Mexican (Sinaloense) culture in Arizona (Phoenix, Tucson: loans, hotel, home)

[RudyOD]

I haven't spent much time in Arizona to make any real conclusive verdict (so insight from locals is much greatly appreciated), but from my few visits I can tell that the Mexican culture there is distinct to the one I'm used to in California. I think the main reason due to the origins of Mexicans that settle in Arizona, that being mostly from Sonora and Sinaloa. Sinaloa and Sonora used to be one state at a point, so the two states have somewhat of a sisterhood going on, and therefore a Sinaloan and Sonoran would get along well (kind of how Washington and Oregon are both similar, but slightly different.) Nonetheless, being from Sinaloa is like being from Texas in the U.S. A very distinct cultural pride to the point that Sinaloenses tend to associate themselves with Sinaloa above all else, even before Mexican - just like Texans.

The Sinaloense presence particularly stands out to me, as my family is Sinaloan and Sinaloans are rare in California (to the point that we become instant family when we meet one another, like a lost brother or sister). I've noticed over the years that while our branch of the family headed for L.A./O.C., anyone else that decided to immigrate to the U.S. went straight to Arizona. Also doing a quick search on YELP for key terms like 'Sinaloa', 'Sinaloense', 'Culiacan' (the capital of Sinaloa) and 'Mazatlan' (Sinaloa's main port city/tourist destination), popped up a plethora of restaurants and businesses. Plenty in Phoenix, but even more so in Tucson (probably due to the proximity to the border). In Tucson I even saw a Sinaloense style hot dog stand (never seen this in L.A!): El Sinaloense Hot Dog Cart - Midtown - Tucson, AZ | Yelp (If you were to go to Mazatlan, you would notice that hot dog stands are almost as common as taco stands.) Sinaloa is known for its seafood, so lots of those restaurants will most likely sell at least a shrimp taco, if not a dedicated 'mariscos' place.

I found this: Mazatlan Interactivo | Hoteles | Bienes Raices | Paseos | Restaurantes - Sinaloenses en Tucson Entrevista

It's an article about the Arizona Association of Sinaloans...which we don't have in California. Though California has Mexicans from all over, the most common states represented are from central Mexico, especially Jalisco and Michoacan. More recently there has been an influx of southern Mexicans (Oaxacans, Yucatenos etc) and Central Americans to L.A., but overall very little from the Northwest of Mexico. When Sinaloenses do go to the Californias, they end up staying in Tijuana and don't cross over unless it is for tourism (San Diego, Disney, road trips to SF).

As to what this means for Arizona.... What you have are Mexicans who essentially see Arizona as an extension of Mexico (a cleaner one with better paying jobs). To them, going back home is just a couple hours drive. They are used to the heat (though Sinaloa is a little more tropical and humid than Sonora) and probably find it (to a point) comforting. They most likely have very strong connections to their home state, even when they are several generations in, due to proximity and concentration. My family in Arizona visit back home (Culiacan) several times a year - to them it is just a weekend trip (11 hours from Nogales), almost like going to San Francisco is for me (8 hours from OC). This as opposed to Mexicans in Californian, who have adapted more of a Chicano identity (it isn't mine, but sometimes I feel it is forced upon me) or a pan-Mexican one. Mexicans in California, do visit their home states, but not as often, and second generation children tend to forget their origins. Overall, I find that while Mexicans in Arizona are still well connected to their roots (in Sinaloa and Sonora), they are also very proud and happy to call Arizona home (at least I find this true within my family.)

A negative: Arizona probably experiences more Narco culture as well. We definitely aren't all drug dealers, but unfortunately Sinaloenses are pretty much at the top of the food chain when it comes to the drug cartels (we run them). Among the general populace, some have come to (foolishly) admire the cartel leaders, and even praise and protest when they end up getting arrested. Sinaloa is home to the patron saint of the cartels, El Malverde (Jesús Malverde - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia). So, due to this, I would say that Arizona probably gets more than its fair share (compared even to other border states) of bad blood flowing in. It might not be the case at all, but I know enough about my home state (Sinaloa) to assume otherwise.

Any other insights?

[jamies]

Who cares about mexican culture in America?

