The African Role In The Slave Trade (view, crime, country)

[ADOSwarrior]

Originally Posted by reneeh63

There's certainly a lot of blame to go around. Why does anyone think that pointing out others' involvement does anything at all to absolve them of their OWN?

Point is ALL parties involved are guilty and have blood on their hands. But these parties don't want to have any accountability which is the real issue.

[Ellis Bell]

Originally Posted by Ellis Bell

Nope it's just logic. You need to offer up something here, you know that right? Like how it would have existed without the African Lords participation in it.

Explain it to me, because as it is, I'm the only one doing any explaining. You've got documentary on it somewhere right that shows a different 'stance'? Or are they all in the TLDR category for you.
And you get that from where? Not to mention --- How? From my understanding Malaria kept everyone on their ships at port, least the contract the diseases in Africa and succumb to their deaths. Not to mention how did they navigate through the ruff terrain and get past the huge wild animals of the African jungles?

If that's wrong, show me where it is wrong. Show your homework on how they conducted their thievery. Inquiring minds want to know.
That's your interpretation in your attempt to bastardize ancient history documentations. King Solomon was a black man; so you're going to try and tell me he was a subhuman, as well as, the Egyptian Pharaohs? It was debtor's prison; people being sentenced who owed taxes and the law of the land, that brought about the Institution of Slavery within the first century of historical documentation. For your timeline --- that's before, during and after the fall of Ancient Rome and the Church was a group of people.
Igbos, for one as I've already showed you in the 'my great-grandfather the Nigerian Slave Trader, article which you have yet to read. I know you haven't read it as you're not bringing up anything that hasn't already been asked and answered. His name was Nwaubani Ogogo Oriaku, and he kept his slaves chained up with heavy chains. They buried six-slaves with him alive, when he died.

Additional documentation (don't know why I bother)
"The transatlantic slave trade was fed by the emergence of these Volta Kingdoms and the Asante Empire." Africans Before the Atlantic Slave Trade
I can't until you explain to me how their cultural 'caste system' is any different, from Apartheid, Jim Crow laws and the black codes of the Northern u.s. I guess you forgot about the later, just as you skipped their caste system in my post above.
Says you and no one else except maybe the ones who brainwashed you into believing it --- so therefore you will have to answer that question.

However, they never did get away from the caste system, so the answer to that question I suspect lays there and since their spiritual religious ceremonies included cutting off people's heads; planting the heads in flower pots and burying them alive --- wouldn't you call that a spiritual brutality? Gotto love Voodoo.

Originally Posted by SLIMMACKEY

The mere fact that you believe that Europeans/Spanish/Portuguese never left their ships due to malaria and wild jungle animals is some sort of historical fact or even a talking pont saying a lot about this conversation. As well as your constant tap dancing around social racial systems put in place by those same groups of people to continually suppress and oppress descendants of slavery. I mean a simple study of the Royal African Company would have assisted you from making the obtuse former statement about them staying on their ships...lmao. This cannot be real. But we have to start there....then i will systematically address the other statements you made. But ony after we discuss that..all of your points are pure conjecture. Heres a start for your education from English sources.

"Slavery was paying dividends. Other European powers such as the Spanish and Portuguese had begun to exploit the New World. Since the 1560s the English had been eyeing the prizes brought back with envy. They had not, however, shown much interest in the emerging transatlantic trade in slaves. A few slave ships under John Dawkins had been sent to English colonies in the 16th century. The West Coast of Africa was not, until the mid 17th century, of much interest to the British.

Interest in the West African Slave Trade grew as a result of the Anglo-Dutch War of 1652-54. The Dutch had a large mercantile fleet operating in the Atlantic off the coast of West Africa. It had posed a threat to the Royal Navy during this entirely sea based war. Following the restoration of King Charles II this threat was identified and an opportunity noted. Among Charles’ closest advisors were Prince Rupert, who was from the Rhineland, and Richard Holmes, an Anglo-Irish mercenary. Rupert had visited parts of West Africa. Holmes was keen to take on the Dutch.

Prince Rupert learnt of the riches that African leaders were acquiring from the interior of the continent. He persuaded Prince James, Duke of York (Future James II), to lobby for an English interest to be established in the area. This lobbying led to the authorisation of a mission, led by Holmes, to Gorée."

Originally Posted by SLIMMACKEY

Cultural caste system is equal to social racial oppresive systems? And you want me to expound on the differences bewtenn the 2 to prove you wrong? LMAO

Apartheid and Jim crow were not based upon social class or economics cher. They were socially constructed institutions created to oppress a particular race of people solely based on their color. The Dutch did not apply Apartheid to the English. They applied it to the African. Jim Crow was not applied to Scots or Irish, it was applicable to what all white people called "Coloered" or Black". This is too simple. Black codes were not created to limit poor blacks from access to everything america had to offer bbefore or after the Emancipation Proclamation, they were made to limit ALL black people. Hence the name......

