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I guess they'll be raining down those jobs anytime now, so that us peons can pay for houses again.
Amen to that folk! Instead of people spewing the Reaganomic talking point that if you give "the wealthy" or "corporations" tax breaks and stimuli they will create jobs, how about making those receiving tax breaks or stimulus dollars SIGN A BINDING LEGAL DOCUMENT stating they will create X amount of jobs?
Of course a bank is going to say they don't have any money left to "trickle down" and create jobs. They are a bank! Is there any other corporate entity looking to maximize profits more than a bank? Did we all forget why the federal government had to pass "Fair Lending" legislation? In terms of people borrowing beyond their means, when someone was seeking a mortgage for a house for 500% more than it would appraise for or that it was worth in the first place, all the bank had to say was "no".
However, if a bank can get a buyer to hang onto to a house with a mortgage inflated 500% more than its worth with a high interest rate for five years then that's better than a 30-year fixed rate mortgage. They are getting the same money with the interest being paid up front and they get to keep the house in the end when the buyer defaults! Except whoops...too many people defaulted now the banks have more inventory then they could ever hope to move, lest they forgot they were banks and not used car salesmen.
The idea that the house you're living in should always appreciate is a rather toxic one. It leads to a modern aristocracy of homeowners who could never afford the houses they live in were it not for previous appreciation, and this hampers upward mobility significantly. This is nowhere more pronounced than California in the US; British Columbia in Canada. Over the long run, economic activity will tend to relocate itself away from these places. This drastic appreciation is normally caused by strict land use and zoning laws, and the brunt of it falls disproportionately on the poor (which is why, to the extent that an exodus from California exists, it has been mainly poorer people and minorities who have been leaving).
Fortunately Atlanta is one of the cities where it doesn't take a small dowry to afford a home: a decent job can still buy a decent home. The question of our construction industry is related, but construction is not dependent upon artificially high prices. When all the unsold houses fill up, more construction will have to commence, and house prices will adjust to construction costs plus land costs. Don't expect to sell your house for more than that in this market, which is generally pro-business and lightly regulated.
Amen to that folk! Instead of people spewing the Reaganomic talking point that if you give "the wealthy" or "corporations" tax breaks and stimuli they will create jobs, how about making those receiving tax breaks or stimulus dollars SIGN A BINDING LEGAL DOCUMENT stating they will create X amount of jobs?
We are (still) a market driven economy. Companies don't exist to create jobs but we need them to have jobs. The government should be taking actions to create a more favorable economic environment. Really, I don't think we should even tax companies, just individuals. Taxing companies just places hidden taxes in any service or product they make.
Quote:
Of course a bank is going to say they don't have any money left to "trickle down" and create jobs. They are a bank! Is there any other corporate entity looking to maximize profits more than a bank? Did we all forget why the federal government had to pass "Fair Lending" legislation? In terms of people borrowing beyond their means, when someone was seeking a mortgage for a house for 500% more than it would appraise for or that it was worth in the first place, all the bank had to say was "no".
In some cases, the government was twisting the banks' arm be more liberal in lending to promote more homeownership. Things get more complicated what with bundled mortgage securities,etc. The result was similar to the 1929 market crash in that the real estate market got way overvalued. In both cases, the "correction" led a huge amount of perceived wealth vanishing. The banks should have said "no" and the government should have butt-out.
Last edited by MathmanMathman; 06-06-2011 at 12:24 PM..
I've said it before and I'll say it again: barring some populist revolution at the ballot box or on the streets, we the American people should forget those golden days of working for a company for 30 years and retiring in relative comfort with a gold pocket-watch as a reward for a job well done. We should forget those days when graduating from college meant getting some automatic employment at a livable salary that could afford us a 1-2 story house sitting on 1-acre with a white-picket fence. Think-tanks, corporate personhood, NAFTA, and the "southern strategy" effectively null & voided all of that.
I am through chasing education in search of that ever elusive "good" job. It's utter bullcrap, especially if globalism demands that I compete with Mr. Pradesh from Mumbai, India where there is no unionism, no OSHA, and no Department Labor to enforce workplace rights. I don't know what my true calling's gonna be, but I know it will not be in service to those who exalt money & inanimate objects above people.
To anyone that comes up to me with talk about pure unregulated freemarkets being the greatest miracle since sliced bread: Go bark up some other tree; that dog ain't huntin' here anymore.
Even Adam Smith, one of the fathers of the modern free market, recognized the inherent unfairness in labor's inability to enter into collective bargaining versus management's ability to suppress wages through laws and an obedient enabling press. It figures that we Americans are still contending with the same problems that were being fought over in the 17th & 18th centuries.
So let's have big face-palm to those who lambaste unions, shall we?
Sweet!
Last edited by AcidSnake; 06-06-2011 at 12:39 PM..
I am through chasing education in search of that ever elusive "good" job. It's utter bullcrap, especially if globalism demands that I compete with Mr. Pradesh from Bombay, India where there is no unionism,no OSHA, and no Department Labor to enforce workplace rights.
