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It isn't just the money. Murder, robbery, smuggling will/should be reduced.
Lastly........when people are throwing back Jack in a bar there is usually trouble, when is the last time anyone has seen two guys go at it after smoking a joint?
Contrary to what many think, cannabis will legal in all states. Just a matter of time.
And, there is a science to growing different strains. The next time you get the stomach flu and throwing up your guts you will wish you had a joint. I'm attempting to use logic. I don't grow I don't smoke but I do see the smokescreen the clowns in the Federal Government have created.
Remember agent orange and the lies the government told to our soldiers?..............never forget........never forgive
Know what you can trust............the government will lie
Again, if we're only doing it because it will give the state money, that's a pretty bad argument.
The money for the state is just a benefit of legalization. Marijuana is here to stay, it's been widely used since the 60's. Arizona has a very harsh marijuana law. Any amount is a felony. Thousands of otherwise law abiding, tax paying citizens get criminal felony records every year in this state. That doesn't look good on a job application. Nobody is condoning driving while buzzed or teen use. Dealers don't ask for ID. Legal shops do. The time has come and it's the right thing to do.
Arizona Laws & Penalties
Possession for personal use of less than 2 pounds of marijuana is a Class 6 felony, punishable by a minimum sentence of 4 months, a maximum sentence of 2 years, and a minimum fine of $1000 or a fine to exhaust the proceeds of the drug offense. If probation is granted after conviction for this offense, the offender will face a mandatory sentence of 24 hours of community service.
I am strongly for Cannabis for prescribed medical reasons but am not sure, leaning against it for recreational use.
The main argument that I here from the recreational supporters is A. It's no worse than alcohol B. It'll make millions for the state. C. It will stop the black market.
The first one "might" be true but don't we have enough issues with drunks as it is? As for the second, that is a lousy justification to make something legal. Especially since it's eventual cost to society may outweigh it's benefit if people are killed over it. As for stopping the black market, that's been shown to be false as people will gravitate to cheaper costs which will be the untaxed product smuggled in.
If we're going down that road, where is the screaming from the mountain tops/election item that prostitution be made legal?
I hope Arizona passes the bill this fall, and I honestly can't for the life of me understand any reluctance to legalize. I appreciate your doubts and respect that you have concerns about it, but let me address the three points you cited...
Re: Point A...
I don't know if you've ever used marijuana or not, but I have a lot, albeit not in many years. It really isn't worse than alcohol. Really. And many can and do make a good argument that it is much, much better. Smoking anything certainly isn't good for your health, but there are many more ways to consume marijuana these days, including edibles. There are no recorded "overdoses" of marijuana that have ever resulted in death. Prolonged alcohol abuse leads to heart disease, liver failure, kidney issues, damaged familial relationships, etc...all of which but the latter have the ability to kill you. There is much debate about other long-term effects of heavy marijuana use, however most physicians and those who have studied it agree that frequent users aren't likely to experience much worse than weight gain associated with spending too much time on your couch eating Cheetos.
I'm not sure specifically which issues with drunks it is that you're referring to, but because the effects of alcohol and marijuana on the brain are so different, the behavior of those intoxicated by each substance is very different as well. As an example, many who abuse alcohol are more prone to fighting or otherwise acting out. People who are stoned don't usually want to get out of their chair. We could argue that the increased laziness is a problem to some extent, but that's about where it ends.
That said, I don't advocate smoking and driving any more than drinking and driving, and that represents one of the few hurdles that need to be overcome. Not sure if driving stoned is any better than driving drunk, but it represents a danger to others on the road regardless. There needs to be a reasonable standard established for impaired driving. There is a lot of disagreement on what constitutes a level of marijuana in your system that results in impairment, but the effects don't last more than a few hours after ingesting it. But because marijuana stays in your system for anywhere from days to weeks depending on how frequent an individual uses, it's been difficult to come up with a threshold that doesn't identify drivers with marijuana in their system who may not actually be impaired at all as lawbreakers.
Re: Point B...
