Humboldt Park Invest or not? (Ransom: buy, new construction, gated)

[thebizkit]

I'm still trying to wrap my head around the train argument. If you live in east Hp you are a short bus ride or bike ride away from damen, western and California blue line stops. Unless you live right on Milwaukee in Logan square, you still have to travel a distance to get to the train, especially if you are on the western or southern fringes in Logan.

[Vlajos]

Originally Posted by jonnynonos

There is that fantastic map (Reader?) that has been posted on here a few times illustrating that very precisely. It is a really great look at the demographic data culled from the last 50 years or whatever.

It was a great way at the complexities of how the city is, if not evolving, constantly changing, and it was anything but simplistic.

Are you referring to this?

Straight Dope Chicago: Where everybody went

[Chi-town Native]

Originally Posted by thebizkit

I'm still trying to wrap my head around the train argument. If you live in east Hp you are a short bus ride or bike ride away from damen, western and California blue line stops. Unless you live right on Milwaukee in Logan square, you still have to travel a distance to get to the train, especially if you are on the western or southern fringes in Logan.

The train argument is because long-time city folk see anything more than a 10m trip to a train as something tantamount to state-sponsored terrorism.

People from areas with no public transportation don't have the same standards/aren't quite so high-maintenance.

Ultimately everybody sees the appeal of living very close to a reliable train line (where the bus falters is when the streets are icy, there's gridlock, etc), but not everybody needs public trans access regardless.

[jonnynonos]

Originally Posted by Vlajos

Are you referring to this?

Straight Dope Chicago: Where everybody went

That's it! Nice memory.

That project/article is a wealth of information.

[BRU67]

Originally Posted by chet everett

...that fully SEVENTY FIVE PERCENT of the touted jobs created since 2002 in the well paying fields that people can support themselves / their family went to those that live in already affluent areas / suburbs --

Daily Kos: Downtown Prosperity, Neighborhood Neglect: Chicago's Black and Latino Workers Left Behind

Of course by itself that leads to GREATER INCOME INEQUALITY but on top of this factor the very representatives that ought to be trying to help folks with modest skills maintain their ability to work are actively seek EVEN GREATER LENIENCY on immigration: US Reps. Jan Schakowsky, Luis Gutierrez arrested during immigration rally | abc7chicago.com

Well, I think both of us know full well why these particular representatives are behaving like that. More undeducated immigrants from third world countries means a stronger low income voter base that will ensure they stay in power. The more the merrier, and I'd expect nothing else from them. Unfortunately, "oh well, that's the way it is, I live in [insert affluent area here] so it doesn't impact me" seems to be the common stance at this point. I wonder what breaking point we'll have to reach before that changes.

[UrbanCheetah]

Originally Posted by thebizkit

I'm still trying to wrap my head around the train argument. If you live in east Hp you are a short bus ride or bike ride away from damen, western and California blue line stops. Unless you live right on Milwaukee in Logan square, you still have to travel a distance to get to the train, especially if you are on the western or southern fringes in Logan.

Part of it too is that most people prefer the train than bus. Why? The train is much quicker and get you where you need to get much faster. With the bus you can fall victim to horrendous traffic, snowstorms, road construction, stopping at every single stop, etc. I will never forget when I took the bus one time on North Ave from North Ave and Damen to North Avenue and Clybourn, and it took 30 minutes! You would never see that on the train.

My complaint about HP is that it's more pigeon holed in one area and really doesn't provide you many quick options to get where you need to go. Living on Belmont and Sacramento I am super close to three Blue Line Stops, the Brown, Red and Purple lines are only a 10 minute bus ride, the Metra is a 5 minute train ride (if that), the expressway takes like less than a minute to get to, Belmont runs practically 24/7, and all the amenities that I need are within walking distance. I have so many options and easy access I can get to places from where I live. In HP you just really don't at all in HP. You don't have very many options at all there!

Another thing is it makes commuting less of a hassle. If you have to take a bus to get to the blue line that is one extra step that you have to take and can make the commute prone to taking longer, if things like the above happened.

And what you say about Logan Square is not true about having to live on Milwaukee. If you live in Armitage and California that is less than a 10 minute walk to not 1 but 2 Blue line stops. If you live on Diversey and California that is also just a 10 minute walk. If you live on the Eastern fringes of Logan Square while it's not 10 minute walk, you have a lot train lines rather close by to get to by bus like the Blue, Brown and Red. In HP your only option is the Blue Line really.

