Will Atlanta Ever Be Northern? (beach, farm, yard)

[bryantm3]

florida is two places. if you grew up along the I-4 and I-95 corridors, you're probably not "southern" at all, culturally speaking. however, the panhandle of florida and the northern half of the peninsula are some of the most southern (and conservative!) areas of the country. the life experience between people who grew up in the first place and people who grew up in the second is so different, it's difficult to claim that florida is uniformly "southern" or "northern".

[JMatl]

Originally Posted by bryantm3

florida is two places. if you grew up along the I-4 and I-95 corridors, you're probably not "southern" at all, culturally speaking. however, the panhandle of florida and the northern half of the peninsula are some of the most southern (and conservative!) areas of the country. the life experience between people who grew up in the first place and people who grew up in the second is so different, it's difficult to claim that florida is uniformly "southern" or "northern".

Exactly, it's a huge blend. Some areas south of the I-4 corridor are not very Southern, but not all by any stretch of the imagination.

There are many people in South Florida that have no clue why Tallahassee is even the Capital. It's pretty sad to me that so many there have hatred towards parts of their own State, including neighboring 'Jawja' as Bobdreamz refers to us.

South Florida is very different. But it is IN and is a PART OF the South. Always has been, always will be. No matter how many people Flagler imported from the NE and the Bahamas.

I feel compelled to bring the grits thing up again...

[bryantm3]

Originally Posted by JMatl

Exactly, it's a huge blend. Some areas south of the I-4 corridor are not very Southern, but not all by any stretch of the imagination.

There are many people in South Florida that have no clue why Tallahassee is even the Capital. It's pretty sad to me that so many there have hatred towards parts of their own State, including neighboring 'Jawja' as Bobdreamz refers to us.

South Florida is very different. But it is IN and is a PART OF the South. Always has been, always will be. No matter how many people Flagler imported from the NE and the Bahamas.

I feel compelled to bring the grits thing up again...

i'm not agreeing with either of you... i think most south floridians would not consider themselves southerners, not out of shame or feeling of superiority, but that the culture there is really a great deal different.

i don't think you can call it the south; before the 1890s, virtually no one lived in south florida; it was a wilderness land inhabited by no one except pioneers and native americans, and belonged to spain for many years. when the first people started moving to south florida, it wasn't southerners, it was northerners. there weren't any civil war battles waged there, there is no southern history there; if we're talking about culture, it's most definitely not the south.

however, there are parts of florida that are most definitely the south; these are towns especially in the panhandle and northern peninsula of florida that date back to before the civil war; this was the florida that chose to secede and had much in common with the rest of the south at that time.

[JMatl]

Originally Posted by bryantm3

however, there are parts of florida that are most definitely the south; these are towns especially in the panhandle and northern peninsula of florida that date back to before the civil war; this was the florida that chose to secede and had much in common with the rest of the south at that time.

There are areas that perfectly fit this description less than an hour from urban coastal South Florida.

Way more than a few there are in total denial.

[oobanks]

Originally Posted by JMatl

You are in total denial because you are terrified to be associated with anything considered 'Southern,' and have been forever. It's all around you, whether you wish to deal with it or not.

I have news for you, Bob. You can have grits with breakfast from Key West to Pensacola. You have a totally delusional, warped and EXTREMELY biased view of what the South even is - but you do live in it.

Yep,,, Totally Agreeded..And why are we even still waisting our time on this Subject and Tread. Florida and Georgia are both Southern States in the Southern Region of the US, Point blank, Period... The South is a region of Different States, Different Cultures and Different ways of doing things, just like every other region of the US. Besides that even within the South, Each State is Unique within its self, thats what makes our Country So GREAT. Our states are just like our People, "Diverse". SMH... Does anyone else think its time for this Thread to get a Lock and Key.

[Staysean23]

I know and it's sad some seem to think Florida is some foreign state.. I mean I know plenty of Latinos that are very southern

[Spade]

I'm just going to say that most black people in South Florida, whether they are American or from the Caribbean, would say they are Southern. My family grew up in Carol City on the Dade-Broward County line and they look at themselves as Southerners.

[Spade]

Originally Posted by Bobdreamz

That is true but black culture of the South is different from white Southern culture. Besides the vast majority of blacks in south Florida where Bahamian workers on Flagler's railroad.

JoeTarheel Sorry but the first time I ever heard of Grits was on that TV show Alice when the other waitress said "Kiss my Grits" and it isn't ignorance either just exposure.You seem to think that every Floridian should know what "sweet tea is & grits are".

LOL fish and grits is very popular in South Florida. Just because you never heard of it doesn't mean it wasn't there.