The revenue isn't a reason to legalize by itself, but it's a nice bonus to tack onto all the other reasons why recreational use should be legalized. The drug war as a whole is a lost cause and a drain on both financial and human resources, with billions spent on it every year. Marijuana prohibition is a huge part of that since it is among the most popular illicit substances.
The number of individuals incarcerated in America for non-violent marijuana-related crimes is staggering. Take those individuals out of the system and it frees up a good deal of police resources, legal/court resources, and beds in jail for people who actually pose a threat to society. When you consider all the freed resources and the elimination of the wasted dollars associated with upholding marijuana prohibition, the fact that it can be turned into a source of positive cash flow for the state is just gravy.
Re: Point C...
You're right, it won't stop the black market. But the black market (for marijuana, anyway) won't be near what it is now. The shady apartment example another poster mentioned is spot on.
For the record, I believe all drugs should be legal, as should prostitution and any other behavior a person wants to engage in that doesn't hurt or infringe upon the rights of others. So the idea of marijuana legalization fits neatly into my very Libertarian opinions on these matters. But besides the philosophical differences, I truly believe that failing to pass this bill in the fall would be a serious mistake for all the economic and societal reasons stated above.
All I'm saying is we ought to be real careful and real sure about what we're willing to do just to get some extra $$$$$.
It's more than all about money. How many folks have had their lives totally messed up for no other reason than because they had a joint in their possession? Before someone goes all law & order on me, I hope they think real hard about any transgression they might have acted on in their own lives. Glass houses.
I am strongly for Cannabis for prescribed medical reasons but am not sure, leaning against it for recreational use.
The main argument that I here from the recreational supporters is A. It's no worse than alcohol B. It'll make millions for the state. C. It will stop the black market.
The first one "might" be true but don't we have enough issues with drunks as it is? As for the second, that is a lousy justification to make something legal. Especially since it's eventual cost to society may outweigh it's benefit if people are killed over it. As for stopping the black market, that's been shown to be false as people will gravitate to cheaper costs which will be the untaxed product smuggled in.
If we're going down that road, where is the screaming from the mountain tops/election item that prostitution be made legal?
Could you please show some proof to back that up. That is completely opposite from my experience. 15% is nothing when it guarantees the safety and quality of an unregulated product.
Again, if we're only doing it because it will give the state money, that's a pretty bad argument.
The border patrol/Police/Military will always be searching for drugs, no matter if they're legal here or not as they can't tax drugs smuggled in (which is the point of legalizing right?), not to mention Cocaine,Heroin,Meth etc. are still in demand.
All I'm saying is we ought to be real careful and real sure about what we're willing to do just to get some extra $$$$$.
I never said only for the money, but that is a part of it.
It's unconscionable what we do to people for nonviolent smoking of a plant.
The money for the state is just a benefit of legalization. Marijuana is here to stay, it's been widely used since the 60's. Arizona has a very harsh marijuana law. Any amount is a felony. Thousands of otherwise law abiding, tax paying citizens get criminal felony records every year in this state. That doesn't look good on a job application. Nobody is condoning driving while buzzed or teen use. Dealers don't ask for ID. Legal shops do. The time has come and it's the right thing to do.
Arizona Laws & Penalties
Possession for personal use of less than 2 pounds of marijuana is a Class 6 felony, punishable by a minimum sentence of 4 months, a maximum sentence of 2 years, and a minimum fine of $1000 or a fine to exhaust the proceeds of the drug offense. If probation is granted after conviction for this offense, the offender will face a mandatory sentence of 24 hours of community service.
You will not get an argument from me that Arizona has become/is a police state. They do love their fines/jail time for anything/everything.
This isn't a true legalization initiative as it's laden with special interest. The medical marijuana industry is one of the primary funding sources for anti-legalization efforts. This is being driven by folks that seek to benefit financially from it. It is, however, a better alternative to what we have in place now. People should not be going to jail for possessing a plant. It's that simple.
If this initiative passes, those that favor for true legalization need to keep pushing. The bus needs to get from point A to point C. Don't settle with stopping at point B.
Could you please show some proof to back that up. That is completely opposite from my experience. 15% is nothing when it guarantees the safety and quality of an unregulated product.