[thebizkit]

Originally Posted by UrbanCheetah

Part of it too is that most people prefer the train than bus. Why? The train is much quicker and get you where you need to get much faster. With the bus you can fall victim to horrendous traffic, snowstorms, road construction, stopping at every single stop, etc. I will never forget when I took the bus one time on North Ave from North Ave and Damen to North Avenue and Clybourn, and it took 30 minutes! You would never see that on the train.

My complaint about HP is that it's more pigeon holed in one area and really doesn't provide you many quick options to get where you need to go. Living on Belmont and Sacramento I am super close to three Blue Line Stops, the Brown, Red and Purple lines are only a 10 minute bus ride, the Metra is a 5 minute train ride (if that), the expressway takes like less than a minute to get to, Belmont runs practically 24/7, and all the amenities that I need are within walking distance. I have so many options and easy access I can get to places from where I live. In HP you just really don't at all in HP. You don't have very many options at all there!

Another thing is it makes commuting less of a hassle. If you have to take a bus to get to the blue line that is one extra step that you have to take and can make the commute prone to taking longer, if things like the above happened.

And what you say about Logan Square is not true about having to live on Milwaukee. If you live in Armitage and California that is less than a 10 minute walk to not 1 but 2 Blue line stops. If you live on Diversey and California that is also just a 10 minute walk. If you live on the Eastern fringes of Logan Square while it's not 10 minute walk, you have a lot train lines rather close by to get to by bus like the Blue, Brown and Red. In HP your only option is the Blue Line really.

If you live on north and California it's the same thing lol, yet it's still Humboldt park. I agree that it's a hassle if you live in the western portion of HP, but if you are on the eastern part, the commute really isn't that bad. I couldn't care either way seeing as I drive and hate public transportation but even if I wanted to get downtown I just hop on the blue line.

I also don't get the pigeon hole thing but doesn't Logan proper only has access to blue line and Healy Metra? Humboldt has access to blue line and Western Metra. Again, I'm only making an argument for the eastern part of HP. Logan is closer to the expressway but that shouldn't matter to cta riders anyways, right?

[UrbanCheetah]

Originally Posted by thebizkit

If you live on north and California it's the same thing lol, yet it's still Humboldt park. I agree that it's a hassle if you live in the western portion of HP, but if you are on the eastern part, the commute really isn't that bad. I couldn't care either way seeing as I drive and hate public transportation but even if I wanted to get downtown I just hop on the blue line.

I also don't get the pigeon hole thing but doesn't Logan proper only has access to blue line and Healy Metra? Humboldt has access to blue line and Western Metra. Again, I'm only making an argument for the eastern part of HP. Logan is closer to the expressway but that shouldn't matter to cta riders anyways, right?

But you are also a farily close bus ride to the Brown, Red and Purple line.

A lot of CTA riders have cars too. Logan closer to the expressway? It actually runs through the neighborhood, so the expressway is in the neighborhood itself. I bring up HP's location because it's not close to a lot. Want to get to Lincoln Park? It's not close. Want to get to Lakeview? even farther. Lincoln Square? Even farther. Logan Square is much more central with easy access to the surrounding neighborhoods.

Logan Square gives you multiple options on how to get around, while in HP you are pigeon holed. For example for work in Avondale where I live I have the option of taking the Brown Line or Blue Line to work and it will take me the same amount of time. You don't have those options in HP.

[nikitakolata]

IMO, Humboldt Park isn't going to be fully gentrified for a long time to come. I bought there in 2008 and we had to take a loss of $150,000 to sell in 2013. That was on the east side, just south of North Ave and just west of Western. The area has come a long way but there is still a long way to go.

The complaints about the distance to the train have some validity. My walk to the train was about 15 minutes. It wasn't horrible and, luckily, it is very easy to park a car by the Western blue line station, but the walk got old after awhile. I took the Western bus every once in awhile but the linking of the bus and train was hit or miss and usually it just seemed easier to walk.

If I could go back in time to 2008 and buy a house anywhere it definitely wouldn't be in east Humboldt Park. If I were buying now I still wouldn't buy there if there were other locations that would work with my budget.

[jonnynonos]

^^ That's what happened to a few of my buddies.