Either be a Mexican and go home, or be an American. I'm getting sick of this ethnic separation garbage.

My family is from Britan. I'm not a "British American.". I don't celebrate the Queens birthday. Why do Mexicans need to make Cinco de Mayo a big deal in America? July 4th is just another day in Mexico. I don't relate to British drug dealers, or refer to them as " we.". I'm an American.

Make a choice.

[RudyOD]

Originally Posted by jamies

Who cares about mexican culture in America?

Either be a Mexican and go home, or be an American. I'm getting sick of this ethnic separation garbage.

My family is from Britan. I'm not a "British American.". I don't celebrate the Queens birthday. Why do Mexicans need to make Cinco de Mayo a big deal in America? July 4th is just another day in Mexico. I don't relate to British drug dealers, or refer to them as " we.". I'm an American.

Make a choice.

You must not be from around here.

Mexican culture is a big part of the Southwestern U.S. Specifically, I am discussing culture from Sonora and Sinaloa that is being imported to Arizona, and vice versa, as this region has been connected for hundreds of years since colonial times, even longer if you we look at the history of the natives that roamed the Sonora desert before it was split into its modern political entity.

Also, this isn't a discussion about identity. I'm not asking whether Mexicans in Arizona identify as Americans or Mexicans or Mexican Americans or Chicano, I'm asking about what is particular (the nuances) to Arizona as opposed to states like California, New Mexico or Texas that also have strong Mexican influences. I could easily have a similar conversation about the different types of Chinese immigrants in California (old school Cantonese SF and LA's Chinatown, new school mainlanders in the SGV...Taiwanese in Rowland Heights, etc).

Lastly, Mexican's don't celebrate Cinco de Mayo. You must have immigrated yesterday. Everyone knows (at least if you are a native of California, the Southwest or Texas) that while Cinco de Mayo is of historical significance for Mexicans (Battle of Puebla, blah blah blah), it is just another excuse of a holiday for Americans to get drunk (like St. Patricks day.)

Get over yourself, if it isn't something that interest you, move on.

- a fellow American

[cacto]

I've noticed some neighborhoods in PHX seem to be full of people from the same Mexican state. Seems like Sunnyslope has a lot of Oaxacans but there's also a Mexico City style restaurant there. I swear I've seen more than one "mariscos Sinoloa" place but not sure where (east PHX).
I see a lot of Sonora and Sinaloa license plates in central PHX near Town and Country and the Biltmore. These are nicer vehicles and I get the feeling they drove up for higher end shopping.

[AlohaFriday]

Interesting thread, Rudy.

I appreciate the time you put into writing that post and found it very informative. I'm not well-acquainted with Mexican culture and enjoyed your insights about the differences between AZ's and California's Hispanic populations.

[MrPHX]

California definitely has a worse narco problem. If you want a mexico feel in az try maryvale in phoenix.

[cBach]

But does AZ embrace this Sinaloense culture?

[AlohaFriday]

Originally Posted by cBach

But does AZ embrace this Sinaloense culture?

Whatever Sinaloense culture is here stays in the pockets where those people live. Did you read that other dude's post? The inflammatory one? A lot of people feel that way.

[cBach]

Originally Posted by AlohaFriday

Whatever Sinaloense culture is here stays in the pockets where those people live. Did you read that other dude's post? The inflammatory one? A lot of people feel that way.

Is the other guy's attitude typical of Arizona folks? Perhaps that would explain why I didn't perceive a "culture".

[AlohaFriday]

I think there's a contingent of very conservative people who feel that way and are very vocal about it, a contingent of moderate people who may feel that way to a lesser extent but don't vocalize their feelings, and a third contingent, probably in the minority, would be open and accepting to a more robust Mexican influence.

Unfortunately, many Mexicans in Arizona remain poor and segregated in poor communities, like urban Blacks in other places. I don't say this to be racist or mean it to be a blanket statement, but that is the trend. Of course there are exceptions. Because they are segregated, their cultural influences tend to stay enclosed inside the areas they live.

For example, many of the really good Mexican restaurants are in the ghetto.

People don't come to Phoenix to arrive. They come to escape. So people bring their ways of life with them and there isn't really much culture to assimilate into.