[Bobdreamz]

Originally Posted by bryantm3

i'm not agreeing with either of you... i think most south floridians would not consider themselves southerners, not out of shame or feeling of superiority, but that the culture there is really a great deal different.

i don't think you can call it the south; before the 1890s, virtually no one lived in south florida; it was a wilderness land inhabited by no one except pioneers and native americans, and belonged to spain for many years. when the first people started moving to south florida, it wasn't southerners, it was northerners. there weren't any civil war battles waged there, there is no southern history there; if we're talking about culture, it's most definitely not the south.

however, there are parts of florida that are most definitely the south; these are towns especially in the panhandle and northern peninsula of florida that date back to before the civil war; this was the florida that chose to secede and had much in common with the rest of the south at that time.

bryantm3 you have explained it perfectly! As I tried to explain it before most of south Florida was developed 30 years after the Civil War hence there are no monuments to the Civil war "heros" or connections to Southern culture at all. I don't know why some get all bent out of shape when we say we aren't Southerners.

[cwkimbro]

Originally Posted by Bobdreamz

bryantm3 you have explained it perfectly! As I tried to explain it before most of south Florida was developed 30 years after the Civil War hence there are no monuments to the Civil war "heros" or connections to Southern culture at all. I don't know why some get all bent out of shape when we say we aren't Southerners.

Here is the problem I have had with this thread from start to finish and they are continuing to show up in your opinions.

Its largely that people form the outside have a narrow definition of what the South or a Southerner is and then from people from fringe areas of the South are trying to simply say they aren't in the South to get away from stereotypes or possibly because they themselves are perpetuating the same false stereotypes and limited definitions of Southerners and the South themselves.

BajanYankee made this self-evident in a very short, abrupt way when he made this haphazard argument:

Originally Posted by BajanYankee

Democratic Fulton/Dekalb + Gays + Whole Foods + Trader Joe's + Emory + Educated Population + Transplants from NY, CA, OH + Hispanics + MARTA = Not Southern

Here is the main problem I have with your above opinion. I come from a long line of Atlantans. My family moved into the area when the metro has just 200,000 people. Admittedly, my family is very much Southern. I have alot of British and alot Scots-Irish in me with a tiny bit of Cherokee and French. This is a very common for a Native Georgian today and I am a rarity in the Atlanta area have been for generations.

Now the problem is the Atlanta region as a whole also applies to the same arguments being made for South Florida. Most of Atlanta as a region was developed after the civil war and very small prior to it. Hell, we basically had to start over from scratch afterwards! It was an important industrial area and railroad junction in the civil war, but Atlanta was a fairly new city at the time of the civil war. Ever sense Atlanta has mostly been settled by outsiders, even in the early days it was a primary destination of business men from the north following the war. All of these trends of people moving from the north here are far from new.

But Atlanta is decidedly Southern, these people moves here and assimilated to the culture, the character, the way we build things... our environment.

I also don't think the confederate monuments matter for defining the South. The civil war was primarily fought in key areas of the South and that is where most of the monuments are. What the South and its culture is, is something far beyond a simple connection to the confederacy or the civil war. That is simple and feeble minded at best.

The South is also very diverse, especially more so than some people from the outside (Bajan Yankee) give it credit for.

Now did many northerners move to Miami? Absolutely, but they didn't move there because it was like the north. Just as they did when they came Atlanta for business opportunities. They moved to a unique place in the South that has an array of different cultures from its location. Miami is also the furthest from being 'northern.' It really gives the South a more Latin Flare, as does Texas in a different way.

Originally Posted by bryantm3

i don't think you can call it the south; before the 1890s, virtually no one lived in south florida; it was a wilderness land inhabited by no one except pioneers and native americans, and belonged to spain for many years. when the first people started moving to south florida, it wasn't southerners, it was northerners. there weren't any civil war battles waged there, there is no southern history there; if we're talking about culture, it's most definitely not the south.

You completely miss the point. The fact that Spain was colonized by Spain doesn't exempt from the South, it makes it decidedly Southern. That is a part of the demographic landscape of the South and it exist all the way up to North Florida. It is also a part of the history, which you claim doesn't exist there. You've actually mistakenly argued against your own argument.

This is also how and why the South has French built cities and a whole state's legal framework built based from Napoleonic code.

Also, what the whole region shares was during early part of history we weren't heavily settled. We maintained more of a frontier and a rural population longer. Florida is not immune from this. We weren't positioned, as neither as Florida, to take the surge of immigrants from West Europe. The northeast has a similar environment and was a much shorter and less expensive ship ride away.


Earlier in this thread people tried to apply a north-south label to different parts of the country. California is the West Coast, period. It isn't north or south. The Midwest is the Midwest. The Pacific Northwest arguably is a subset of the West Coast, but it brings its own own uniqueness and diversity to that part o of the country.