"While no one expected the state's first-in-the-nation recreational sales would eliminate the need for dangerous underground sales overnight, the violence has raised concerns among police, prosecutors and pot advocates that a black market for marijuana is alive and well in Colorado.
"It has done nothing more than enhance the opportunity for the black market," said Lt. Mark Comte of the Colorado Springs police vice and narcotics unit. "If you can get it tax-free on the corner, you're going to get it on the corner."
I hope Arizona passes the bill this fall, and I honestly can't for the life of me understand any reluctance to legalize. I appreciate your doubts and respect that you have concerns about it, but let me address the three points you cited...
Re: Point A...
I don't know if you've ever used marijuana or not, but I have a lot, albeit not in many years. It really isn't worse than alcohol. Really. And many can and do make a good argument that it is much, much better. Smoking anything certainly isn't good for your health, but there are many more ways to consume marijuana these days, including edibles. There are no recorded "overdoses" of marijuana that have ever resulted in death. Prolonged alcohol abuse leads to heart disease, liver failure, kidney issues, damaged familial relationships, etc...all of which but the latter have the ability to kill you. There is much debate about other long-term effects of heavy marijuana use, however most physicians and those who have studied it agree that frequent users aren't likely to experience much worse than weight gain associated with spending too much time on your couch eating Cheetos.
I'm not sure specifically which issues with drunks it is that you're referring to, but because the effects of alcohol and marijuana on the brain are so different, the behavior of those intoxicated by each substance is very different as well. As an example, many who abuse alcohol are more prone to fighting or otherwise acting out. People who are stoned don't usually want to get out of their chair. We could argue that the increased laziness is a problem to some extent, but that's about where it ends.
That said, I don't advocate smoking and driving any more than drinking and driving, and that represents one of the few hurdles that need to be overcome. Not sure if driving stoned is any better than driving drunk, but it represents a danger to others on the road regardless. There needs to be a reasonable standard established for impaired driving. There is a lot of disagreement on what constitutes a level of marijuana in your system that results in impairment, but the effects don't last more than a few hours after ingesting it. But because marijuana stays in your system for anywhere from days to weeks depending on how frequent an individual uses, it's been difficult to come up with a threshold that doesn't identify drivers with marijuana in their system who may not actually be impaired at all as lawbreakers.
Re: Point B...
The revenue isn't a reason to legalize by itself, but it's a nice bonus to tack onto all the other reasons why recreational use should be legalized. The drug war as a whole is a lost cause and a drain on both financial and human resources, with billions spent on it every year. Marijuana prohibition is a huge part of that since it is among the most popular illicit substances.
The number of individuals incarcerated in America for non-violent marijuana-related crimes is staggering. Take those individuals out of the system and it frees up a good deal of police resources, legal/court resources, and beds in jail for people who actually pose a threat to society. When you consider all the freed resources and the elimination of the wasted dollars associated with upholding marijuana prohibition, the fact that it can be turned into a source of positive cash flow for the state is just gravy.
Re: Point C...
You're right, it won't stop the black market. But the black market (for marijuana, anyway) won't be near what it is now. The shady apartment example another poster mentioned is spot on.
For the record, I believe all drugs should be legal, as should prostitution and any other behavior a person wants to engage in that doesn't hurt or infringe upon the rights of others. So the idea of marijuana legalization fits neatly into my very Libertarian opinions on these matters. But besides the philosophical differences, I truly believe that failing to pass this bill in the fall would be a serious mistake for all the economic and societal reasons stated above.
I for one would like to see the full mechanism in place to identify and quantify drivers under the influence of MJ before it's made fully legal. Unless of course people are willing to go with ANY THC in your system while driving is illegal? No? Didn't think so, and rightly so.
There is testing and limits in place for alcohol but no "real" testing/limits for THC. This is unacceptable if we're going to basically allow altered drivers to be on our roadways
BTW, I'm not going for the idea that pot makes one a "better/safer" driver. Having been there/done that I KNOW it's B.S.
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They do love their fines/jail time for anything/everything.
