Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
It might be anecdotal...but I know that my room mate is working remote so now he doesn't have to go downtown. He's itching to get out of the city after being here 12 years.
My closest friend is leaving after his lease expires in October.
I have a job offer in OKC that I am strongly considering leaving for.
We are all in our late 20's/early 30's.
Theres also racial tension on top of all of this stuff going on. I never thought about it before...but why would I buy a house in an area where people resent my presence? For the same price as a house in Pilsen, I can get a very nice house in the suburbs.
It might be anecdotal...but I know that my room mate is working remote so now he doesn't have to go downtown. He's itching to get out of the city after being here 12 years.
My closest friend is leaving after his lease expires in October.
I have a job offer in OKC that I am strongly considering leaving for.
We are all in our late 20's/early 30's.
Theres also racial tension on top of all of this stuff going on. I never thought about it before...but why would I buy a house in an area where people resent my presence? For the same price as a house in Pilsen, I can get a very nice house in the suburbs.
If you moved to a lower income area, it is unlikely the people who live there would resent your presence. In fact they would likely be happy to see you, particularly if they own property. Certain people would resent you being there but, as I said above, they would not be from the area and quite frankly they're full of s-it anyway.
I'm not making any comment on your politics, because I don't know them. However, I think we are going to see an interesting tension going forward. Many progressive young people, and Chicago certainly has its share, decry systemic racism. And that is said to include redlining, disinvestment, poor scoring schools, and police violence.
The way to cure these things, really the only way short of creating broad economic opportunity for unskilled workers outside of the drug trade (everyone hold your breath on the count of 3....), is for more affluent people to move into these areas and eliminate the effects of redlining, invest their money in businesses in the community, both their own and others which are there, and put their kids in the schools to help create demographic diversity to raise test scores and create a better learning environment. They can also document and deter all of the police violence that they think is happening there.
Until this happens, all this talk about black lives mattering and systemic racism from liberals is just a lot of lip service, IMO.
If you moved to a lower income area, it is unlikely the people who live there would resent your presence. In fact they would likely be happy to see you, particularly if they own property. Certain people would resent you being there but, as I said above, they would not be from the area and quite frankly they're full of s-it anyway.
I'm not making any comment on your politics, because I don't know them. However, I think we are going to see an interesting tension going forward. Many progressive young people, and Chicago certainly has its share, decry systemic racism. And that is said to include redlining, disinvestment, poor scoring schools, and police violence.
The way to cure these things, really the only way short of creating broad economic opportunity for unskilled workers outside of the drug trade (everyone hold your breath on the count of 3....), is for more affluent people to move into these areas and eliminate the effects of redlining, invest their money in businesses in the community, both their own and others which are there, and put their kids in the schools to help create demographic diversity to raise test scores and create a better learning environment. They can also document and deter all of the police violence that they think is happening there.
Until this happens, all this talk about black lives mattering and systemic racism is just a lot of lip service, IMO.
I agree 1000%
All in all I'm very centrist. I agree with your solutions. I have a lot of super liberal friends who get really squeamish in the hood. I'll take them to my friends houses in little village and you can tell they are uncomfortable in the street and it's kind of funny to see those contradictions in their beliefs play out in front of you in real time.
I digress.
My dream was always to buy a 2-4 unit building in a lower income area that I believed in. I grew up lower middle class, and now live on a starving artists income, but have educated myself about wealth building and investments. I've been saving my money for a down payment for years. Took a pretty nice hit this year with the corona putting me out of work. I've run through half my savings account that was set aside for a down payment on a property.
I know I sound like a big downer, but it's just getting harder to justify going through with my plan. I still believe in Real Estate investing, but I don't know how much I believe in urban living, high taxes, racial tension, and extremist politics. That, and the gangs aren't going away any time soon. It's starting to grind me down a bit.
I can take 50-100k for a downpayment/rehab budget and live in a gang infested neighborhood where I feel unwelcome at best, or take that same budget and get the hell up out of here. It's a cross roads i think alot of people are at.
All in all I'm very centrist. I agree with your solutions. I have a lot of super liberal friends who get really squeamish in the hood. I'll take them to my friends houses in little village and you can tell they are uncomfortable in the street and it's kind of funny to see those contradictions in their beliefs play out in front of you in real time.
I've been observing this for many years now, long before the current woke culture took root and really got shrill. But I think it's going to become increasingly uncomfortable for them to maintain these contradictions if things continue on their present course. They simply cannot reconcile their stated causes for the terrible conditions in improvised neighborhoods with their own behaviors, at least if they're intellectually honest. They're even starting to get called on it by their own leadership...
I've been observing this for many years now, long before the current woke culture took root and really got shrill. But I think it's going to become increasingly uncomfortable for them to maintain these contradictions if things continue on their present course. They simply cannot reconcile their stated causes for the terrible conditions in improvised neighborhoods with their own behaviors, at least if they're intellectually honest. They're even starting to get called on it by their own leadership...
What a great read. Spot on. Theres a chasm between what alot of these types of people purport to believe and what they actually practice. It's becoming very clear in our current atmosphere. It's something i've had my eye on as well ever since I graduated high school. I always spent a lot of time in bad neighborhoods when I was in high school and my early 20's. I used to joy ride through the ghetto after I got my drivers license on the weekends. It was always very interesting to me and I wanted to learn more about it and why it is that way and how it got that way. Especially my grandparents old neighborhood off of 79th and Ashland.