I don't know what my true calling's gonna be, but I know it will not be in service of those who put money & inanimate objects above people.
HVAC repair is a better career choice than 90% of what a college degree will get you.
you must clearly be calculating that on a bankers bonus and divident additions...... get real bro.
No not really. That is seriously the way people used to budget their personal finances. Back then it was absurd that anyone would use 40% of their monthly take home pay on a house, but now it is considered normal. Why? Because everyone else is doing it and it drives up housing costs such that normal working people can't afford a decent home.
This is why I see the correction of the housing market as a good thing for the long term outlook of the country. If someone out there is waiting for it to come back, sorry, it isn't coming back, not like it was. And it really shouldn't since it was all fake. Home prices are resetting to 1990's levels now. Why? Because there has been no real increase in salaries since then. The vast majority of "economic growth" of the 2000's was based on people cashing in their home equity credit line and spending money they didn't have. If overall salaries don't increase 3% per year then real estate cannot appreciate 3% per year because sooner or later no one can afford a house.
We are (still) a market driven economy. Companies don't exist to create jobs but we need them to have jobs. The government should be taking actions to create a more favorable economic environment. Really, I don't think we should even tax companies, just individuals. Taxing companies just places hidden taxes in any service or product they make.
In some cases, the government was twisting the banks' arm be more liberal in lending to promote more homeownership. Things get more complicated what with bundled mortgage securities,etc. The result was similar to the 1929 market crash in that the real estate market got way overvalued. With the "correction", a huge amount of perceived wealth vanished. The banks should have said "no" and the government should have butt-out.
You mentioned the Great Depression. So if you are implying what I think you are, Keynesian economics debunked the myth of a completely laissez-faire economy during the Great Depression. It was the fact that there was no governmental interference that caused the macroeconomic failures of the private sector to completely bring the U.S. asunder. Quite frankly I'm glad the U.S. government stepped in so my bank cannot make me refinance my mortgage every year which was exactly what was happening prior to the market crash. And the FDIC makes certain I still have money in my bank account (or at least it is backed) should the financial institution make pi$$-poor investment decisions. The banks should say "no" and that should be the end of it.
As far as no taxes, wouldn't it be nice! I don't think it is any accident that the U.S. government had to implement federal income tax as the Sixteenth Amendment was drafted and ratified during the construction of the Panama Canal. If the United States government is going to create an infrastructure to allow our corporations to be globally competitive and ship their goods at much cheaper costs while backing this international transhipment with the world's most powerful military coupled with the world's most extensive interstate highway system so companies can get goods rapidly to its consumers, well I think the corporations and those who profit the most from them should have to foot a lot of the bill. If American corporations don't like it and threaten to leave, let them. Foreign corporations will be willing to pay high tariffs to get a stranglehold on the market. I would be more afraid that American corporations leaving would dampen ingenuity and the innovative spirit that created America's great business magnates but the excessive cuts to higher education make me believe that it's not America's top priority to crank out scientists and engineers.
Yes the United States will surpass Japan to have the highest corporate tax rate in the world and of course it is a better stimulus to cut corporate tax rates to remain competitive. I certainly wouldn't argue that. However, America's high corporate tax rate "cohort" of Japan, France, Belgium, and Germany don't have a massive internal interstate highway infrastructure to maintain and more importantly don't rely on new home construction to bolster their economy which is what is hurting "boomtowns" like Atlanta, Las Vegas, Phoenix, and Orlando now. Then after our cohort, do the lower corporate tax rates of Australia, Mexico, Spain, New Zealand, Canada, and the United Kingdom make them qualitatively better for business than the United States?
Mexico and Canada basically are using the infrastructure that we are paying for not to mention we are the chief clients for their oil not to further mention the remittances generated primarily from laborers in our new home construction industry is the second largest revenue stream for Mexico (maybe it will be surpassed by the narcotics we buy). We essentially are the defense spending for Australia and New Zealand under the ANZUS treaty and the fact that we took up the role as the world's superpower from the UK and we persist to try and put out all the fires they started a century ago pretty much accounts for why the rest of the industrialized world can afford lower corporate taxes than the U.S.
Last edited by Steelers10; 06-06-2011 at 12:53 PM..
HVAC repair is a better career choice than 90% of what a college degree will get you.
I agree. Get something that CANNOT be outsourced. And with global warming, HVAC is looking pretty good right now. Even the "professions" are being outsourced. Quality legal services are being done for cheap in India.
I don't discourage education, but it has honestly become a racket in itself. College tuition has sky rocketed while job security has plummeted. Kids have been sold on the traditional college education from the day they are born and a culture that turns its nose up at technical training has resulted. Now we have burger flippers with Masters Degrees.
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, lest they forgot they were banks and not used car salesmen.
Even the "professions" are being outsourced. Quality legal services are being done for cheap in India.