"The Black Codes, sometimes called Black Laws, were laws governing the conduct of African Americans (free and freed blacks). In 1832, James Kent wrote that "in most of the United States, there is a distinction in respect to political privileges, between free white persons and free colored persons of African blood; and in no part of the country do the latter, in point of fact, participate equally with the whites, in the exercise of civil and political rights."Although Black Codes existed before the Civil War and many Northern states had them, it was the Southern U.S. states that codified such laws in everyday practice. The best known of them were passed in 1865 and 1866 by Southern states, after the American Civil War, in order to restrict African Americans' freedom, and to compel them to work for low wages.

Since the colonial period, colonies and states had passed laws that discriminated against free Blacks. In the South, these were generally included in "slave codes"; the goal was to suppress the influence of free blacks (particularly after slave rebellions) because of their potential influence on slaves. Restrictions included prohibiting them from voting (although North Carolina had allowed this before 1831), bearing arms, gathering in groups for worship, and learning to read and write. The purpose of these laws was to preserve slavery in slave societies." James Kent, a white man wrote the Commentaries on American Law. I swear it shouldnt be this hard.....imperical fact.....

The Igbo are ONE ethnic group in the region now known as Nigeria. Their history is very well known, so I challenge you to name on etribal leader as I asked before, that even the Portuguese dealt with in the manufactured capture and trade of slaves. It should be easy as Brazil imported more slaves than anyone. These are all very simple and easy questions yo should be able to easily answer. Also, which other countries had Apartheid or Jim Crow level socially sonstructed laws?

You havent explained anything actually. Ive had to explain to you the context on the subject as you are completely off base.

If a native African can't tell you any different, who am I to try.

[SLIMMACKEY]

Originally Posted by Ellis Bell

If a native African can't tell you any different, who am I to try.

All you've done is regurgitate. I've countered all your points with points that are complete and accurate. When pressed you seem to falter.

Its clear that maybe you dont quite understand the context and nuance of the issue. The causes, effects, and derivatives......because not only have you claimed that none of the purveyors of the transatlantic slave trade actually traversed inland to capture slaves, even when they themselves have documented it, you also falsely equivocate caste systems with racially social oppressive systems. That leads me to believe that you may not believe any of the facts presented about the transatlantic slave trade actually are truthful, even when deemed so by the protagonists. In which case a discussion is neither fruitful or warranted. Either way, tchau

[Ellis Bell]

Originally Posted by Ellis Bell

If a native African can't tell you any different, who am I to try.

Originally Posted by SLIMMACKEY

All you've done is regurgitate. I've countered all your points with points that are complete and accurate. When pressed you seem to falter.

Its clear that maybe you dont quite understand the context and nuance of the issue. The causes, effects, and derivatives......because not only have you claimed that none of the purveyors of the transatlantic slave trade actually traversed inland to capture slaves, even when they themselves have documented it, you also falsely equivocate caste systems with racially social oppressive systems. That leads me to believe that you may not believe any of the facts presented about the transatlantic slave trade actually are truthful, even when deemed so by the protagonists. In which case a discussion is neither fruitful or warranted. Either way, tchau

Originally Posted by SLIMMACKEY

Its clear that maybe you dont quite understand the context and nuance of the issue.

It's clear to me all you want to do is bust my chops.

Adaobi Tricia Nwaubani is who (a native African) you believe is bringing false information as she is the source I have brought to this thread. If you really wanted to have a meaningful conversation, then it would have started with her and her knowledge that she brings to this topic. She's the one who will tell you, that the Europeans didn't leave the ship port, but waited for the slaves (all bound and ready) to be brought to them. If you don't believe her, then I don't know what to tell you.

Everything you've said that I have done in these post, is what you have been doing (trolling) in these posts, to everything I've said. You've offered nothing, but the same brainwashed material that we've been (politically) subjected to for the last 250 years. And I'm not looking any more of this sh-t up (tribal customs and ways) for you, because the source materiel I have brought, you never wanted to talk about, but only state that I was being obtuse. As for as me regurgitating your posts, if I had been doing that, then you and I would have had nothing to talk about.

No one did (Trans Atlantic Slave Trade) anything that the those (business men or Lords of the African kingdoms) native to Africa didn't allow, because they couldn't without their say so. To try, there would have been a war that would make our Civil War, look like a three year long picnic.

btw: the caste system is oppressive and none different than any black codes or laws, because as it is, Africa is a very diversified continent. If all a person sees (that that is not backed by science) is black and white folk, they'll never get it and there's nothing anyone can do about that.

[Dopo]

Why is this in the Africa forum instead of the history forum?