This reminds me of the time I went to Jamaica with a very liberal family member. We drove 2 hours from Montego Bay to Negril. It's a very poor 3rd world country outside the tourist areas. My family member was clearly upset and could barely bring herself to even look out the window to absorb the realities of the conditions people were living in there. It ruined her whole day. I was fascinated by it all.
Similarly, a few years ago, me and a liberal friend had to head from Lincoln Park out to the west suburbs for a wedding. Highway traffic was impossible, so we had to cruise down Madison from Western to the end of the city. This dude couldn't handle his surroundings whatsoever. He was making the most sensational and ignorant comments about what he was witnessing on our Friday evening drive through Garfield Park. I was taken back by his reaction given his politics and the type of dude he usually is.
Part of my leaning of wanting to get away from the city is more so to get away from those types of people. The hypocrites. I'm tired of the fake woke culture among people my age,(and people of all ages for that matter) while they simultaneously bury their heads in the sand as to why these conditions exist.
I know I'm on a giant tangent now, but I offer these stories because I am aware enough to realize that I am the type of person who drives gentrification. I am a pro capitalist artist/musician. People like me are the ones who buy the shabby 3 flats for artists to live. I can't speak for all of us, but this is the way I have been thinking lately. I never dreamed of leaving the city, but now I just don't care at all either way. I can take it or leave it. Maybe you aren't even a real Chicagoan until you are bitter and hate it! I'm getting there! haha!
What a great read. Spot on. Theres a chasm between what alot of these types of people purport to believe and what they actually practice. It's becoming very clear in our current atmosphere. It's something i've had my eye on as well ever since I graduated high school. I always spent a lot of time in bad neighborhoods when I was in high school and my early 20's. I used to joy ride through the ghetto after I got my drivers license on the weekends. It was always very interesting to me and I wanted to learn more about it and why it is that way and how it got that way. Especially my grandparents old neighborhood off of 79th and Ashland.
Nothing can replicate nails on a chalkboard, for me, more than this, or better yet, a family who you know moved to a majority white suburb so their kids wouldn't have to go to school with low income minority children suddenly becoming an overly emotional BLM supporter on Facebook or Twitter.
I mean, I'm not saying everyone should move to a place like Austin or West Garfield Park. If you believe that a lack of social fabric and lack of respect for others fostered by decades of victimization culture and bad policies which led to an exodus of good jobs with dignity is fundamentally causing the issues in those communities, then why would you want to move there? I certainly wouldn't fault you for not.
But if you believe the problems are caused by "systemic racism," that is, redlining, disinvestment, neglected schools, and police violence, I just don't see why you wouldn't move there, unless you either have no heart or courage, or you are a hypocrite.
Mid tier cities are burbs with amenities and a nice downtown like Naperville...or a standalone city of about 250-500k like a Madison, WI. Where housing is cheap but people can still get similar amenities like good schools, yoga studio, coffee shops, breweries, etc. Here's more proof the burbs are booming due to covid:
Mid tier cities are burbs with amenities and a nice downtown like Naperville...or a standalone city of about 250-500k like a Madison, WI. Where housing is cheap but people can still get similar amenities like good schools, yoga studio, coffee shops, breweries, etc. Here's more proof the burbs are booming due to covid:
One thing I've learned in life is never follow heard mentality during any kind of fad/panic/scare/trend when it comes to investing money. Take it or leave it, of course, but that's the motto I follow. Though I bet those larger homes have more room for toilet paper and hand sanitizer.
One thing I've learned in life is never follow heard mentality during any kind of fad/panic/scare/trend when it comes to investing money. Take it or leave it, of course, but that's the motto I follow. Though I bet those larger homes have more room for toilet paper and hand sanitizer.
It's one thing to be greedy when others are fearful and vice versa. It's another to ignore an obvious behavioral shift or trend. You and I both invest in real estate and I'll simply say it seems you are very high on Berwyn/Cicero almost to the extent of having tunnel vision while ignoring other Chicago areas where people are clearly shifting. That's fine if you're comfortable investing in Berwyn/Cicero...every investor has their niche...but your analysis of other areas has been off. The covid effect is real and will impact real estate for at least the next couple of years.
It's one thing to be greedy when others are fearful and vice versa. It's another to ignore an obvious behavioral shift or trend. You and I both invest in real estate and I'll simply say it seems you are very high on Berwyn/Cicero almost to the extent of having tunnel vision while ignoring other Chicago areas where people are clearly shifting. That's fine if you're comfortable investing in Berwyn/Cicero...every investor has their niche...but your analysis of other areas has been off. The covid effect is real and will impact real estate for at least the next couple of years.
When did I say I was high on Berwyn or Cicero? I have no investments there. The taxes are way too high to have decent cash flow on a multi-unit. Single-family home sure. But that's really not an investment more than it is a place to live.
Covid has been with us since middle of March (widely known I mean). That was just about four months ago. I mean if you think that's enough time to determine a clear tend, maybe you just feel you simply have more foresight than most people. I personally would wait longer and see how it plays out. Again, just my two cents.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
