MARTA to make an $8 billion pitch to change the face of Atlanta (complaints, capita)

[primaltech]

Originally Posted by fourthwarden

Primal, I think you might be misunderstanding the sheer amount of trouble that would cause the state if they tried to rebrand and internally regovern MARTA. Atlanta, to me, is generally pretty skittish when it comes to the state messing with stuff around the city. We've been burned (heh, Sherman joke) before, and we've pushed back before.

The rest of the state might have the political clout, but Atlanta has a large chunk of the economic clout. I'm not sure the rest of the state is ready to deal with the drama and massive amount of push back that it would get by meddling with something as integrated into the city's identity as MARTA. For the most part, I don't think the rest of the state cares enough to really fight for it, outside of a few of the metro counties.

I'm not saying it won't be tried, but I'm not so certain it will be successful.

Well, if you're right, then the most that Atlanta/ITP will be able to really retain, is the MARTA name/colors/image.

If in-town is able to maintain control of MARTA, then that will likely be a different MARTA that operates as a part of a larger metro/regional transit system. A sub-agency rather than an agency.

Because, I'm just saying, I don't like it but the fact is that Cobb/North Fulton/Gwinnett need high-capacity rapid transit but they are not willing to give up control to MARTA, for various reasons. So because of the pressing needs of the region, they will probably somehow be able to get their way. Rather than just simply cave to MARTA as MARTA is organized and set up now.

[fourthwarden]

Originally Posted by fieldm

Everyone at least ITP knows what a great job Keith Parker is doing by turning MARTA around. Hopefully once the city of Atlanta pass the transportation bill in NOV that will make his "MARTA is failing" statement even more ludicrous.

I hope so to, but, did you see the pamphlets that were being handed out in Cherokee about Sen. Beach and how MARTA is going to invade the county? It's why Ashe wrote that op-ed in the Cherokee Tribune talking about how that's not at all, in any way, true.

There are plenty of loud people out there who do feel that MARTA is nothing but a bastion and system for criminals and those who can't get their lives together. They feel as if the city wants to expand it to... I don't know, rob them? They are ignorant, yes, but that doens't mean they don't have power in numbers, and don't have the politicians to make their ignorance policy.

[Gulch]

Originally Posted by primaltech

Well, if you're right, then the most that Atlanta/ITP will be able to really retain, is the MARTA name/colors/image.

If in-town is able to maintain control of MARTA, then that will likely be a different MARTA that operates as a part of a larger metro/regional transit system. A sub-agency rather than an agency.

Because, I'm just saying, I don't like it but the fact is that Cobb/North Fulton/Gwinnett need high-capacity rapid transit but they are not willing to give up control to MARTA, for various reasons. So because of the pressing needs of the region, they will probably somehow be able to get their way. Rather than just simply cave to MARTA as MARTA is organized and set up now.

If that happens, this region deserves to go down the toilet.

[demonta4]

Or instead of rebranding MARTA, Cobb and Gwinnett could better their own transit agencies instead of demanding MARTA to do something that doesn't benefit MARTA. Cobb and Gwinnett need MARTA, but MARTA doesn't need Cobb and Gwinnett.

[skbl17]

Originally Posted by cqholt

They could give GDOT and GRTA freedom to do use the gas-tax revenue to build and operate commuter rail

The state constitution forbids the use of gas tax revenue on anything but roads and bridges, so you'd need buy-in from voters across the state to approve a constitutional amendment to allow gas tax money to be used for non-road purposes.

- skbl17

[fourthwarden]

Originally Posted by skbl17

The state constitution forbids the use of gas tax revenue on anything but roads and bridges, so you'd need buy-in from voters across the state to approve a constitutional amendment to allow gas tax money to be used for non-road purposes.

- skbl17

Which could be done, but it's a long shot. If you sold it as an actual state plan to introduce Commuter Rail, and intra-state / inter-city rail. The real question would be if the shift in availability would raise the tax. Whether or not it should be raised while gas is at a low point, it would surely hurt any chance of getting it passed.

[fourthwarden]

Originally Posted by primaltech

Well, if you're right, then the most that Atlanta/ITP will be able to really retain, is the MARTA name/colors/image.

If in-town is able to maintain control of MARTA, then that will likely be a different MARTA that operates as a part of a larger metro/regional transit system. A sub-agency rather than an agency.

Because, I'm just saying, I don't like it but the fact is that Cobb/North Fulton/Gwinnett need high-capacity rapid transit but they are not willing to give up control to MARTA, for various reasons. So because of the pressing needs of the region, they will probably somehow be able to get their way. Rather than just simply cave to MARTA as MARTA is organized and set up now.

Or, you know, they could use the other already existing agency that has no limit on which metro counties it can run it. You know, that one that was supposed to do exactly what you're talking about. They should be going after expanding GRTA rather than trying to take on MARTA.

Cobb, north Fulton, and Gwinnett also need to get over themselves, but that's already been said too many times.

[primaltech]

Originally Posted by demonta4

Or instead of rebranding MARTA, Cobb and Gwinnett could better their own transit agencies instead of demanding MARTA to do something that doesn't benefit MARTA. Cobb and Gwinnett need MARTA, but MARTA doesn't need Cobb and Gwinnett.

Not to do what they do now, no. But MARTA would need Cobb, Gwinnett, North Fulton, and many billions of dollars to do anything with transit that would be regionally impactful or comprehensive in any way. Because that's where most people live. And Cumberland and Alpharetta are where a large chunk of people work.

So, what will probably happen is some kind of compromise situation, which is kinda what Cagle alludes to. MARTA will bring rail to those areas, but will be fundamentally changed internally in a few ways. And might possibly be re-named, or at least re-branded.

[demonta4]

Originally Posted by primaltech

Not to do what they do now, no. But MARTA would need Cobb, Gwinnett, North Fulton, and many billions of dollars to do anything with transit that would be regionally impactful or comprehensive in any way. Because that's where most people live. And Cumberland and Alpharetta are where a large chunk of people work.

So, what will probably happen is some kind of compromise situation, which is kinda what Cagle alludes to. MARTA will bring rail to those areas, but will be fundamentally changed internally in a few ways. And might possibly be re-named, or at least re-branded.

Well, the state better pay for it then. Fulton, Dekalb, and Clayton's tax money shouldn't go to rebranding MARTA just to look appealing to the north metro. But first, I want a survey done to confirm that the residents on the northern counties actually fear MARTA and that this rebranding is absolutely needed.

[Gulch]

Originally Posted by demonta4

Well, the state better pay for it then. Fulton, Dekalb, and Clayton's tax money shouldn't go to rebranding MARTA just to look appealing to the north metro. But first, I want a survey done to confirm that the residents on the northern counties actually fear MARTA and that this rebranding is absolutely needed.

Just more unnecessary and costly BS so that a minority of white conservatives MIGHT feel better.