose now and you lose later if you take one.
Not in dc. Most private companies don't pay their interns. And no there is no negotiation on pay. You either accept what they will pay you or you can look elsewhere. There are way too many people looking for jobs.
My company pays interns fairly decently. I haven't seen any that are lacking. In fact the one that we did have in our department put together critical research that would otherwise be considered admin work; but it will save the company hundreds of thousands of dollars in the long term.
I don't think the problem is them not being paid. I think the problem is that your management is too afraid to lay down the law before, during and after the internship. Expectations have to be clear and they need to be met.
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