[SLIMMACKEY]

Originally Posted by Ellis Bell

It's clear to me all you want to do is bust my chops.

Adaobi Tricia Nwaubani is who (a native African) you believe is bringing false information as she is the source I have brought to this thread. If you really wanted to have a meaningful conversation, then it would have started with her and her knowledge that she brings to this topic. She's the one who will tell you, that the Europeans didn't leave the ship port, but waited for the slaves (all bound and ready) to be brought to them. If you don't believe her, then I don't know what to tell you.

Everything you've said that I have done in these post, is what you have been doing (trolling) in these posts, to everything I've said. You've offered nothing, but the same brainwashed material that we've been (politically) subjected to for the last 250 years. And I'm not looking any more of this sh-t up (tribal customs and ways) for you, because the source materiel I have brought, you never wanted to talk about, but only state that I was being obtuse. As for as me regurgitating your posts, if I had been doing that, then you and I would have had nothing to talk about.

No one did (Trans Atlantic Slave Trade) anything that the those (business men or Lords of the African kingdoms) native to Africa didn't allow, because they couldn't without their say so. To try, there would have been a war that would make our Civil War, look like a three year long picnic.

btw: the caste system is oppressive and none different than any black codes or laws, because as it is, Africa is a very diversified continent. If all a person sees (that that is not backed by science) is black and white folk, they'll never get it and there's nothing anyone can do about that.

Facts are trolling?? LMAO....surely you jest.....you cant argue the invalidity of any of the documented facts Ive presented. Theres a reason why......

You say that no Euros travelled inland due to Malaria and Jungle animals....FALSE.
You stated that the caste system is akin to Apartheid and Jim Crow....FALSE.
You've been asked to provide a reference to tribal leaders whom initiated the sale of African souls...this is a relevant question because you insinuate that the Africans sought out the Euros to trade the POW's. I would argue you are again FALSE.....the Spanish and Portuguese, include the Dutch as well all were engaged in capturing Africans before the English got involved. You cannot refute this so you conveniently try and avoid it.

Again, address your false statements if you would like to have a conversation about facts.

[SLIMMACKEY]

Originally Posted by Dopo

Why is this in the Africa forum instead of the history forum?

It wouldnt matter to the people posting nonsense in here. When confronted with fact they still push their narratives.

[Ellis Bell]

Originally Posted by SLIMMACKEY

Facts are trolling?? LMAO....surely you jest.....you cant argue the invalidity of any of the documented facts Ive presented. Theres a reason why......

You say that no Euros travelled inland due to Malaria and Jungle animals....FALSE.
You stated that the caste system is akin to Apartheid and Jim Crow....FALSE.
You've been asked to provide a reference to tribal leaders whom initiated the sale of African souls...this is a relevant question because you insinuate that the Africans sought out the Euros to trade the POW's. I would argue you are again FALSE.....the Spanish and Portuguese, include the Dutch as well all were engaged in capturing Africans before the English got involved. You cannot refute this so you conveniently try and avoid it.

Again, address your false statements if you would like to have a conversation about facts.

I bring the facts, you bring your opinion ...

Adaobi Tricia Nwaubani says your wrong. Washington Post says your wrong, BBC says your wrong and the Guardian also says your wrong.

Originally Posted by SLIMMACKEY

You've been asked to provide a reference to tribal leaders whom initiated the sale of African souls...this is a relevant question because you insinuate that the Africans sought out the Euros to trade the POW's. I would argue you are again FALSE

Adaobi Nwaubani has already been provided as reference, what more do you wamt? But since you keep asking for more, another reference, PBS: Europeans Come to Western Africa

"The well-armed fort provided a secure harbor for Portuguese (and later Dutch and English) ships. Africans were either captured in warring raids or kidnapped and taken to the port by African slave traders."

Originally Posted by SLIMMACKEY

You say that no Euros travelled inland due to Malaria and Jungle animals....FALSE.

As well as, the rough terrain and the war that that would have caused. Everything you've stated that is false is your opinion on my posts, nothing more but what a troll would do in an attempt to tick me off.

[Ellis Bell]

Originally Posted by Dopo

Why is this in the Africa forum instead of the history forum?

Could be that slavery nor the African role in it, isn't history.

[Ellis Bell]

Originally Posted by SLIMMACKEY

Cultural caste system is equal to social racial oppresive systems? And you want me to expound on the differences bewtenn the 2 to prove you wrong? LMAO

Also, which other countries had Apartheid or Jim Crow level socially sonstructed laws?

India and Asia and socially practiced today, as well.

Originally Posted by SLIMMACKEY

And you want me to expound on the differences bewtenn the 2 to prove you wrong? LMAO

Since Apartheid is an example of a caste system I'd be very interested in learning how you think they are different. If you can find a document that backs up what you think, that'd be great too.